Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Sean_A on September 14, 2008, 07:19:15 PM
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Despite the many elements which combine to make the course better than its sum parts, it is the bunkering which is New Zealand’s standout feature. It has long been my belief that Walton Heath’s bunkers are the best in the heathlands. According to Patric Dickinson “They are curiously, aggressively, artificial looking.” While not nearly as austere as Walton’s Heath’s pits, one could say that New Zealand’s are alarmingly charming, but just as effective and thus the equal of Fowler’s maiden design. Because both courses are fairly flat the bunkers take on a more prominent strategic role and may explain why the architects seemed to take great care in creating thoughtful hazards which in the best of traditions guard rather than frame greens. There is a fair amount of wonderful architecture that is more often than not dismissed as “flat” and therefore uninteresting. This sort of attitude will lead golfers to miss out on one of the true gems of London.
Much of New Zealand is the product of Mure Fergusson’s 1895 design which was unique for its day in that it was carved out of a forest. Fergusson continued to make refinements over the following 30 years as secretary of the club. Not long after his death Tom Simpson was called in to make significant changes. Being a former partner of Herbert Fowler and a member of Woking gave Simpson first hand knowledge of good design principles. Among the alterations were the addition of the great green complexes for #s 17 & 18, the short 3rd hole and a grand bunkering scheme for the entire course. Consequently its fair to state that New Zealand is the product of both these gentlemen.
The 1st, a tough opener that uses the angles well in shaping the strategy of the hole. Right from the get go the golfer can see the relationship between the turn of the fairway and the placement of the bunker just shy of the green. This is a theme throughout the round.
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Although New Zealand is relatively short on yardage, it starts out in stout fashion. The second is another two-shotter which is often into the prevailing wind. The drive progressively narrows for the player looking to hit a long ball. The centre-line bunker completely dictates the strategy of the hole. The bunker is deceptively large, but there is room for the golfer to bounce shots onto the green should conditions call for it. This sort of design is Simpson at his best and a re-occurring theme. The bunker guarding the right side of the green exemplifies the difference in quality and placement between the two bunkers. Fortunately, New Zealand doesn't have too many of this slap dash sort.
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The short 3rd is trickier than looks suggest, but we move to the excellent 4th, this hole probably has the most elevation change of any hole on the course. The slope of the fairway leading toward the bunker is visually intimidating, but only the longest hitters can reach the sand from the tee.
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Another great bunker! Notice how the flag is only half visible. The green runs away from the player, but there is all the room in the world to bounce one in. That doesn't however, make judging this approach any easier.
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The second one-shotter in five holes, the 5th takes us back to the house. I like the idea of a short loop and a long loop rather than equal halves. The club is a great example of understated elegance; very old fashioned without being stuffy.
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The 6th is one of the half dozen or so par 4s that can play very long especially into the prevailing wind. The hole used to feature one of the several camouflaged bunkers to be found at New Zealand in the right heather. The bunker is now more visible from the tee, but still menacing.
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The area short of the green is scooped out and shoves shots intended to bounce in to the right...which means we must challenge the right fairway bunker off the tee to have options for the approach.
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A great par 3 among a fine set of short holes, the 7th is a good example of what can be achieved on flat land. The left and right bunkers create all the interest necessary. The right bunker has the added appeal of acting as a greenside bunker for #13. There must be 30 yards or a shade more from the left bunker to the flag. The flag to the right is #13.
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The right greenside bunker with #13 in the background.
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The following four holes are all solid, but the high points are the bunkers. The blind 8th is the one hole in this bunch which doesn't fill my ticket. The goal of the ninth hole is to carry the right side bunkers and thus gain the optimum angle of approach or one can scoot a ball past them.
The 10th is a rather awkward length hole of 120 yards to very good raised green. As on the 16th, the heather works particularly well as dead ground.
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Simpson was very creative in the angling of his bunkers. Many are on a diagonal line jutting across the line of play. This feature makes it difficult to ascertain just where the landing zone is for the aggressive play. Notice how far short this bunker is of the 11th green. There is plenty of room to challenge the bunker and stay right to take advantage of the right to left slope, but the bunker angle obscures the view.
