News:

This discussion group is best enjoyed using Google Chrome, Firefox or Safari.


Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #50 on: July 04, 2014, 02:58:50 AM »
Yes, the greens are the high point of the design, but I also like how the course flows except for the tame ending from 16, though I like 18 a lot.  Something just doesn't sit right for me with #s 16 & 17, but I honestly can't say they aren't good holes.  For sure, I can't point to any less than good hole on the course.

I need to go back just to see #6 playing into a headwind  :D

Ciao 
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #51 on: July 04, 2014, 03:31:54 AM »
I remember liking the 16th in its previous par four format... And I seem to remember the 17th being a strong par three given its position in the round... although my memory of the detail is a little hazy.

Given that you described the 12th as one of the most prosaic holes on the course, It seems to me that the biggest loss from the old routing may be the old 12th which came at the culmination of a world class three hole stretch (following the current 7th & 8th)...

I really liked the Renaissance (2008 version)... A great course in great company...

Jim Nugent

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #52 on: July 04, 2014, 03:37:51 AM »

I really liked the Renaissance (2008 version)... A great course in great company...

So which do you think is better? 

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #53 on: July 04, 2014, 03:52:49 AM »

I really liked the Renaissance (2008 version)... A great course in great company...

So which do you think is better? 

I haven't seen the new one, Jim. I'm sure if the choice was made to use the ocean by developer and architect, then there is more than a 50% chance that new is better...

The old routing did have its weaknesses with the front nine tracking back and forth a little on more inland terrain... But I loved the feel and finishing on the course...

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #54 on: July 04, 2014, 03:58:41 AM »
Ally

I haven't paid much attention to what has changed at Reniassance, but I gather the back nine is radically different.  That said, the 12th may have been extended, but the green struck me as new?  I am sure someone can run thru the changes.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #55 on: July 04, 2014, 04:50:07 AM »
Ally

I haven't paid much attention to what has changed at Reniassance, but I gather the back nine is radically different.  That said, the 12th may have been extended, but the green struck me as new?  I am sure someone can run thru the changes.

Ciao

Sean, Here is Scott's photos and descriptions from another thread... In essence, the old 12th played from the left of the current 8th's green up to a skyline green (which I guess was higher and further on than today's 11th tees)... Then a par-3 played in to the corner before the Par-5 down the hill (current 13, old 14)

12th hole - par 4 - 462/399/355

The 12th climbs a steady slope to a skyline green, with a centreline bunker visable from the tee that sits 140 yards out from the green and is 300/237/193 from the tee. Again, a good example of why choosing the right tees at TRC is crucial to appreciating the course.

Over the hill are bunkers either side of the fairway that stretch from 94-52 yards short of the green on the left and 74-64 yards short on the right. Played into a strong wind, these bunkers are likely to be a factor on your second shot.

One of the things that stood out at TRC was that the bunkering seemed remarkably relevant regardless of the wind I imagined as I stood on the tee, without there simply being sand all over the place to allow for any eventuality. Perhaps that is a benefit it has as a modern layout: the bunkering and tees were designed from scratch for the technology of the current day.

The second shot is probably one of the most memorable on the course. Not much room for error, but the green is 40 yards long, so it's easier to hit than it seems, but obviously that length could lead to some very long putts!

The undulation on much of TRC is as good as I have seen on any links, as the pics of this hole thankfully managed to capture.

The drive:


In the fairway about 170 yards out:


Short right of the green:


Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #56 on: July 04, 2014, 05:57:30 AM »
Like Ally, I was a great fan of the old 12th, which came at the end of a run of seriously good holes.  It would be great to get back to see the changes but the new holes would have to be seriously good to compensate for the loss of the old 12th!
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +1/-1
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #57 on: July 04, 2014, 06:52:42 AM »
The current 12th starts from the old 12th fairway and runs to the old 13th green, combining the two holes into one.  We took out one bunker short and left of the 13th green, but otherwise it's the same green, played from a different angle (about 30 or 40 degrees more to the right now).

