[Rob Marshall]

I spent much of the day on the 6th hole. Playing into the wind i saw 1 birdie. Bogies, dubs and trips. Had to play close to 1.5 strokes over par. Has to be one of the hardest holes on tour. If they shaved the banks like they did when the green site was a par 3 I can’t imagine what the scores would have been.

[Tom_Doak]

I spent much of the day on the 6th hole. Playing into the wind i saw 1 birdie. Bogies, dubs and trips. Had to play close to 1.5 strokes over par. Has to be one of the hardest holes on tour. If they shaved the banks like they did when the green site was a par 3 I can’t imagine what the scores would have been.

Hot take:  shaving the banks is stupid.  Augusta National is the exception that proves the rule.


Also:  kudos to Andrew Green for restoring the 6th hole.  From the first time I saw Oak Hill [as a 19-year-old college sophomore], I could not comprehend how George and Tom Fazio decided to eliminate Donald Ross's best hole from the routing to make their version of the course fit.

[Jim_Coleman]

   This group has shown love for the “half par.” This was a half par. It so happens it was half+ par, not a half- par. Would you have liked it more if it were called a par 5?

[Matt_Cohn]

Had to play close to 1.5 strokes over par.

The 6th hole played at 4.75 today.

[Rob Marshall]

Had to play close to 1.5 strokes over par.

The 6th hole played at 4.75 today.

Just saw that. I think they said hardest hole in pga championship history. With only 3 birdies I thought the average was higher. I will say when I left the hole, the wind died way down. Scheffler said it was the hardest hole he’s every played.

[Matthew Rose]

Prior to the new 5th hole being added, there was what appeared to be a maintained par three "practice hole" in the same spot. You can see this on pre-Green overhead shots.

Was this hole ever put in play in any incarnation of Oak Hill?

[Andrew Harvie]

It's the hardest hole I've ever played in the hardest stretch of consecutive par 4's I've ever seen. Makes sense: it was, apparently, the hardest hole ever in a single PGA Championship round at +0.75 over par

[John Blain]

Prior to the new 5th hole being added, there was what appeared to be a maintained par three "practice hole" in the same spot. You can see this on pre-Green overhead shots.

Was this hole ever put in play in any incarnation of Oak Hill?

It was used for the '68 US Open. They took the original par 3 6th out of play due to congestion issues with the 5th green, 7th and 9th tees being so close to each other.

[JLahrman]

The tournament is won by taking the fewest shots.


Through three rounds, players are taking the most shots (4.99) on hole #4.


Wouldn't #4 be the hardest hole?

[Matt_Cohn]

The tournament is won by taking the fewest shots.


Through three rounds, players are taking the most shots (4.99) on hole #4.


Wouldn't #4 be the hardest hole?

Sure, if you like your leaderboards done by cumulative shots rather than over/under par!

[JLahrman]

The tournament is won by taking the fewest shots.

Through three rounds, players are taking the most shots (4.99) on hole #4.

Wouldn't #4 be the hardest hole?

Sure, if you like your leaderboards done by cumulative shots rather than over/under par!

Well I get that, but the fact is that 278 or 283 or whatever wins the tournament, not -5 or -2.

We're talking about the 6th being the hardest hole in PGA Championship history, Scheffler says it's the hardest hole he's ever played, etc. But if they change the sign to say it's a par 5 instead of a par 4, then all of a sudden we'd be talking about how easy the hole is. That can't be right - the hole is the hole. You can't change it from hard to easy simply by using white-out. By that rationale all we'd have to do is relabel a par 3 as a par 2 and voila we've got the new hardest hole on the course.

[John Foley]

I love how the set up is challenging the long iron game of the best players in the world. Haven't seen more hit in a tournament in forever. The stretch from 6-9 is soo tough. #8 is a head scratcher as it appears that is playing easier than I would have thought especially given the green side bunkers. It has always been the toughest hole in my rounds there.


Absolutely LOVE the new 5th. They can take dead aim and pay a price for the miss. From the 180 its been playing shorter than that w/ the pin up front.


All in all the changes are just spectacular, cant wait for a great Sunday.

[JJShanley]

   This group has shown love for the “half par.” This was a half par. It so happens it was half+ par, not a half- par. Would you have liked it more if it were called a par 5?

My current home course has a half-par hole for #3. 460 yards, par 4, typically into a prevailing wind, although with firm links turf. Downwind it requires an accurate draw to avoid a bunker at ~300 yards on the right hand side of the fairway the contours around which can attract a ball from as much as 15 yards away. I enjoy the challenge.

[Matt_Cohn]

Absolutely LOVE the new 5th. They can take dead aim and pay a price for the miss. From the 180 its been playing shorter than that w/ the pin up front.

Agree it's a cool hole. I get distracted by the dew path from the tee that dead-ends in the rough 40 yards short of the green because there's not fairway to connect to. There must be a better way. 

[Sam Kestin]

Hot take:  shaving the banks is stupid.  Augusta National is the exception that proves the rule.

@Tom--would be curious to hear more detail on what drives your viewpoint on shaved banks.


I suppose it's a matter of personal preference, but I love the excitement created by a shaved bank that thins out the margin separating a serviceable (or sometimes even great) shot from total disaster. To me, I guess, one of the great thrills in golf is a ball in the air with an unknown and highly polarized result. More plainly, I'm talking about a shot where you know if it's one yard in this direction then it's DOA, but if it's another yard in that direction it could be glorious. I'm sensitive to the way in which this violates the concept of proportionality, but I'll admit to being a sucker for the exhilaration created by this sharp divergence in possible outcomes.


Additionally, for the most part, I'm not a huge fan of negating hazards. This is another matter of personal taste, but I guess I view growing the rough on a bank separating a hazard from fairway/green to be cut from a similar strategic cloth. The rough acts to blunt the razor's edge that would otherwise separate the fairway/green from the water.


Using the sixth at Oak Hill as the example, if the water on the left by the green exists to punish the player for missing on that side, what is the strategic value of giving the player a redraw opportunity to not pay in full for his mistake?

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