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The three isolated holes on the far side of Martyr's Lane are not of the same cailbre as those across the road at Worplesdon. However, once we return to the main section of the property the stretch of holes leading back to the house are what make New Zealand better than the run of the mill good course. Features such as the slight drop on the front right of the green are generally not as obvious on the first 11 holes. Below is a side-look at the bunker/hollow complex to the right of the 12th green.
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Thirteen has a very clever pair of centre-line bunkers, one of which is hidden behind the other making the carry up the hill longer than it looks. As on the previous hole (but more pronounced), there is a wee swale protecting the front right of the green. This short par 4 is exceedingly well conceived.
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A hidden Cat Woman eyes bunker protects the right side of the fairway. Just over this bunker is fairway, perhaps this is an idea which could be used on other holes to increase the importance of tempting players to challenge the bunkers.
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In a bit of a twist (similar to Littlestone's 16th), it is better to be on the outside of the dogleg as this bunker guards the approach from the right. The green slopes to the back, which is the best place to miss as all the trouble is near the front of the green.
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The 15th sees the fairway bisected by bunkers on either side of the fairway. Little Lizzy isn't camera shy!
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Yet another centre-line bunker. Pay close attention...
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...it is another that is much larger than it looks from a distance. The orientation of this bunker is unusual as well. Notice the bold contouring with the wing on the back left of the green. Its well designed to make the guy avoiding the front right bunker have to risk a 3 putt, but still offer a bailout shot from the right.
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#16, the final par 3, is approximately a 180 yard carry over the heather. The photo accurately depicts the obscured view of the green one has from the tee. Once again, clever bunkers partially conceal the target and distract the golfer from the goal.
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A closer look.
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The renovated right hand bunker...
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...and a look at the severity of New Zealand's heather.
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A sharp legger left, the 17th is an awkward hole which works around an adjacent property. The landing zone for this forced layup is a bit tight and a few trees could stand to come out. In fact, other than the fairways being a bit tight given the harsh penalty of playing from heather, the only other concern I have is the number of trees and undergrowth. Many hundreds could come out without anyone noticing, but it must be noted that due care is necessary to maintain a proper sound block. New Zealand has a very secluded feel yet the M25 is only a few miles away.
A Simpson sketch of the 17th circa 1931.
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The photos don't accurately depict the unforeseen kick to the left many golfers experience at the green. An alley falling away from the green leads these astray approaches directly to the rear left bunker. This sort of design reminds the author of some links bunkers such as at Carnoustie. Many play much larger than their actual size because of their gathering nature. Below is a view of the green from well beyond the approach area.
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This view of the green complex shows off the movement of the land and the deceptively large right green-side bunker.
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The home hole doesn't disappoint. Like the twelfth, this is another tee shot free of sand. As an example of the tree problem, trees down the left block the view of Simpson's handiwork from the tee and a few could be removed without compromising the dog-leg strategy of the hole. In fact, a view of the flag could act as an enticement to play unwisely, a design strategy which I have long admired. Below is New Zealand's response to the Valley of Sin.
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The clubhouse has bags of charm and the course is demandingly honest, but some readers may be curious about the vital statistics; a par of 68 and a breath under 6000 yards. These numbers will strike many as a bit on the light side, however, don’t be deceived. The story of New Zealand is discovered in its playing and there are three All England candidates; #s 6, 7 & 16. There is a premium placed on hitting fairways and with six holes which can take some reaching this aspect of the game is greatly rewarded in keen conditions. Additionally, there are two long par 3s, consequently, New Zealand offers plenty of challenge with medium to long irons and wood play. This sort of configuration is a wonderful example of how to combat flat bellies yet offer respite for the less gifted players.
Despite not being blessed with a rolling property, New Zealand drains exceedingly well. The flatter landscape offers a pleasantly cunning game with its many small and large swales kicking poorly judged shots into awkward recovery situations. Bernard Darwin encapsules the qualities of the club and course like no other can; “New Zealand is sui generis. It does not compete with other courses, but it sets its own standard and lives up to it.” 2015
The famed lockers.
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Ciao
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This is some good stuff.
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Wonderful tour. Your commentary makes the pictures. It's one of the things that makes GCA special. The downside is that I have added another must-play to an already very long list.
