[bakerg]

Are you kidding me?  Olympia Fields ahead of Pacific Dunes and Sand Hills??  Are they insane?  This is almost as dumb as them saying that Pebble was better than Pine Valley. How is it possible to go from #1 to #5?  

[Mike_Cirba]

Just wait til the US Open goes to Torrey Pines...

I smell another Top Ten course in the making.  

What the freak is it with this "US Open bounce"?  Is there anything that makes less sense on any level?   :-/

The fact that Sand Hills is the #38 course in the country is beyond ludicrous, and speaks for itself and the methodologies employed, loud and clear.  

[Michael Dugger]

bakerg

Before someone else chimes in here--less tongue-in-cheek than I--have you played all of these courses?  

Don't you know you aren't allowed to make comments of this sort without having "done the work"?

(I so totally agree--there's a whole lot about those rankings that make me shake my head)

But what do I know  

[bakerg]

I haven't played Sand Hills but the other two I mentioned I have played.  IMO Shinnecock should be third behind PV and CP.  I was just shocked because Golf Magazine doesn't even include Olympia Fields in their World 100 but Sand Hills is ranked 12th in the world according to them.  It just boggles the mind.  I also think Pinehurst #2 should be in the top 10, not sure how it isn't.  I guess we will have to wait till 2005 when they have the Open to be ranked higher.  

And as far as Medinah and Olympia go, I don't even think they are the two best courses in Chicago.  Shoreacres and Chicago GC should be ranked higher than them.  IMO

[Keith Williams]

My ten cents...

Is Crooked Stick really Pete Dye's finest effort? :-/
And, in turn, is the best Dye course only worthy of
#54???
And, also in turn, does this really mean that Shadow Creek,
Victoria Nat'l and Wade Hampton are all better than any
Pete Dye course in the entire country?

Also, on the public list... Cuscowilla at #61 and only six spots
ahead of its very undeserving (IMHO) neighbor, Great Waters?

Oh well, it certainly is discussion material....

Keith.

[RJ_Daley]

This seems to me like another episode of City Slickers III.  If you don't have an upscale clubhouse operation, you don't make it.  RC, WH, and BC all suffer from spartan "amenities" in the public list.  On the 100 greatest list, most of the metropolis/resort centered raters couldn't even find Nebraska, let alone navigate their way to Mullen.  

But really, why do we obsess on lists of numerical rankings in the first place?  Why not put out a non-numerical grouping of general consensus meritorious golf courses, and then have a system of consensus comments about each individual courses strengths.  Anotherwords, identify the course by saying things like - naturally routed and constructed, exellent balance of hole challenges and shot making demands, very walkable, consistently fast and firm conditions, exciting and clever greens structure.  Or, eager and fawning staff, pristine grounds, beautiful landscaping, fine food and drink, perfectly manicured framing bunkers with sparkling sand, great hole containment, best fleet of carts, high profile executive clientel...blah, blah, blah :-/

Any golf enthusiast wanting insight as to where to try and play or why courses are great is far better served if Golf Club Atlas continues to expand its' list of courses and descriptions with attached discussion of the merits of the reviews.  What the hell can you learn from a numerically ranked list other than some sort of a sense of personal validation of your own tastes?

[John_Conley]

Re: Sand Hills

It seems like we have this conversation entirely too often.  It was Top 10 four years ago and Top 10 two years ago.  Golf Digest adds the arbitrary "tradition" category and it falls to 40 or so.  It went DOWN in 2001 despite more people seeing it and recognizing it for the wonder it is.

I'm sure Olympia Fields is not ranked ahead of Pacific Dunes by my count.  I ignore "tradition".

If you disagree with the criteria, don't be surprised when you disagree with the final result.

[Chris_Clouser]

I only really noticed two things in the list that I wanted to comment on.

How in the world is Brickyard Crossing the #47 public course in the country???

That course isn't even in the top 10 in the Indy metro area!!!

Really that is something that someone will have to explain to me for me to even understand how you could rank a course that high.  It must get a lot of bonus points for being near the track.  

Also, Kingsley Club only ranked 22nd in the state of Michigan???

Must be some good golf up there.  

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