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Clyde Johnson

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #75 on: July 12, 2019, 02:25:22 AM »
Great photos, thanks Duncan!

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #76 on: July 12, 2019, 02:32:58 AM »

One hole looks very different, the 10th. Was that green pushed back?




I'm not sure. My friend Nick Norton thinks so. Club historian Richard Atherton thinks not.


The angle of the old photo may be deceiving - it is taken from well to the left of the line of play and the far bank of the stream appears to be a gentle grassy slope, rather that the cliff edge we see today.


I will try to remember to get a pic from the same angle over the weekend so that a comparison can be made.


You are certainly right about the bunkering - it has been dumbed down considerably over the years and many greens have shrunk. Our new Course Manager - in conjunction with our archie members Jonathan Gaunt and the aforementioned Nick Norton - has plans to restore these as funds allow.


Our Centenary year approaches in 2025 and gives us a realistic target to get improvements made by.


Overall however, Tommy W is quite correct. The overall look, feel, and atmosphere of the course have altered very little in nearly 100 years. This is one of the advantages of a club never having the money to change anything!
« Last Edit: July 12, 2019, 02:36:07 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Thomas Dai

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #77 on: July 12, 2019, 03:44:26 AM »
Great old photos Duncan.
See PM.
atb

James Boon

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #78 on: July 12, 2019, 05:46:28 AM »
Thanks for these Duncan!


Most of the greens and surrounds look quite different which is to be expected with green sizes changing, bunker profiles changing and backgrounds changing (mainly with trees!!!) I spend a lot of time looking at old photos for work and also recently at my home course, and from my experience I'm not seeing anything that has changed on 10 but I could be wrong?


Has anyone any old aerial photos of the course? If you contact Historic England they might have something in their archive that isnt yet available online? Could be interesting if they do?


Cheers,


James
2022 Highlights: Hollinwell (Notts), Brora, Reay

"It celebrates the unadulterated pleasure of being in a dialogue with nature while knocking a ball round on foot." Richard Pennell

PPallotta

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #79 on: July 12, 2019, 09:54:54 AM »
I so enjoy this type of photo tour. Even through the mists of time and change and circumstances, you can still see & feel the essence of Dr Mac's inherent design approach and ethos -- so different (or so it seems to me, a casual observer) in its essentials from Tilly or Ross or Colt etc.

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #80 on: July 12, 2019, 04:55:47 PM »
I am super indebted to Thomas Dai, who this morning emailed me a set of superbly colourised versions of the 1920s photos I posted to this thread.


I was inspired this evening to drive up to Cavendish with my son and to recreate as far as possible the same shots. I've still got a bit of work to do on most of them but here are a few tasters...


Here is the 4th hole;

1929
04 by duncan cheslett, on Flickr
2019
04 by duncan cheslett, on Flickr


The 10th;

1929
10 by duncan cheslett, on Flickr
2019
10 by duncan cheslett, on Flickr


And the 18th;

1929
18a by duncan cheslett, on Flickr

2019
18a by duncan cheslett, on Flickr

Fantastic work Dai! Those B&W photos from over 90 years ago now look as though they were taken last week! I have no idea how you do this and my 18 year old son (who knows EVERYTHING) is seriously impressed!
« Last Edit: July 12, 2019, 05:35:57 PM by Duncan Cheslett »

Thomas Dai

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #81 on: July 12, 2019, 05:32:28 PM »
Terrific then-n-now comparisons Duncan. Well done and thanks for the kind words. A bit of colour does seem to bring out nuances that are otherwise missable. I look forward to seeing the others.
As to how I do it, tell your son that its covered by the Official Secrets Act, sub-section 007, paragraph 666 entitled Dads only! :)
See also Duncan's excellent detailed comparison thread - http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,67384.0.html
Atb

« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 06:19:06 AM by Thomas Dai »

Michael Whitaker

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #82 on: July 13, 2019, 09:27:15 AM »
Our Centenary year approaches in 2025 and gives us a realistic target to get improvements made by.
Buda 2025?
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #83 on: July 13, 2019, 01:04:16 PM »
Buda 2025?