Simpson might be more under appreciated than Colt in the US.
Thanks. Bob
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One thing for sure that I have learned from this website, having London Golf Club as my sole English course on my personal resume is something that needs to be fixed. All three of these courses today look great.
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Mike and Bob,
One year from now is the next Buda Cup, which will be played in Kent at Royal St George and Deal, with weekend golf in the London suburbs - New Zealand and possibly Huntercome - followed by a Monday match vs some Littlestone members.
It's not too soon to work on making this happen! ;D
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Bill,
Mike Whitaker has been hitting me up already for Buda 2009. However, there is a pretty good chance that I will be attending a Gilbert and Sullivan festival next July in Buxton, England. It is a loooooong story, but I should get a few rounds out of it.
http://www.gs-festival.co.uk/
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Mike, trust me, there is a lot more golf played and a lot more good beer and single malt consumed at a Buda Cup than a G&S fest. Time for you to examine your priorities! :o
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Thanks for a great tour Sean - sorry I could not join you. Next time! It is a long time since I have heard you eulogise about the bunkering on a course so this is high praise indeed! The short 16th looks quite similar to the second at Morfontaine, also a Simpson course.
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Very nice tour, Sean... thank you. Those closing holes look fun. The greens appear mild compared to other Simpson courses.
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Mike and Bob,
One year from now is the next Buda Cup, which will be played in Kent at Royal St George and Deal, with weekend golf in the London suburbs - New Zealand and possibly Huntercome - followed by a Monday match vs some Littlestone members.
It's not too soon to work on making this happen! ;D
Bill - Please count me in. I gotta see more Simpson. Bob
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Now that.. THAT is Golf
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Mike and Bob,
One year from now is the next Buda Cup, which will be played in Kent at Royal St George and Deal, with weekend golf in the London suburbs - New Zealand and possibly Huntercome - followed by a Monday match vs some Littlestone members.
It's not too soon to work on making this happen! ;D
Bill - Please count me in. I gotta see more Simpson. Bob
That'll be great. I'll find the Buda 2009 information thread and bump it so you can get the dates, etc.
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Great pictures - thanks for sharing them.
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Wonderful tour. Your commentary makes the pictures. It's one of the things that makes GCA special. The downside is that I have added another must-play to an already very long list.
Simpson might be more under appreciated than Colt in the US.
Thanks. Bob
Bob
Cheers. Very kind words indeed. To be fair, New Zealand is a very good mix of Muir Fergusson and Simpson. I get the feeling that Simpson either didn't want to crowd out the Fergusson work or he wasn't given the go ahead to do so. Darwin claimed that NZ was sui generis and that is as good a description as can be conjured for the course combined with the club really is unique.
I want to see more Simpson stuff because the little I have experienced is excellent.
J Morgan
The greens are generally flat which is perfectly in keeping with the topography.
Ciao
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Sean, you have a knack for taking pics of your courses...I think you need a nickname as proposed on the other thread. 8) Your course pics are so 'photographarble' !
I would think that this New Zealand course is a grad study in great drainage in bunker construction. I take it that it rains alot there. Every bunker looks clean, dry and drainage slopes & swayles are not obvious at all. The bunker array and angle diversity is remarkable.
I am jealous of the great golf courses Lizzy gets to pee on! ;D ;D ;D
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Sean, great photos again. A pleasure to play once more, very impressed by seeing young Liz broadcast on the worldwide web. She's delighted.
Cheers
Rich
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The heather in the rough comes right out into your face on quite a few holes: #1, #2, #8, the all carry par 3. Is it the really nasty stuff? :o
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Beautiful pictures! But I never hated cart paths more...I wonder if there has been any thoughts about hiding them better?
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Bill each year seems to produce thicker and thicker heather; it is generally far more dangerous stuff than it was only 5 years ago on all the courses I've played recently. Ball swallowing stuff. So it’s either the weather or Greenkeepers sharing knowledge of how to encourage it. Every course you go to is working on it.
New Zealand's importance is often underplayed. Darwin was only 19 when it opened but Horace Hutchinson was 36 and he put it at the centre of developments. In a chapter of his memoirs called "Inland golf" he focuses on this course as the first important one in the Heathlands. He points out that it had to be cleared of trees some 25 years before the famous pictures of ST Georges Hill.
