[Mungo Park]

Niall,
A couple of mods to the latest list, including Craiglockhart Hydropathic, not Craighouse, and the other one in Vienna

Ben, Sven et al,
There seem to be only two question-marks at the moment, No 200 'Reidsville' and No 213 'Unnamed in Merdiien' - unless anyone has any others?

I shall ask send to Ben for posting, as I am still getting 'An error has occurred, The attachments upload directory is not writable. Your atachment or avatar cannot be saved'. I know this is basic incompetence, but does anyone have any idea what I am doing wrong - running Mac El Capitan OS.

Mungo

[Sean_A]

I took a quick look at your list

Antwerp is in Belgium

Parkstone is in England

Notts had serious revisions

Sunny Old had serious revisions

Western Gailes had some significant revisions

Formby
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,32146.0.html   

Silloth on Solway
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,48672.msg1097997.html#msg1097997

Temple
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,37725.msg777890.html#msg777890

Worplesdon
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,47211.msg1052900.html#msg1052900

Western Gailes
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61367.msg1460254.html#msg1460254

Montrose
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,56097.0.html

Portstewart
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,40300.msg847056.html#msg847056

Stoneham
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,30823.msg597466.html#msg597466

I assume you are not separating original designs from redesigns etc.  Below are some courses you may want to investigate

Cooden Beach
Tynemouth
Gog Magog
Aldbeburgh
Berkhampsted
Broadstone

Ciao

[Tony_Muldoon]

Mungo can you please confirm I got the following detail right? It was part of an anecdote.

Last Month a few of us spent a lovely hour with Archie Baird at his old Curiosity Museum in Gullane. He informed us that his wife was the daughter of Mungo Park Jr (your Grandfather), who had brought his sick elder brother Willie Jr., home from America. Archie said he had played many rounds with Mungo.

[Mungo Park]

Tony, No. . . . nearly right. Because of a poverty of imagination the Park clan often suffers from 'name slippage'. Archie's wife Sheila is indeed my first cousin. Her father was my uncle Mungo III. His father was our grandfather Mungo Jnr, winner of the first Argentine Open etc. and brother of WP Jnr.  and yes, Archie did play golf with both his father in law (my uncle), and his grandfather-in-law (my grandfather). I hope that hasn't further confused the matter!

Sean, no, I am trying to include all, and have not differentiated yet. I think I had Antwerp and Parkstone in the list, and the only one I didn't include was Cooden Beach - do you have any attribution / provenance for that? I have it as a Fowler course.

Mungo

[BCowan]

  I'm going to merge this list with OP list.  Mungo's I put in Red in OP.        (Mungo's updated list)
SCOTLAND

1 1 Baberton Golf Club in Edinburgh City
2 2 Barnton
3 3 Bathgate Golf Club in West Lothian
4 4 Biggar Golf Club in South Lanarkshire
5 5 Bo'ness
6 6 Bridge o' Weir
7 7 Bruntsfield Links Golfing Society, Granton
8 8 Burntisland Golf House Club in Fife
9 9 Carnoustie
10 10 Craigkickhart Hydropathic - Morningside, Edinburgh 1892
11 11 Crieff
12 12 Dalkeith and Newbattle
  13 13 Duddingston ?
14 14 Duddingston Golf Club Ltd in Edinburgh City
15 15 Forres
16 16 Western Gailes G C adjacent to Glasgow GC, Gailes., Ayrshire
17 17 Glasgow GC Gailes Golf Club in North Ayrshire
18 18 Glencorse
19 19 Gorleston
20 20 Goswick
21 21 Grantown on Spey
22 22 Gullane GC - No. 2 in East Lothian 1898
  23 23 Gullane GC No 3 East Lothian
24 24 Innellan
25 25 Innerleithen
26 26 Jedburgh
27 27 Kilspindie
28 28 Lauder Golf Club in Scottish Borders
29 29 Luffness New
30 30 Melrose
31 31 Monifeith
32 32 Montrose Golf Links - Medal Course in Angus
33 33 Murrayfield
34 34 Peterhead Golf Club - The New Course in Aberdeenshire
35 35 Peterhead Golf Club - The Old Course in Aberdeenshire
36 36 Selkirk
37 37 Shiskine
38 38 St Boswells
39 39 The West Lothian Golf Club
40 40 Torwoodlee
41 41 Turnhouse
42
43 ENGLAND