The old 12th was one of my favorite holes on the course, but only a few people would consider saving it more important than adding the new 9th and 10th and 11th.  Also, the old 12th came in tandem with the old par-3 13th which was one of the weakest holes on the old course, and the old 14th (now 13th) was improved by shifting the tees further left.

Mark Pearce

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #58 on: July 04, 2014, 07:56:29 AM »
The current 12th starts from the old 12th fairway and runs to the old 13th green, combining the two holes into one.  We took out one bunker short and left of the 13th green, but otherwise it's the same green, played from a different angle (about 30 or 40 degrees more to the right now).

The old 12th was one of my favorite holes on the course, but only a few people would consider saving it more important than adding the new 9th and 10th and 11th.  Also, the old 12th came in tandem with the old par-3 13th which was one of the weakest holes on the old course, and the old 14th (now 13th) was improved by shifting the tees further left.
Thanks, Tom. 
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #59 on: July 04, 2014, 08:14:43 AM »
It's funny, from my one time play of the old routing, I recall being right of the green and getting up and down on the old 12th. However from what I recall the green was more of a plateau than is suggested in those photo's, particularly on the right hand side or perhaps I'm falling into the fisherman trick of exaggerating the size of the fish.

Either way I remember it as a very nice hole but not necessarily a standout which is no knock given the company. I recall it sat more on the ridge, a bit to the left of the current fairway which therefore afforded it a better view of the water. I wonder if that has a bearing in folks recollection of the quality of the hole ?

Niall

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #60 on: July 04, 2014, 08:20:04 AM »
A few random thoughts.

Who is the course for?   Given the cost of entry I conclude it’s for wealthy , and therefore most probably older golfers only a few of whom will be low cappers. The rest will have spent too much time behind a desk! I wonder what the membership feel about the rough and will more want to join?  I’m guessing overseas visitors will be used to forecaddies and want to see their course as tough, but that’s an alien world to me.

Sean loved the various loops, but I doubt the members take much advantage of them. It’s a destination club and for some reason golfers never seem to play e.g. 22 holes.  Maybe I’m wrong…

NO one else has talked about the flow of the course. I expected to get used to it but after 3 ‘big’ holes you have 3 holes which test your finesse more.  Two more ‘big’ holes and then the new loop which, at the moment, feels different again.  It’s only from 12 that I felt the course really flowed.

The 15th is the only hole I had real doubts about. Perhaps it was the wind direction but I seemed to have similar hybrids to 9, 15 and 17.  I would have preferred a mid iron hole.  Not bad but just not as good as the others.

I mentioned this to a few people and only one agreed, but I did find the grass around the greens ‘grabby’. I had much trouble trying to run the ball from fairway to green. Perhaps time will solve this and perhaps it was just part of my problems with the putter.

Finally let me just say the above amounts to little more than nit picking. What an event and what a course. I had huge fun playing there and if you ever have a chance, grab it. I can recall every hole in detail and in particular loved, 2, 3 (very subtle green, loved the pin position on Tuesday), 4, 5, 6 (Scott was right), 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 13 (hit green in two!) 14, 16, 17 & 18.   Not bad at all!

Thanks to everyone at Renaissance Golf Design and at the Renaissance Golf Club. It was a gas.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2014, 08:38:31 AM by Tony_Muldoon »
Let's make GCA grate again!

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #61 on: July 05, 2014, 07:04:54 AM »
Interesting Spangles, I thought from 12 the course started to fizzle out a bit.  It would take a lot of will power on my part to continue to 16 rather than go back to 6.  I spose that is one drawback of many loops and a low membership count.  A guy like me would probably do 6-15 an awful lot. 