Credit for the course is shared. Mure Ferguson was apparently assisted by Douglas Rolland (fresh from Rye). However Ferguson had the reigns at the club for the next thirty years eventually dying there. He was also influential and was an adviser to PM Lucas on the creation of Prince's Sandwich which at the time was in tended to be the most modern links.
Immediately following Ferguson’s death Simpson was called in. The par 3 third was new and the original 10th and 11th holes were combined. New greens were constructed at the tenth, seventeenth and eighteenth. And then as Sean has so beautifully pointed out there’s the bunkering to consider.
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Bill each year seems to produce thicker and thicker heather; it is generally far more dangerous stuff than it was only 5 years ago on all the courses I've played recently. Ball swallowing stuff. So it’s either the weather or Greenkeepers sharing knowledge of how to encourage it. Every course you go to is working on it.
New Zealand's importance is often underplayed. Darwin was only 19 when it opened but Horace Hutchinson was 36 and he put it at the centre of developments. In a chapter of his memoirs called "Inland golf" he focuses on this course as the first important one in the Heathlands. He points out that it had to be cleared of trees some 25 years before the famous pictures of ST Georges Hill.
Credit for the course is shared. Mure Ferguson was apparently assisted by Douglas Rolland (fresh from Rye). However Ferguson had the reigns at the club for the next thirty years eventually dying there. He was also influential and was an adviser to PM Lucas on the creation of Prince's Sandwich which at the time was in tended to be the most modern links.
Immediately following Ferguson’s death Simpson was called in. The par 3 third was new and the original 10th and 11th holes were combined. New greens were constructed at the tenth, seventeenth and eighteenth. And then as Sean has so beautifully pointed out there’s the bunkering to consider.
I well remember the heather at Beau Desert, and to a lesser extent, at Alwoodley. The stuff at Beau Desert looked reasonably benign until you made the mistake of getting in it. It's almost as nasty as ice plant for difficulty of extrication. >:( It makes for a beautiful but treacherous hazard.
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Great photos as ever Sean. New Zealand certainly seems to be another hidden gem.
Your photo tours always leave me envious. It seems that I could spend a good couple of weeks in SE England playing the well known heathland courses as well as the lesser known ones such as New Zealand. Unfortunately I suspect that neither my wife nor my Bank manager would approve of such a trip!
Incidentally how did New Zealand come by its name?
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Drool, drool.... Great photos and fascinating commentary.
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I can't stop looking at these photos. Thanks for posting them, Sean.
New Zealand appears to be as close to my "ideal" as any course not occupying links-land.
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I can't stop looking at these photos. Thanks for posting them, Sean.
New Zealand appears to be as close to my "ideal" as any course not occupying links-land.
Jeff, what really makes these classic heathland courses work is the sandy soil. The heather is beautiful, isn't it? I'm with you, New Zealand is very appetizing!
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Incidentally how did New Zealand come by its name?
From Wikipedia.
Etymology
Main article: New Zealand place names
It is unknown whether Māori had a name for New Zealand as a whole before the arrival of Europeans, although they referred to the North Island as Te Ika a Māui (the fish of Māui) and the South Island as Te Wai Pounamu (the waters of greenstone) or Te Waka o Aoraki (the canoe of Aoraki).[4] Until the early 20th century, the North Island was also referred to as Aotearoa (colloquially translated "land of the long white cloud");[5] in modern Māori usage, this name refers to the whole country. Aotearoa is also commonly used in this sense in New Zealand English.
The first European name for New Zealand was Staten Landt, the name given to it by the Dutch explorer Abel Tasman, who in 1642 became the first European to see the islands. Tasman assumed it was part of a southern continent connected with land discovered in 1615 off the southern tip of South America by Jacob Le Maire. The name New Zealand originated with Dutch cartographers, who called the islands Nova Zeelandia, after the Dutch province of Zeeland.[6] No-one is certain exactly who first coined the term, but it first appeared in 1645 and may have been the choice of cartographer Johan Blaeu.[7] British explorer James Cook subsequently anglicised the name to New Zealand. There is no connection to the Danish Zealand.