Cavendish would make for an excellent BUDA and Buxton is a lovely town in which to spend a few days. I would be delighted to organise this in our Centenary year if there was sufficient support.


The other course in the town - Buxton and High Peak GC - is a delightfully old-fashioned quirky routing across Fairfield Common designed by Jack Morris of Hoylake renown in 1887. It has a number of exceptional holes (a couple of them completely mad) and very few mediocre ones. It would make an excellent stable-mate for Cavendish in a BUDA.


  https://www.bhpgc.co.uk/

Ben Stephens

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #84 on: July 14, 2019, 05:09:57 AM »
The older pic of 10th looks like its further left than where the green is. The line of the stream and the slope is different unless they flattened the green, moved it slightly further right and/or slightly moved the line of the stream over the years. 


I felt this green wasn't really a Mackenzie as it seems to be too flat and very un-Mackenzie green.

Sean_A

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #85 on: July 14, 2019, 05:26:06 AM »
Ben

It is very difficult to tell, but I do think Duncan is right.  The left bunker looks like it is in the same position.  The houses in the background seem different as there are now no chimneys to line up the green.  What has really changed is the grade from the water up to something close to green level.  Now its a sharp rise.  It looks like the creek was re-directed to curb the erosion of that bank. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the green retained its position, but lengthened to the rear and shortened up front.  There is an odd amount of land between the water and the green.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2022: Bamburgh Castle, Erewash, Gullane 2, St Pats, The Loop x2, Arcadia Bluffs South & Crystal Downs

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #86 on: July 14, 2019, 06:17:04 AM »
I am sure that the green is basically in the same position, but may have migrated slightly due to changes in mowing practice.


There is a large area short of the current green that could easily be mown to green length. This was probably the case in years gone by.


Rumours abound that the 10th green is one of those that was flattened by George Henriques in the 40s or 50s.


He was a leading amateur in his day, major force at Cavendish, and by all accounts unstoppable bully.

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #87 on: April 04, 2020, 10:25:14 AM »
Course improvements continue apace at Cavendish, even during the current lockdown. The greenstaff are apparently taking advantage of the lack of prying members' eyes to remove a lot of trees!


The 10th is a much acclaimed hole - requiring a 240 yard carry to gain the upper level of the fairway and to bring the green within range over a ravine faced with a cliff. The full strategy of the hole has always been obscured from the tee by tree growth all along the left hand side of the fairway.


No longer!  :D

10c by Duncan Cheslett, on Flickr
« Last Edit: April 04, 2020, 10:32:59 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Mark Pearce

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #88 on: April 04, 2020, 11:57:07 AM »
That's a huge improvement from my last visit, Duncan
In July 2022 I will be riding 3 stages of the Tour de France,  in the Alps, to raise money for the William Wates Memorial Trust which is dedicated to providing opportunities for under privileged young adults.  To support the Trust, please visit https://fundraising.wwmt.org/fundraisers/MarkPearce/rid

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #89 on: April 04, 2020, 12:00:20 PM »
That's a huge improvement from my last visit, Duncan


Isn't it?  The tiger line is now completely opened up and will tempt the flat bellies. I expect a lot of provisional balls to be played!


It won't affect my tried and tested strategy of 6-iron, 8-iron, wedge, putt  though!   ;)




Similar improvements are happening all over the course.


You'll have to get over when all this shit has finished!
« Last Edit: April 04, 2020, 12:09:51 PM by Duncan Cheslett »

Mark Pearce

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #90 on: April 04, 2020, 12:03:46 PM »
You'll have to get over when all this shit has finished!
Count on it.  Though it's down, not over, from up here!
In July 2022 I will be riding 3 stages of the Tour de France,  in the Alps, to raise money for the William Wates Memorial Trust which is dedicated to providing opportunities for under privileged young adults.  To support the Trust, please visit https://fundraising.wwmt.org/fundraisers/MarkPearce/rid

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #91 on: April 04, 2020, 12:06:31 PM »
You'll have to get over when all this shit has finished!
Count on it.  Though it's down, not over, from up here!