Ciao
« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 06:55:24 PM by Sean_A »
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #62 on: July 05, 2014, 07:20:12 AM »
If I was trying very hard to be hyper-critical I would make two criticisms;

1 - 16th - doesn't quite work for me. I seem to recall it as a better hole first time round when I think I'm right in saying that it was a par 4. Then you had the bunker left to contend with from the drive. After that, assuming you had an OK drive, you had a shot to the green that was reasonably receptive in the sense that it's at grade albeit with a pronounced slope. Now the hole has been lengthened and the bunker left really isn't in play except for long hitters in the right conditions. For most including me the next shot is going to be short of the green to a blind fairway which slopes off on both sides into hazards. In my book there is nothing wrong with a bit of blindness, its in my DNA, however it usually goes hand in hand with a bit of latitude that this hole doesn't give you.

2 - can someone please produce a users manual for the showers. I don't have to push that many buttons to re-programme my VCR.

Niall

Tom_Doak

  • Karma: +1/-1
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #63 on: July 05, 2014, 07:23:38 AM »
Niall:

Re: 16, again, when the wind is behind you instead of against you [which is the majority of the time], it is much more reachable in two and the blindness of the fairway 75-100 yards short of the green is not as much of a factor.  I liked it as a par-4, too, but it was a much easier hole downwind.

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #64 on: July 05, 2014, 07:51:56 AM »
Thanks Tom, now can you do something about the showers ?

Re - 16th - I'm of course guilty of looking at it from my own perspective. A shorter hitter would have had the same problems when it was a par 4 that I do as a par 5. The basic moan is that the long hitter flies by the trouble whereas the shorter hitter has to thread his/her way through it. Not quite risk reward as there is probably more of a premium on being accurate for the shorter hitter than for the guy going for the green.

As an aside, when David and I were playing Mike (of Riviera fame) and his partner Charlie, Charlie reached with a driver and an iron. Thankfully for David and I Charlie hit his first putt as hard as his iron.  ;D

Niall

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #65 on: July 06, 2014, 05:26:45 AM »
Niall

There are a few holes like that at RC, but why not?  One problem with the RCup is higher cappers playing with very good golfers from the same tees (not long for very good golfers).  Inevitably, the stronger players have a length advantage.  So long as it doesn't involve too much bobbing and weaving for the harried higher cappers, I don't mind. Every course needs a few holes which clearly advantage the stronger player; be that length or accuracy.

Ciao 
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Niall C

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #66 on: July 06, 2014, 08:45:09 AM »
Sean

I think you misunderstand my objection to the hole. In fact I wouldn't even call it an objection but why I don't think it works as well as it could is not because the big hitter has an advantage but rather the nature of that advantage is that the shorter hitter has a blind approach to an area where the ball spills off both sides into hazards. In the old days such holes would likely have evolved with some of the hazards taken out through players experience of the hole, in order to give some degree of latitude to compensate for the blind nature of the shot. As you allude, if shorter hitters played from a forward tee then this disadvantage might at least be partially alleviated however I'm not a fan of that approach and would rather see flexibility be built into the design of the hole rather than reducing the length.

Personally I think if you filled in the bunker right and gave the shorter hitter a relatively safe line of passage up the right you would still be keeping the longer hitters relative advantage as coming in from the right to a green that slopes away from you isn't going to be easy. As an aside it would also fit with the MacKenzie maxim of providing the weaker player a route to the hole.

Niall

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #67 on: July 07, 2014, 04:02:38 AM »
Niall

Perhaps you are right, but one can always lay-up short of the right bunker.  To some degree, the hole suffers because of the narrowed fairway, but even as it is, I didn't think the long approach was that tight for a par 5.  For instance, #13 has a much higher probability of a ball kicking either direction into never never land.  I guess I don't have a problem with 16.  Its not exceptional, but neither do I think it unreasonable.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Frank Pont

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #68 on: July 07, 2014, 05:49:18 AM »
Yes, the greens are the high point of the design, but I also like how the course flows except for the tame ending from 16, though I like 18 a lot.  Something just doesn't sit right for me with #s 16 & 17, but I honestly can't say they aren't good holes.  For sure, I can't point to any less than good hole on the course.

