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Adrian_Stiff

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2023, 05:32:58 AM »
Wonder if the R & A would ever consider having the Open over two courses for the first two days.


Double the field- More income.



Old Course & New Course
St Georges & Princes
Birkdale & Hillside
Dunluce & other one forget its name
Troon & Prestwick (or Portland)
Carnoustie & Burnside.


Lytham, Hoylake don't tick the box. Turnberry probably does not. Muirfield could duel with Gullane??


Remember they started doing this with the Amateur championship..

So for an extra two days.
Double the no of grandstands?
TWO TENTED VILLAGES? ???
Logistical probles of getting 2X fans in and out?


Yep I'm sure they've run the calculator over this and if they keep jacking the price up, it may yet happen.  ;D ;D

However of your examples only Princes and Hillside are long enough for the 'flat bellies'.  But they seem willing to do "work" on the Old Course(and its immediate neighbours), so why not the others?
I dont think you would need extra grandstands and certainly no tented village, St Andrews or St Georges is prime for a Super Open. Could easily add £10,000,000 back into the pot/grow the game/help at grass roots/help at the tours below DPworld.
Only problem is logistics, the tickets all get sold out so no problem getting the crowds, lots of space at RSG/Princes- St Andrews New/jub combo could prob be done.
A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2023, 06:30:55 AM »
Where two courses share a boundary (like St Andrews or Princes and RSG… Or Portmarnock and the Hotel course for that matter), I could see it almost working with some things shared like perimeter security, tented village, flow of spectators etc… but I can’t see how they could get away without significant extra cost on grandstands, TV infrastructure, parking etc…


Unless they reduced the attendance numbers which would kind of defeat the purpose?

Adrian_Stiff

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2023, 08:54:08 AM »
Where two courses share a boundary (like St Andrews or Princes and RSG… Or Portmarnock and the Hotel course for that matter), I could see it almost working with some things shared like perimeter security, tented village, flow of spectators etc… but I can’t see how they could get away without significant extra cost on grandstands, TV infrastructure, parking etc…


Unless they reduced the attendance numbers which would kind of defeat the purpose?
Don't really need extra grandstands, the stands are only for a few thousand outside the 18th, the main event 3 of the 4 rounds is still on the big one, will be a bit more cost for TV, parking would be the problem to solve but you just park further away and bus them in. Could be good to have a Super Open, even if only for TOC. Field could go to 312, all ex champions, much more spots for qualifiers and more of the 'old romantic feeling' the Open had. Regional Q has become something some good players don't even try now because of the few spots. I am sure you are right though and there must be logistical reasons why not to do it. From St Andrews point of view it would elevate the 'want' for people to play the New and Jubilee, so long term commercial benefit.

A combination of whats good for golf and good for turf.
The Players Club, Cumberwell Park, The Kendleshire, Oake Manor, Dainton Park, Forest Hills, Erlestoke, St Cleres.
www.theplayersgolfclub.com

JohnVDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2023, 09:42:01 AM »
No aged champions, no amateurs who had a good day or two… etc.


Just 20 club pros who rarely make the cut, in spite of this year.

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2023, 09:43:00 AM »
Where two courses share a boundary (like St Andrews or Princes and RSG… Or Portmarnock and the Hotel course for that matter), I could see it almost working with some things shared like perimeter security, tented village, flow of spectators etc… but I can’t see how they could get away without significant extra cost on grandstands, TV infrastructure, parking etc…
Unless they reduced the attendance numbers which would kind of defeat the purpose?
Don't really need extra grandstands, the stands are only for a few thousand outside the 18th, the main event 3 of the 4 rounds is still on the big one, will be a bit more cost for TV, parking would be the problem to solve but you just park further away and bus them in. Could be good to have a Super Open, even if only for TOC. Field could go to 312, all ex champions, much more spots for qualifiers and more of the 'old romantic feeling' the Open had. Regional Q has become something some good players don't even try now because of the few spots. I am sure you are right though and there must be logistical reasons why not to do it. From St Andrews point of view it would elevate the 'want' for people to play the New and Jubilee, so long term commercial benefit.
I’ve always thought an Open at St Andrews or some other big, special event there, could play the 1st, 16th, 17th and 18th on TOC with the remaining holes comprising the best holes from the New, Eden and Jubilee. If possible routing wise maybe include the 11th and 14th on TOC as well. It wouldn’t even be necessary to play the non-TOC holes from their usual tees.
Most viewers on TV probably wouldn’t notice the difference to the normal routing and some attending probably won’t realise either. It would certainly be different and ought to allow more spectators on site too.
Be nice to see it happen but I’m not holding my breath it will.
Atb

Marty Bonnar

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #30 on: September 14, 2023, 09:56:04 AM »
Getting in and out of St Andrews is horrendous even at the best of times. Single-lane roads. There’s no dual-carriageway within about ten miles. The nearest rail station is, of course, Leuchars about five miles away. Parking is hellish. If you’re lucky enough to have access to a private jet or helicopter you can land at the old RAF Base (now an Army camp). Accommodation is VERY limited - and stupidly expensive.
Oh, and the golf course is now an utter irrelevance to any kind of elite golf as recently illustrated by the Walker Cup.
Really, why bother?
 ;D
F.
The White River runs dark through the heart of the Town,
Washed the people coal-black from the hole in the ground.