Oh you mean the course name, Andrew. Seems some of the family of Hugh Locke King the landowner emigrated to New Plymouth , NZ. It first apeared on an Ordnance Survey map in 1865.
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Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?
Cheers
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Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?
Cheers
How about top 7?
Addington
Berkshire (there's 2)
Sunningdale (ditto)
Swinley
Woking
and if only allowed 5, drop the Blue and the New.
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Sean - Thanks for the excellent pics - can you give a London area Top 5 to play recommendation?
Cheers
Thanks all for your kind comments!
Rob
If its top 5 favourites:
Addington
St Georges Hill
New Zealand
Woking
and if I can spread the London area out a bit -
Huntercombe
If its top 5 best:
Addington
St Georges Hill
Woking
Swinley
Sunny New
Note, I could easily slot in Sunny Old, the Berkshires or Walton Heaths to either list if I saw them again. These have been omitted based on old memories.
Bill
The heather isn't too bad. It is generally easy to find a ball, but sometimes difficult to get it out. Ideally, there should be a mix of holes with a bit of shortish rough between the fairway and heather and without the rough.
Ciao
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Another of New Zealand's charms is that you are well insulated from the outside world, even though you do cross a road for three holes. A glance at the overhead reveals how dense the trees are (a real forest).
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Glancing at the aerial I was reminded of how close NZ is to West Byfleet which I remember fondly from the 1970s. Sadly, I've not been back.
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Another of New Zealand's charms is that you are well insulated from the outside world, even though you do cross a road for three holes. A glance at the overhead reveals how dense the trees are (a real forest).
Mark
It is amazing how quiet the area is. Woking is literally 2 miles south and the M25 can't be much further - the M3 isn't far either.
How is Woking as a town? Its well centred for playing the heathland courses, but are there decent eateries and pubs in the area?
Ciao
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Thanks for this thread Sean, really enjoyed the photos and descriptions.
Sometimes it is impossible to get a feel for how a golf course would play from photos, but you have managed to get that across really well.
The GCA looks fantastic, but it also looks like a genuinely fun golf course to play.
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Sean, I haven't been to Woking, apart from the three Ws golf courses, for years. I lived briefly at Ripley, near Woking, but that was in 1971! Sorry, I don't know anything about Woking gastronomy.
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After a game today I am convinced that New Zealand is a course which unnecessarily flies under the London radar. I have a great admiration for how well this design works. Take a look at the updated Tour.
Ciao
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This course looks phenomenal. I may have to check it out during my stay in London.
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Sean,
Is the NZ course on flatter terrain than found at Woking, Swinley, Berkshire ?
Bunkering with those eyebrows looks difficult.
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John,
NZ is probably the flattest golf course I have played. There are perhaps 3-4 holes with more than 1m of elevation change. It really is VERY flat.
But the brilliant bunkering (especially those that seem small until you get to them [2, 11, 14], those set in the middle of the front of greens [8, 14] and those that create distance perception issues [2, 4, 7]), combined with how brilliantly the small amount of elevation change (8, 13, 14) and small swales in the land (6, 12, 18) are used are what causes it to soar.
It also has an extremely varied set of par threes.
As an example of how great design can overcome site limitations, NZ has to be a poster child.
I have played many higher rated courses in GB&I, but few that I start thinking about more often in idle moments.
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Scott,
Bunkering looks superb. Missed it on first go at London area, but NZ is at the top if (when) I return. Thanks.
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This looks great. Will have to look into it when I next head in that direction.
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It seems each time I visit New Zealand I grow more fond of it and notice things which escaped my eye previously. The visual subtlety may be the course's single best trump card. It makes me wonder what additional changes Simpson had up his sleeve that were never built. Anyway, take a look at the updated tour. There are a few new pix.
Ciao
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Sean,
Mant thanks for refreshing this photo tour. Scott's recent thread on heathland bunkering and this one have only highlighted both my desire to play NZ and how great the bunkers look!