44 1 Acton
45 2 Aldeburgh
46 3 Alnmouth
47 4 Barry, Glamorganshire (now defunct)
48 5 Berkhamstead (James Braid according to their web site)
49 6 Berwick on Tweed
50 7 Bexhill on Sea - Sussex
51 8 Brighton and Hove
52 9 Broadstone GC - Dorset
53 10 Burhill
54 11 Cambrige University (Coldham) - distinct from Gog Magog, but WP was involved
55 12 Cannon's Park
56 13 Carholme Golf Club in (Lincolnshire, UK)
57 14 Chiselhurst, Kent
58 15 Coombe Hill
59 16 Edgware
60 17 Ellesborough Golf Club in Buckinghamshire
61 18 Formby
62 19 Frinton-on-Sea
63 20 Gog Magog Golf Club - Old Course in Cambridgeshire
64 21 Goswick
65 22 Gravesend (now Mid-Kent)
66 23 Hampton Court Palace Golf Club in Surrey
67 24 Hartlepool
68 25 Haywards Heath
69 26 Headingley
70 27 Hendon
71 28 Huntercombe Golf Club in Oxfordshire
72 29 Knebworth Golf Club in Hertfordshire
73 30 Matlock Bath 1903
74 31 Muswell Hill
75 32 Neasden
76 33 Newbiggin by Sea
77 34 North Middlesex
78 35 Northampton
79 36 Nottingham Golf Club - Hollinwell, Notts 1901
?? 80 37 Nottinhgham, Bulwell Forest
81 38 Parkstone - Southampton, Hants 1909
82 39 Richmond GC - Sudbrook Park, Surrey
83 40 Royal Wimbledon GC - Wimbledon, Surrey
84 41 Seaford
85 42 Sheerness
86 43 Shooters Hill
87 44 Silloth on Solway Golf Club in (Cumbria, UK)
88 45 South Herts
89 46 Southampton (distinct from Parkstone in WP list)
90 47 St Peter's, Mablethorpe GC - Mablethorpe, Lincs
91 48 Stanmore
92 49 Stoneham - Southampton, Hampshire 1908
93 50 Sundridge Park
94 51 Sunningdale 1900
95 52 Temple
96 53 Tooting Bec
97 54 Totteridge
98 55 Tynemouth 1914
99 56 Wembley
100 57 West Hill - Woking, Surrey
101 58 West Lancs, Blundellsands
102 59 West Middlesex
103 60 Worplesdon
104
105 WALES

106 1 Dinas Powis Golf Club in Vale of Glamorgan
107 2 Southerndown, Glamorgan
108 3 Barry, Glamorganshire (now defunct)
109
110 IRELAND

111 1 Killarney
112 2 Larne
113 3 Londonderry, Prehen
114 4 Port Stewart
115 5 Waterford
116 6 Tramore
117
118 FRANCE

119 1 Costebelle, Hyeres
120 2 Dinard
121 3 Evians les Bains
122 4 La Boulie, Versailles
123 5 Nieuport Bains, Lombardzide,Ostend
124 6 Rouen
125 7 Dieppe
126
127 MONTE CARLO