Are you not still based in Leeds?


Thomas Dai

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #92 on: April 04, 2020, 01:16:39 PM »
Course improvements continue apace at Cavendish, even during the current lockdown. The greenstaff are apparently taking advantage of the lack of prying members' eyes to remove a lot of trees!
r


Best keep quiet and let them get on with it if they're trying to take advantage of the current period to do things away from members prying eyes!
:)
atb

Adam Lawrence

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #93 on: April 04, 2020, 03:45:44 PM »
Id like a Cavendish visit once the Plague has passed too. Perhaps a GCA event?
Adam Lawrence

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Mark Pearce

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #94 on: April 04, 2020, 04:17:51 PM »
Id like a Cavendish visit once the Plague has passed too. Perhaps a GCA event?
Why not?  Relatively close, I'd imagine, to the centre of gravity of UK GCAers and somewhere I really need to get back to.  Without fearing for my life with Ben Stephens in the group behind!
In July 2022 I will be riding 3 stages of the Tour de France,  in the Alps, to raise money for the William Wates Memorial Trust which is dedicated to providing opportunities for under privileged young adults.  To support the Trust, please visit https://fundraising.wwmt.org/fundraisers/MarkPearce/rid

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #95 on: April 05, 2020, 02:08:52 AM »
Id like a Cavendish visit once the Plague has passed too. Perhaps a GCA event?
Why not?  Relatively close, I'd imagine, to the centre of gravity of UK GCAers and somewhere I really need to get back to.  Without fearing for my life with Ben Stephens in the group behind!


My introduction to Ben was while putting out on the 7th green at Cavendish with Lorne Smith and two others whose identities I can't remember. Was one you, Mark?


A ball thudded onto the green right in the middle of us. What the ....?!!!


We glared back to see a grinning Ben on the tee 300 yards away waving at us.


Having subsequently played with Ben on several occasions I now know that his target area is actually a relatively safe place to be. 


Still...  :o


« Last Edit: April 05, 2020, 02:18:28 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #96 on: April 05, 2020, 02:21:54 AM »
Id like a Cavendish visit once the Plague has passed too. Perhaps a GCA event?


Happy to organise a post plague Cavendish meet.  Maybe combined with Reddish Vale to make a 36 hole MacKenzie day?


The survival of both clubs permitting, of course!  :o
« Last Edit: April 05, 2020, 02:23:31 AM by Duncan Cheslett »

Mark Pearce

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #97 on: April 05, 2020, 04:31:08 AM »
Yes, Duncan, I was in that group.  I was also in a group at Liphook, on the short dogleg left par 4 when Ben drove through the green and, even more remarkably, on the 3rd green at Silloth when he nearly did the same thing.  Perhaps it's me, not him?
In July 2022 I will be riding 3 stages of the Tour de France,  in the Alps, to raise money for the William Wates Memorial Trust which is dedicated to providing opportunities for under privileged young adults.  To support the Trust, please visit https://fundraising.wwmt.org/fundraisers/MarkPearce/rid

Duncan Cheslett

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #98 on: April 05, 2020, 08:26:55 AM »
Perhaps it's me, not him?


If I could drive the ball 300 yards the last person I'd want to hit in the group ahead would be a lawyer!  ;)

Thomas Dai

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Re: CAVENDISH GC: A Dr Mac Delight - 2018-19 Winter Tour
« Reply #99 on: April 05, 2020, 10:43:24 AM »
If I could drive the ball 300 yards the last person I'd want to hit in the group ahead would be a lawyer!  ;)
:) :) :) :) and +1
And a GCA get-together at Cavendish one day sounds great.
Atb


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