Ciao  

Sean,  funny enough I had the same feeling at the start of the course. Even though 1 and 2 are fine (and quite difficult) holes, I would rather skip them and start playing on a slightly shorter hole 3, a more classic easy par 5 start. Then just find 2 new par 3's to weave in the remaining 16 holes (between 7-8 and 13-14), and make holes 10 and 15 driveable par 4's and you have my perfect course.....
« Last Edit: July 07, 2014, 06:45:30 AM by Frank Pont »

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #69 on: July 07, 2014, 06:53:20 AM »
Yes, the greens are the high point of the design, but I also like how the course flows except for the tame ending from 16, though I like 18 a lot.  Something just doesn't sit right for me with #s 16 & 17, but I honestly can't say they aren't good holes.  For sure, I can't point to any less than good hole on the course.

Ciao  

Sean,  funny enough I had the same feeling at the start of the course. Even though 1 and 2 are fine (and quite difficult) holes, I would rather skip them and start playing on a slightly shorter hole 3, a more classic easy par 5 start. Then just find 2 new par 3's to weave in the remaining 16 holes (between 7-8 and 13-14), and make holes 10 and 15 driveable par 4's and you have my perfect course.....

Frank

I really like the opener except that it doesn't start near the house.  Perhaps it might be better if the parking lot were turned into a putting green and the cars parked out of sight somewhere (I am always keen to hide cars).  That said, with so many loops and a few starting points near the house, one can't have everything.  I said it before, but I can imagine myself playing a lot of 6-15 loops.   

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Tony_Muldoon

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB - A Heathland(?) Beauty
« Reply #70 on: July 12, 2014, 06:20:28 AM »

A few more photo's

















« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 12:29:15 PM by Tony_Muldoon »
Let's make GCA grate again!

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB: 2021-22 Winter Tour
« Reply #71 on: April 03, 2022, 06:46:49 AM »
I finally made it back to Renaissance as part of the 2021-22 Winter Tour. I must say the course is much more enjoyable on a fine winter day than in high summer if only due to the rough being a more reasonable penalty at this time of year. Trees have been removed, some for the good and others not so much. I guess the goal is to make Renaissance look more linksy. I did notice the start of the 7th was shifted quite a bit to the left and pinched in, presumably to throttle flat bellies. In any case, the hole does look very different today. Please see the significantly updated tour.

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58937.0.html

2021-22 Winter Tour Previous Stops

Royal Porthcawl
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,45933.0.html

Seaton Carew New
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,70404.msg1693517.html#msg1693517

Cleeve Hill
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,49796.0.html

Minch Old
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,48765.75.html

Notts
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,33988.0.html

Charnwood Forest
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,70866.0.html

Goswick
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,64104.0.html

Scheduled Tour Stops

Muirfield

Ciao
« Last Edit: May 03, 2022, 02:06:42 AM by Sean_A »
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

Jeff Schley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB: 2021-22 Winter Tour
« Reply #72 on: April 03, 2022, 09:45:25 AM »
Sean always added value to post to the group.  When is Muirfield scheduled? Also we are already in Spring! ;D
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB: 2021-22 Winter Tour
« Reply #73 on: April 03, 2022, 11:01:55 AM »
Sean always added value to post to the group.  When is Muirfield scheduled? Also we are already in Spring! ;D

Muirfield didn't feel much like spring... brrr.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Fraserburgh, Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend, Alnmouth & Cruden Bay St Olaf

archie_struthers

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: RENAISSANCE CLUB: 2021-22 Winter Tour
« Reply #74 on: April 05, 2022, 11:09:30 PM »
 8)




looks like fun


Tags:
Tags:

An Error Has Occurred!

Call to undefined function theme_linktree()
Back