128 1 Monte Carlo Golf Club - Mont Agel
129
130 SWITZERLAND

131 1 Vaud, Switzerland
132
133 BELGIUM

134 1 Antwerp
135 2 Lombardzide - Ostende (destroyed WW1)
136
137 AUSTRIA

138 1 Prater, Vienna
139 2 Private course for Count Althann
140
141
142 USA

143 1 Agawam Hunt Club - East Providence, RI 1895
144 2 Ashbourne CC - Cheltenham PA 1923
145 3 Ashland CC aka Bellefonte CC - Ashland, KY 1922
146 4 Ashland GC - Ashland OH 1923
147 5 Atlantic City CC - Northfield, NJ 1921
148 6 Baltimore CC - Roland Park MD 1919
149 7 Battle Creek Country Club - Battle Creek, MI 1920 & 2nd 9 1922
150 8 Berkshire Country Club - Reading, PA 1918
151 9 Boonsboro CC (Lynchburg, VA) - Consultation 1924
152 10 Canoe Brook (Nort) - Milburn, NJ 1920
153 11 Castine Golf Club - Castine. ME 1921
154 12 Chartiers Country Club - Pittsburgh, PA 1919
155 13 Congress Lake CC - Hartville, OH 1924
156 14 Defiance C C - Defiance, OH
157 15 East Liverpool Country Club - East Liverpool. OH 1920
158 16 Elm Terrace GC - West Haven, CT
159 17 Flint Golf Club - Private in Flint MI 1917
160 18 Glen Ridge CC - NJ 1918
161 19 Grant Hugh Brown Pvte course - Goshen, Middletown, NY 1916
162 20 Greate Bay Golf Club aka Ocean City, aka Somers Point - Somers Point, N1J923
163 21 Green Valley CC - Roxboroough, PA 1919
164 22 Happy Valley CC - Asheville N C 1916
165 23 Highland Country Club - IN 1920
166 24 Hot Springs Country Club (Majestic) - Hot Springs AR 1920
167 25 Indiana Country Club - Indiana PA 1919
168 26 Newport GC - named John H. Cain GC from 1965 to 2008 - Newport, NH 1921
169 27 Knollwood CC (White Plains, NY) 1895
170 28 Lake View CC (aka Cascade Hills) - Grand Rapids, MI 1919
171 29 Madison Country Club - Madison,CT 1918 /19
172 30 Maidstone - East Hampton, Long Island, NY 1896 & 1923
173 31 Marion Country Club, The - Marion, OH 1921
174 32 Meadowbrook Country Club - (Grosse Pt,Detroit) Northville, MI 1916
175 33 Metacomet GC - East Providence RI 1919
176 34 Miami Beach GC (Bay Shore) (aka Alton Beach GC) - Miami Beach, FL 1920
177 35 Miami Beach GC (Flamingo) - Miami Beach, FL 1922
178 36 Mill Creek GC - Youngstown, OH 1922
179 37 Milton-Hoosic Club aka Hoosie Whisick - Canton, MA 1916
180 38 Minneapolis Golf Club - Minneapolis, MN 1916
181 39 Misquamicut GC (Watch Hill, RI) (Ross involved later) 1895
182 40 Moon Brook Country Club - Jamestown NY 1918
183 41 New Bedford - Private in North Dartmouth 1916
184 42 New Canaan - Private in New Canaan 1916
185 43 New Haven Country Club - Hamden, CT. 1920
186 44 Newport GC - Newport, RI 1895
187 45 North Jersey C C aka Paterson GC - Paterson, NJ 1916
188 46 Old York Road CC - Jenkintown, Jenkintown, PA (aka The Abington Club) 1920
189 47 Olympia Fields Country Club (No 1) - Olympia Fields, IL 1919
190 48 Olympia Fields Country Club (No 2) -Olympia Fields, IL 1919
191 49 Olympia Fields Country Club (No3) - Olympia Fields, IL 1919
192 50 Olympia Fields Country Club (No4) - Olympia Fields, IL 1922
193 51 Pawtucket Country Club - Pawtucket,RI 1924
194 52 Penn State Uni GC (White) - State College, PA 1921
195 53 Philmont Country Club (North) - Huntingdon Valley, PA 1923
196 54 Pine Lake Country Club (Automobile Club of Dteroit) - Pine Lake, MI 1917
197 55 Pittsburgh Field Club -Pittsburgh PA 1923
198 56 Princess Anne CC - Virginia Beach, VA 1919
199 57 Red Run Golf Club - Private in Royal Oak, Michigan 1917
?? 200 58 Reidsville ?? 1916
201 59 Rhinecliff - Astors private course - Rhinebeck, NY 1895
202 60 Rolling Road Golf Club - Catonsville, MD 1920
203 61 Schuykill CC - Pottsville, PA 1921
204 62 Shelburne Farms (Vanderbilt Webbs) - Shelburne, VT 1896
205 63 Shorehaven GC - East Norwalk, CT 1922
206 64 Shuttle Meadow Country Club - New Britain, CT 1916
207 65 St Albans GC - St Albans, NY 1916
208 66 St Andrews GC - Mount Hope 1896
209 67 St. Johnsbury Country Club - Saint Johnsbury, VT 1923
210 68 Sylvania Country Club - Sylvania, Toledo OH 1916
211 69 Toledo Country Club,The - Toledo, OH 1917
212 70 Tumble Brook Country Club (Red Nine) - Bloomfield, CT 1924
?? 213 71 Unnamed course in Meridian 1916
214 72 Willowdale CC - [now Westwood] (original 9 holes) (Buffalo, NY) 1920
215 73 Woodway Country Club - Darien, CT 1918
216 74 Youghiogheny Country Club - McKeesport, PA 1922
217
218
219 CANADA

