[Rob Rigg]

Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?

Cheers

[Tony_Muldoon]

Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?

Cheers

How about top 7?

Addington
Berkshire (there's 2)
Sunningdale (ditto)
Swinley
Woking

and if only allowed 5, drop the Blue and the New.

[Sean_A]

Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?

Cheers

Thanks all for your kind comments!

Rob

If its top 5 favourites:

Addington
St Georges Hill
New Zealand
Woking
and if I can spread the London area out a bit -
Huntercombe


If its top 5 best:  

Addington
St Georges Hill
Woking
Swinley
Sunny New

Note, I could easily slot in Sunny Old, the Berkshires or Walton Heaths to either list if I saw them again.  These have been omitted based on old memories.

Bill

The heather isn't too bad.  It is generally easy to find a ball, but sometimes difficult to get it out.  Ideally, there should be a mix of holes with a bit of shortish rough between the fairway and heather and without the rough.  

Ciao

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Another of New Zealand's charms is that you are well insulated from the outside world, even though you do cross a road for three holes. A glance at the overhead reveals how dense the trees are (a real forest).

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Glancing at the aerial I was reminded of how close NZ is to West Byfleet which I remember fondly from the 1970s. Sadly, I've not been back.

[Sean_A]

Another of New Zealand's charms is that you are well insulated from the outside world, even though you do cross a road for three holes. A glance at the overhead reveals how dense the trees are (a real forest).

Mark

It is amazing how quiet the area is.  Woking is literally 2 miles south and the M25 can't be much further - the M3 isn't far either. 

How is Woking as a town?  Its well centred for playing the heathland courses, but are there decent eateries and pubs in the area?

Ciao

[RichMacafee]

Thanks for this thread Sean, really enjoyed the photos and descriptions.

Sometimes it is impossible to get a feel for how a golf course would play from photos, but you have managed to get that across really well.

The GCA looks fantastic, but it also looks like a genuinely fun golf course to play.

[Mark_Rowlinson]

Sean, I haven't been to Woking, apart from the three Ws golf courses, for years. I lived briefly at Ripley, near Woking, but that was in 1971! Sorry, I don't know anything about Woking gastronomy.

[Sean_A]

After a game today I am convinced that New Zealand is a course which unnecessarily flies under the London radar.  I have a great admiration for how well this design works.  Take a look at the updated Tour.

Ciao

[JNC Lyon]

This course looks phenomenal.  I may have to check it out during my stay in London.

[john_stiles]

Sean,

Is the NZ course on flatter terrain than found at Woking, Swinley, Berkshire ?

Bunkering with those eyebrows looks difficult.   

[Scott Warren]

John,

NZ is probably the flattest golf course I have played. There are perhaps 3-4 holes with more than 1m of elevation change. It really is VERY flat.

But the brilliant bunkering (especially those that seem small until you get to them [2, 11, 14], those set in the middle of the front of greens [8, 14] and those that create distance perception issues [2, 4, 7]), combined with how brilliantly the small amount of elevation change (8, 13, 14) and small swales in the land (6, 12, 18) are used are what causes it to soar.

It also has an extremely varied set of par threes.

As an example of how great design can overcome site limitations, NZ has to be a poster child.

I have played many higher rated courses in GB&I, but few that I start thinking about more often in idle moments.

[john_stiles]

Scott,

Bunkering looks superb.  Missed it on first go at London area, but NZ is at the top if (when) I return.  Thanks.

[Scott Henderson]

This looks great.  Will have to look into it when I next head in that direction.

[Sean_A]

It seems each time I visit New Zealand I grow more fond of it and notice things which escaped my eye previously.  The visual subtlety may be the course's single best trump card.  It makes me wonder what additional changes Simpson had up his sleeve that were never built.  Anyway, take a look at the updated tour.  There are a few new pix.

Ciao

[James Boon]

Sean,

Mant thanks for refreshing this photo tour. Scott's recent thread on heathland bunkering and this one have only highlighted both my desire to play NZ and how great the bunkers look!

The "Cat Woman Eyes" bunkers on 14 are interesting, and I'm not just talking about your naming of it    There is a lot of heather short of that bunker, somthing whech I haven't seen much of before? Does this mean the fairway used to be much wider here allowing for tee shots to run into the bunker? And if so, its interesting to see how vigerous the growth of heather here is to populate the former fairway?

Cheers,

James

[Tim Nugent]

What I find remarkable is how many different bunker styles are employed but they don't necessarily conflict with one another.  It's alomost as if the style is not to have a style.  Great pics and analysis.  I wouold like to see more courses ilike this being developed.  Courses like this that are inricate without being overly long, just seem more comfortable.

[Tom_Doak]

I really haven't thought about New Zealand GC in 20+ years. 

What's amazing to me is how many aspects are similar to Kingston Heath:

1.  Short loop coming back to clubhouse (five holes instead of six)
2.  Flatness
3.  Superb bunkering (Kingston Heath probably has 3x as many though)
4.  18th hole side-on approach to clubhouse (deja vu!)

The main difference, of course, is that Kingston Heath is about 700 yards longer so it gets much more respect from the low handicappers.

[Scott Warren]

Sean,

I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.

Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.

I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.

Back left of the 17th green?

[Noel Freeman]

Sean,

I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.

Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.

I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.

Back left of the 17th green?

Scott, that bunker on 17 is awesome.. I have to disagree with you.. Russell Talley snapped this shot of me looking dour not because of the architecture but because I was soon to fly out of Heathrow (as you can see by my attire) shortly there after and could not play NZ that day.. I would not touch the artistry of that bunker..

[Scott Warren]

Log-in required to see that pic, Noel.

[Noel Freeman]

its up now

[Sean_A]

Sean,

I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.

Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.

I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.

Back left of the 17th green?

Scott

I wouldn't touch a thing with the green or the surrounds of #17.  It is one of the most brilliantly subtle green complexes I know of. 

There are only four bunkers I can think of that I would do away with:

#2 right side of green
#8 rear of green (maybe two back there?)
#11 rear of green x2

All are very slap dash in construction and should be filled in just because they are a blight.  That said, #11's defeat the purpose of the green sloping to the rear.  The placement of #2's is fine, but if they are not gonna take the time to make it blend the bunker is that critical to compromise the look of the bunker short of the green.   

Ciao

[Noel Freeman]

For you Sean "I hate Deal" Arble.. notice that is my YA Tittle pose (especially if you saw what happened to Eli Manning last night!)

[Sean_A]

For you Sean "I hate Deal" Arble.. notice that is my YA Tittle pose (especially if you saw what happened to Eli Manning last night!)

Tuco aka Yelberton

Deal is for girlie boys.

Ciao

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