The "Cat Woman Eyes" bunkers on 14 are interesting, and I'm not just talking about your naming of it ;) There is a lot of heather short of that bunker, somthing whech I haven't seen much of before? Does this mean the fairway used to be much wider here allowing for tee shots to run into the bunker? And if so, its interesting to see how vigerous the growth of heather here is to populate the former fairway?
Cheers,
James
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What I find remarkable is how many different bunker styles are employed but they don't necessarily conflict with one another. It's alomost as if the style is not to have a style. Great pics and analysis. I wouold like to see more courses ilike this being developed. Courses like this that are inricate without being overly long, just seem more comfortable.
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I really haven't thought about New Zealand GC in 20+ years.
What's amazing to me is how many aspects are similar to Kingston Heath:
1. Short loop coming back to clubhouse (five holes instead of six)
2. Flatness
3. Superb bunkering (Kingston Heath probably has 3x as many though)
4. 18th hole side-on approach to clubhouse (deja vu!)
The main difference, of course, is that Kingston Heath is about 700 yards longer so it gets much more respect from the low handicappers.
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Sean,
I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.
Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.
I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.
Back left of the 17th green?
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Sean,
I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.
Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.
I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.
Back left of the 17th green?
Scott, that bunker on 17 is awesome.. I have to disagree with you.. Russell Talley snapped this shot of me looking dour not because of the architecture but because I was soon to fly out of Heathrow (as you can see by my attire) shortly there after and could not play NZ that day.. I would not touch the artistry of that bunker..
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v640/swinley/DSCF0140.jpg)
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Log-in required to see that pic, Noel.
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its up now
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Sean,
I am interested to hear which bunkers you think are superfluous? I agree some could go without affecting the course at all.
Those behind the 8th and 11th greens do nothing for me, but I realise they probably help to keep balls off the road.
I also wonder if 5 would be a better hole with the RHS bunker removed? There is good enough ground to the right to make that chip tough as it is.
Back left of the 17th green?
Scott
I wouldn't touch a thing with the green or the surrounds of #17. It is one of the most brilliantly subtle green complexes I know of.
There are only four bunkers I can think of that I would do away with:
#2 right side of green
#8 rear of green (maybe two back there?)
#11 rear of green x2
All are very slap dash in construction and should be filled in just because they are a blight. That said, #11's defeat the purpose of the green sloping to the rear. The placement of #2's is fine, but if they are not gonna take the time to make it blend the bunker is that critical to compromise the look of the bunker short of the green.
Ciao
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For you Sean "I hate Deal" Arble.. notice that is my YA Tittle pose (especially if you saw what happened to Eli Manning last night!)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v640/swinley/DSCF0142.jpg)
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For you Sean "I hate Deal" Arble.. notice that is my YA Tittle pose (especially if you saw what happened to Eli Manning last night!)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v640/swinley/DSCF0142.jpg)
Tuco aka Yelberton
Deal is for girlie boys.
Ciao
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Deal is MIGHTY... I look forward Friday as the southwesterly is going to blow 20mph
(http://www.tigerrag.com/wp-content/uploads/ya-tittle.jpg)
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Tom mentions respect because of length. While New Zealand isn't long, when the course is keen its surprisingly tight for the aggressive player.
It always a treat to play New Zealand and yesterday was no different. Take a look at the updated pix. For sure New Zealand is one of the tigers dressed as a kitten - I always struggle to score.
Ciao
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After a recent trip to this delightful course without my own camera, i thought I'd bump Sean's thread.
While not a long course, the heather and bunkering still make it quite a challenge. However, the heather appears to be kept pretty young and not too woody, so recovery isn't too difficult, and there aren't many bunkers but those there are, well with the exception of a few that Sean points out, they are all well positioned. Some of the other details of the course are also great, such as the hollows short of the 6th, 13th and 18th holes, making for interesting approaches and recoveries.
But the course isn't especially hilly, and may well be one of the flattest courses I've ever played. But at no point do you start thinking its dull because of this. In fact, being pretty flat, not too long but still a fun challenge, all means I can imagine this would be a great course to play your final years over as an older man...
And finally not forgetting the club itself. A wonderful old clubhouse, with great food and attention to detail, but all in a very understated way. Fantastic stuff!