220 1 Abitibi Power and Paper Co - Iroquois Falls, Ont
221 2 Beaconsfield GC, (Beaconsfield, QC) [past version]
222 3 Bowness, Calgary
223 4 Brightwood Golf and Country Club in (Dartmouth, NS)
224 5 Calgary Golf and Country Club in Calgary
225 6 Calgary, St Andrew's GC
226 7 Club de Golf Royal Quebec - (Royal course) M. Raddick may have been involved
227 8 Dorval Municipal course - (Dorval, QC) [9 holes, a few are his)
228 9 Islesmere
229 10 Kentville - Nova Scotia
230 11 Le Club Laval-Sur-Le-Lac - (Green Course) in (Laval, Quebec)
231 12 Mount Bruno Country Club, (St-Bruno, QC)
232 13 Ottawa Hunt and Motor Club - Gold - South/West in Ottawa 1920
233 14 Royal Montreal, (Dorval, QC (NLE)) [past versions]
234 15 Royal Quebec GC [Royal course] (Quebec)
235 16 Senneville - Que
236 17 Southwood Golf & Country Club (Winnipeg, Manitoba)
237 18 St Agathe de Monts, 'Laurentian'
238 19 Summerlea Golf & CC. (Lachine, QC) 27 holes (NLE)
239 20 Toronto Hunt - Ont.
240 21 Weston Golf and Country Club in (Weston, Ontario)
241 22 Whitlock Golf & Country Club,?(Hudson-Heights, QC) (A & Charles Murray and James Black 242 23 Winnipeg Golf Club (Winnipeg, Manitoba)
243 24 Winnipeg Hunt Club

[BCowan]

I took a quick look at your list

Antwerp is in Belgium

Parkstone is in England

Notts had serious revisions

Sunny Old had serious revisions

Western Gailes had some significant revisions

Formby
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,32146.0.html   

Silloth on Solway
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,48672.msg1097997.html#msg1097997

Temple
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,37725.msg777890.html#msg777890

Worplesdon
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,47211.msg1052900.html#msg1052900

Western Gailes
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61367.msg1460254.html#msg1460254

Montrose
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,56097.0.html

Portstewart
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,40300.msg847056.html#msg847056

Stoneham
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,30823.msg597466.html#msg597466

I assume you are not separating original designs from redesigns etc.  Below are some courses you may want to investigate

Cooden Beach
Tynemouth
Gog Magog
Aldbeburgh
Berkhampsted
Broadstone

Ciao

Sean,

   Thanks for the info and photo tour links.  I have WPJ doing two Notts courses, which one of the 2 are you referring to?  Gog Magog I believe is already on list.  I was going to separate original from re-designed but I'm not sure right now.  trying to make notations for the time being in regards to renos.  Thanks for Investigation list.