Jeff Schley

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #31 on: September 22, 2023, 06:12:08 AM »

Oh, and the golf course is now an utter irrelevance to any kind of elite golf as recently illustrated by the Walker Cup.
Really, why bother?
 ;D
F.


Marty so u really believe that?  Didn't we have one of the all time great open finishes just a year ago with Cam Smith winning an ultra exciting finish?


Do we really care what the winning score is? If the weather picks up u have higher scores, if not u have lower scores.  Pretty weather dependent at most open venues.
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #32 on: September 22, 2023, 07:26:05 AM »
Not sure if it's been mentioned above but the 2024 British Amateur Championship, aka The Amateur Championship, is to be played at ....... Ballyliffin, which is in the Republic of Ireland.
Note that this championship has previously been played in the RoI at Portmarnock in 1949 and 2019.

atb

Erik J. Barzeski

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #33 on: September 22, 2023, 11:38:29 AM »
No aged champions, no amateurs who had a good day or two… etc.

Just 20 club pros who rarely make the cut, in spite of this year.
Yes, and 136 (I think) well qualified Tour players.
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, and Garland.

Ally Mcintosh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #34 on: September 22, 2023, 02:28:18 PM »
Not sure if it's been mentioned above but the 2024 British Amateur Championship, aka The Amateur Championship, is to be played at ....... Ballyliffin, which is in the Republic of Ireland.
Note that this championship has previously been played in the RoI at Portmarnock in 1949 and 2019.

atb


This for me was an amazing coup; not the fact that Ballyliffin is outside the UK; but that they gave the Amateur to such a new course outside the UK.


The Amateur has arguably the best list of host courses of any tournament / championship anywhere: Not a weak one among them, all with design pedigree and all with a long history.

Thomas Dai

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #35 on: September 23, 2023, 04:16:48 AM »
Not sure if it's been mentioned above but the 2024 British Amateur Championship, aka The Amateur Championship, is to be played at ....... Ballyliffin, which is in the Republic of Ireland.
Note that this championship has previously been played in the RoI at Portmarnock in 1949 and 2019.
atb
This for me was an amazing coup; not the fact that Ballyliffin is outside the UK; but that they gave the Amateur to such a new course outside the UK.
The Amateur has arguably the best list of host courses of any tournament / championship anywhere: Not a weak one among them, all with design pedigree and all with a long history.
Qualifying on the delightful ‘humps and hollows’ Old, Championship play on the newer ‘made by big machines’ Glashedy.
Be nice if it were the other way round but I guess TV camera views will be more spectacular if play is on the Glashedy. TV first, golf second at an amateur event seems rather sad.
Atb


David_Tepper

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #36 on: October 07, 2023, 12:48:13 PM »
Recent article ("R&A keen to explore"):

https://www.bbc.com/sport/golf/67027603

JohnVDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2023, 03:58:36 AM »
No aged champions, no amateurs who had a good day or two… etc.

Just 20 club pros who rarely make the cut, in spite of this year.
Yes, and 136 (I think) well qualified Tour players.


Past champions have a lifetime exemption to the PGA. Some of them are not really that qualified anymore.

Erik J. Barzeski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #38 on: October 09, 2023, 08:04:54 AM »
Past champions have a lifetime exemption to the PGA. Some of them are not really that qualified anymore.
The fact remains that the PGA has the strongest field of the four majors.
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, and Garland.

Niall C

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2023, 08:11:10 AM »
Erik


Is it a fact ?


Niall

Mark Pearce

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #40 on: October 09, 2023, 08:32:48 AM »
Erik


Is it a fact ?


Niall
Eric says it is.  So it must be.
In June I will be riding the first three stages of this year's Tour de France route for charity.  630km (394 miles) in three days, with 7800m (25,600 feet) of climbing for the William Wates Memorial Trust (https://rideleloop.org/the-charity/) which supports underprivileged young people.

Niall C

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2023, 08:36:39 AM »
ah yes, there is that.


Niall

Erik J. Barzeski

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2023, 08:25:48 PM »
Is it a fact ?
Yep.

https://www.owgr.com/events-to-date

PGA: 463
Players: 434
British: 433
U.S. Open: 422



Masters: 335
Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, and Garland.

Bill Gayne

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2023, 09:36:50 PM »
It's a fact but help me understand why it's a relevant fact? OWGR ranking for majors is a reflection of the number of players at the low end of the field. The top end of the field is the same for all four majors and the Players.

Sean_A

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2023, 09:54:32 PM »
Is it a fact ?
Yep.

https://www.owgr.com/events-to-date

PGA: 463
Players: 434
British: 433
U.S. Open: 422



Masters: 335

Thats not a fact because the data is based on a subjective set of weighted criteria. Anyone could devise a different set of criteria which could yield different results. Saying the PGA is the strongest field is akin to saying Pine Valley is the best golf course because a ranking panel crunched the numbers and that is the result.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2024: Ashridge, Kennemer, de Pan, Blackmoor, Eindhoven, Hilversumche, Royal Ostend & Alnmouth

Erik J. Barzeski

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Re: OT - R&A "Seriously" Looking At Staging The Open Outside Of The UK?
« Reply #45 on: October 10, 2023, 10:10:14 PM »
Thats not a fact because the data is based on a subjective set of weighted criteria.
Your dictionary has a wrong definition of "subjective."

Erik J. Barzeski @iacas
Author, Lowest Score Wins, Instructor/Coach, and Lifetime Student of the Game.

I generally ignore Rob, Tim, and Garland.

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