Cheers,
James
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NZ has one of the toughest starts I know of on a short course 1-7 includes three par 3s and four solid par 4 holes. Like Rye and Swinley Forest, the New Zealand course proves pure length is not required for a good challenge. Hitting the short stuff is very important as is solid iron play.
NZ used to be dragged down by spongy slow greens, now the greenkeeper has dried out the greens, done plenty of work and the surfaces are more than acceptable. Given the current rate of their improvement in a couple of years the NZ greens will be as good as any of their peer greens.
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Chappers
The last time at NZ I was surprised at how narrow the course plays when F&F. There are some serious club selection debates which can occur on several tees. I need to go back again and again and again.
Ciao
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Sean you are quite right the fairways are pretty generous and as James stated the heather is kept nice and young and moderately playable. However when the ball runs the fairways play considerably narrower.
NZ would be a wonderful place to play ones twilight years golfing years at. It's flat, short, pretty, a great club but still testing of the players abilities.
Only at NZ would you find a members dog hitching a ride on the marshals/drinks cart. As it was a warm day the driver picked up the tired hound, apparently it's a regular service to members dogs....class!
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Yes, New Zealand IS under the radar - and they want it kept that way. I visited the club some years ago to write an article about it for inclusion in a book. But first I had to convince the secretary that I wasn't going to open the floodgates to visitors. I convinced him. They are not overwhelmed by unwanted visitors and I had a very pleasant afternoon wandering the fairways and thoroughly amiable chat with the secretary afterwards. That precious ethos was not damaged.
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Brian
Those courses weren't in any particular order. The list hasn't changed much
Ciao
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Swinley better than Berkshire Red? Unlike you to be so orthodox.
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Mark
I haven't seen Berkshire Red in a long time so I discount that I have ever seen it. The Red is high on my list to see as is Walton Heath Old, but it still pains me to pay over a 100 quid - maybe one day.
Ciao
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Brian
New Zealand is something apart isn't it? As Richard pointed out, the conditioning is improving. While it was far from bone dry Friday, I didn't have any mud/dirt on me troozers and that is the acid test for winter golf. That is good going with the rain we have had.
Ciao
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Has it really been five years since this thread was re-visited? See the updated tour with some pix I found lost in the vaults.
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,36467.msg745045.html#msg745045 (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,36467.msg745045.html#msg745045)
Ciao
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So F Pont did some work to New Zealand last winter...anyone see the results?
Ciao
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Only on Facebook so far. Shaped by Conor Walsh and his crew. Looks good from photos
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Only on Facebook so far. Shaped by Conor Walsh and his crew. Looks good from photos
Adam
I am quite surprised the work hasn't received more ink. Do you know if pushing fairways out is part of the work?
Ciao
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Does anyone have updates on the work at NZ?
Ciao
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If the course is as good as you say, Sean, why are they doing anything to it?
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If the course is as good as you say, Sean, why are they doing anything to it?
I think they did bunker work, but I was hoping that trees were the bigger focus. Haven't heard.
Ciao
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If the course is as good as you say, Sean, why are they doing anything to it?
I think they did bunker work, but I was hoping that trees were the bigger focus. Haven't heard.
Ciao
CDP have been posting regular updates on Twitter, Sean. You’ll be pleased to see there has been a lot of tree work.
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1458134781594521603?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1458134781594521603?s=21)
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1457816864608894987?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1457816864608894987?s=21)
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1453046394768461827?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1453046394768461827?s=21)
I was due to play there for the first time a few months ago but it didn’t come off. It’s high on my wish list for 2022.
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If the course is as good as you say, Sean, why are they doing anything to it?
I think they did bunker work, but I was hoping that trees were the bigger focus. Haven't heard.
Ciao
CDP have been posting regular updates on Twitter, Sean. You’ll be pleased to see there has been a lot of tree work.
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1458134781594521603?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1458134781594521603?s=21)
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1457816864608894987?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1457816864608894987?s=21)
https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1453046394768461827?s=21 (https://twitter.com/cdpgolf1/status/1453046394768461827?s=21)
I was due to play there for the first time a few months ago but it didn’t come off. It’s high on my wish list for 2022.
Thanks! The photos don't depict that much change. Just a bit of sprucing up. Any more talk of tree removal?
Ciao