[Bret Lawrence]

Here are a few more Willie Park articles:
Toronto Hunt Club-Evening Star-December 20, 1918:




Woodway, Shuttle Meadow, Catonsville and Toledo-The Hartford Daily Courant-February 8, 1917:



La Turbie, Monte Carlo-The Hartford Daily Courant-May 14, 1912

[Mungo Park]

Bret,
Great articles - I think they are all on the list.
Catonsville is Rolling Road, and La Turbie is Monte Carlo GC at Mont Agel. Good to know more about them.

Sean, I am not sure that WP2 did anything at  Bulwell, the Nottingham course before Hollinwell. It was laid out in 1887, so he could have had a hand in it, particularly as John Doleman was a Musselburgh man too. The only reason that I included it on the list was because in WP's 1922 'flyer', 'Nottingham' is shown in the list with a full stop after it, then 'Hollinwell' separately underneath it, again with a full stop. This might have been WP stretching the portfolio a bit, but until we find out, I thought it we could leave it there.

Anyone have any more on a Bulwell / WP link?

Mungo

P S Mrs Forman's, Musselburgh is at risk - see separate thread. Letters of opposition would help before the 17th Feb.

[MCirba]

I'm not sure if this has been posted previously, but I was on the Metacomet website and it seems they attribute their first course at their present site that they moved to around 1918/1919 to their former professional Leonard Byles.

This seems inaccurate in a number of respects.   Byles had indeed been the club's professional prior to the move but a 1928 article about him indicated that he had been the pro at Hot Springs, VA for 11 years at that time, and that he had also spent "several seasons" at Sleepy Hollow after leaving Metacomet, so it's likely that Byles tenure at Metacomet ended around 1914 or so.

This article from the NY Times mentions instead that Willie Park, Jr. was responsible for the original layout at the present site of Metacomet, and in looking back on some old threads here that fact seems confirmed by others including the late Tom MacWood, who wrote;

"The club moved to its present location in 1917-18. Willie Park-Jr. designed a new course at that time but despite the fact it had several very good holes the club was never completely satisfied with the total layout.

Ross redesigned Park's golf course in 1925 and it opened in 1926. It included 12 completely new greens, and nearly 200 bunkers!

In any case this September 14, 1919 article in the NY Times seems to reinforce the fact, in the interest of historical completion and accuracy.

[BCowan]

...

[MCirba]

...

Ben,

I missed your response.   If appropriate, can you send me something offline?   Thanks.

[Sven Nilsen]

Mike:


That NYT article was posted earlier in the thread.  Park did indeed do the layout for Metacomet's new course, with Ross coming in later to rearrange his work (which was handled by W. H. Follett).


As for Byles, the Annual Guides of 1916 and 1917 note John Anderson as the professional.  So Byles tenure had ended at least by 1916, which was prior to the club's lease running out and their move to new property (with Agawam Hunt taking over the old lease and course).


Sven

[MCirba]

Sven,

Thanks, I suspected that might have been posted previously but thought the Byles info might be pertinent.

I'm fairly sure the following January 1921 article (seemingly written at the end of the 1920 season) hasn't been posted previously as I recently received it from a friend.   It provides some more meat to the story but raises a few questions, as well.   

Are the holes described in the article still existing?   I haven't played there yet but they seem close to today's, even down to numbering.   

[Bret Lawrence]

Mike,


Thanks for posting that article.  I played the course about seven years ago and the picture you provided of the seventh looks very similar to the setting today.  The 16th hole I believe was one of the greens Ross did not change.  The first hole has been rerouted.  Ross slightly altered Park's first green to create today's 10th.  I think the only entirely new hole Ross designed was 11.


I have never seen a Wille Park routing for this course, but if you look at the Donald Ross Online Exhibit through Tufts Archive you can read the individual plans for each hole.  Ross made several comments on using present tees, present greens, etc.  I would recommend checking out the Ross Plans from 1925 for a better picture of what was changed.  Enjoy the course!


Bret

[MCirba]

Thanks for the additional information, Bret.   I'll check out the individual hole comments on the Tufts Archives site, as you suggest.   

[BCowan]

Mike,

   Here is what I posted prior. 

Metacomet- RI  (Park Jr/Redesigned by Ross) A few Park Greens left-13th, 15th and 16th greens.

I don't recall who gave me this info, maybe Bret or Sven or someone else with knowledge,  It's in OP.  I just thought that DR left a few greens like he left the Nichols par 3 at Inverness, which is getting replicated on additional land on the course  ....

[Stephen Britton]

Does anyone know if there is any original Willie Park Jr left at Rolling Road in Catonsville, MD?

[MCirba]

Does anyone know if there is any original Willie Park Jr left at Rolling Road in Catonsville, MD?

Tons.

[Joe Bausch]

Does anyone know if there is any original Willie Park Jr left at Rolling Road in Catonsville, MD?

Tons.

Photos of Rolling Road from this past spring:

http://www.myphillygolf.com/uploads/bausch/RollingRoad/index.html

[Stephen Britton]

Does anyone know if there is any original Willie Park Jr left at Rolling Road in Catonsville, MD?

Tons.

Photos of Rolling Road from this past spring:

http://www.myphillygolf.com/uploads/bausch/RollingRoad/index.html

Any aerials from back in the day? Or the original plans?

[Joe Bausch]

Does anyone know if there is any original Willie Park Jr left at Rolling Road in Catonsville, MD?

Tons.

Photos of Rolling Road from this past spring:

http://www.myphillygolf.com/uploads/bausch/RollingRoad/index.html

Any aerials from back in the day? Or the original plans?

I currently don't have any original plans nor early aerials.  But I hope to revisit the course this fall and will inquire.

[Joe Bausch]

GCAer Josh Bills kindly provided me with three older aerials of Rolling Road.  I've incorporated them near the beginning of my updated Rolling Road photo album:

http://www.myphillygolf.com/uploads/bausch/RollingRoad/index.html

[Peter Flory]

What would be the best preserved example of Willie Park Jr bunkers in America (both shaping and placement)?  Most of what I have seen looks like it was significantly changed over the years- like OFCC north for example. 

[Ryan Taylor]

What would be the best preserved example of Willie Park Jr bunkers in America (both shaping and placement)?  Most of what I have seen looks like it was significantly changed over the years- like OFCC north for example.

Bump. I've spent time researching this very question and have come to the conclusion that Shuttle Meadow CC is one of the better examples. Bruce Hepner deserves alot of praise. As you may know, extensive aerial photos from the 1930's exist in CN because then Gov. Wilbur L. Cross recommended an aerial survey of the entire state. See CN 1934 Aerial Survey conducted by Fairchild Aerial Surveys, Inc. This makes for easy comparison on Historic Aerials and other sites. I'm just starting to analyze New Haven CC. (Also, New Haven CC recently found WPJ master plan as reported by Anthony Pioppi)

[Tim Martin]

What would be the best preserved example of Willie Park Jr bunkers in America (both shaping and placement)?  Most of what I have seen looks like it was significantly changed over the years- like OFCC north for example.

Bump. I've spent time researching this very question and have come to the conclusion that Shuttle Meadow CC is one of the better examples. Bruce Hepner deserves alot of praise. As you may know, extensive aerial photos from the 1930's exist in CN because then Gov. Wilbur L. Cross recommended an aerial survey of the entire state. See CN 1934 Aerial Survey conducted by Fairchild Aerial Surveys, Inc. This makes for easy comparison on Historic Aerials and other sites. I'm just starting to analyze New Haven CC. (Also, New Haven CC recently found WPJ master plan as reported by Anthony Pioppi)

Ryan-Shuttle Meadow being Park Jr.’s first eighteen hole U.S. design is incredibly well preserved thanks to a long time dedicated greens chairman. He along with the superintendent are constantly looking at an aerial from around opening day and comparing that to what is in the ground in an effort for it to remain as original as possible. It’s incredibly fun to play and for me stands at the head of the class when compared to the other Park Jr. courses in Connecticut.

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