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Rich Thomas

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The American Muni
« on: February 18, 2023, 02:05:31 PM »
Hey all...this may be a little off topic architecturally, but I am looking to start a project to tell the stories from what I consider to be the heartbeat of American golf. I'm looking for stories about municipal golf courses to tell. I want to tell stories of the courses and the people. I am looking for lesser known historically significant courses, to courses with great architecture, and courses with unusual stories and people.
For example, I grew up playing a course in West Central Illinois in the middle of nowhere called Gibson Woods. It's a Homer Fieldhouse layout in the city park. The course has hosted a President, is the home of a major champion, and arguably the home of one of the most successful high school golf programs in the state boasting multiple individual and team state champions from 1980-2002.
We are all familiar with the big name munis like Bethpage, Torrey, and Chambers Bay, and those in the know, are aware of Swope Memorial, Sharps Park, Brackenridge Park, and Winter Park. I was hoping some you would know of some stories, characters, and courses that are worth putting on paper. If anyone is willing to share, I would be very grateful. I know this is going to be a long project and I am just starting to get some ideas in motion, but I have the time and hopefully will have the ability to see this project through.
Again, in advance, thank you for your ideas and help.


Rich

Jeff Schley

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2023, 02:23:16 PM »
George Dunne in Oak Forest, Illinois is a very good muni. Owned by the Cook County Forest Preserve and one of the highlights of public golf in the suburbs of Chicago.
"To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice your gifts."
- Steve Prefontaine

Mike Hendren

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2023, 03:12:41 PM »
Daylight to dark at Tenison Park.  Trevino playing with a taped up Dr. Pepper bottle, not to mention Titanic Thompson.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2023, 03:15:49 PM by Mike Hendren »
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Tim_Weiman

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2023, 03:26:41 PM »
Rich,


We recently had a thread that touched on Stanley Thompson’s work, including courses in the Cleveland area.


Big Met in Fairview Park is a course with only a few interesting holes but it gets a ton of play and can be frustrating from a pace of play perspective.


Years ago I played with a guy who told me he bet a local pro he couldn’t break 80 at Big Met. The pro laughed and thought it was a joke until one Saturday afternoon when he painfully struggled through a round of 84.


He liked to play fast and just couldn’t stand the slow pace of play. It cost him a steak dinner.
Tim Weiman

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2023, 04:06:10 PM »
Daylight to dark at Tenison Park.  Trevino playing with a taped up Dr. Pepper bottle, not to mention Titanic Thompson.




This is the type of stuff I'm looking for. If Ben Hogan calls you the best shot maker he has ever seen, that's saying something.

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2023, 04:12:02 PM »
No discussion of American Munis is complete without Cobbs Creek in Philadelphia:

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,31872.0.html

Might as well add Paxon Hollow:
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,70039.0.html

Also, Try Torresdale-Frankford, Walnut Lane, Juniata, FDR and Five Ponds
« Last Edit: February 18, 2023, 04:19:16 PM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2023, 04:28:27 PM »
Rich,


We recently had a thread that touched on Stanley Thompson’s work, including courses in the Cleveland area.


Big Met in Fairview Park is a course with only a few interesting holes but it gets a ton of play and can be frustrating from a pace of play perspective.


Years ago I played with a guy who told me he bet a local pro he couldn’t break 80 at Big Met. The pro laughed and thought it was a joke until one Saturday afternoon when he painfully struggled through a round of 84.


He liked to play fast and just couldn’t stand the slow pace of play. It cost him a steak dinner.




Tim,


I remember that thread. I was getting ready to head up to play Banff and Jasper. Absolutely loved them by the way.

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2023, 04:30:40 PM »
No discussion of American Munis is complete without Cobbs Creek in Philadelphia:

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,31872.0.html

Might as well add Paxon Hollow:
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,70039.0.html

Also, Try Torresdale-Frankford, Walnut Lane, Juniata, FDR and Five Ponds




Steve,


Cobbs Creek came to mind. I don't know much about it right now. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of experience playing on the East coast. I have a lot to learn and see when it comes to that side of the country. Are the others you listed also east coasters?

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2023, 05:13:44 PM »
Yes, all those I mentioned are in Philadelphia or nearby.
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Phil Young

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2023, 05:30:33 PM »
How about a public course that began as a private club? Tilly, who was inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame, redesigned and rerouted the existing Cedar Crest Country Club course in 1920. The original course was designed and built in 1919 by S. J. Cooper. He was quite upset when the club hired tilly to rip up what he built and create a new course, so he quite his job and went to another club. He brought with him his son, Harry" not yet Lighthorse" Cooper who, the year before, set the record for the original course  at 14 years of age.
 
In 1926, Macdonald Smith won the Texas Open Championship, today's Valero Open, Smith would be inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame.

Another 14-year old who caddied at the club in 1928, was a young man named Lloyd Mangrum, who turned professional the next year. Both "Lighthorse" Harry Cooper and Lloyd Mangrum were also inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame. In 1927 the course hosted the PGA Championship, won for the last time by Walter Hagen.
 
Like many clubs of its time, the financial strain of the Great depression drove it into bankruptcy. It was purchased by the city of Dallas, Texas and has been enjoyed by many public players ever since.

In 1954, the course hosted the UGA Negro National Open, won by Charlie Sifford. He would be inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame as well. That same year, Gene Andrews would win the USGA Public Links championship, also contested at Cedar Crest. As far as I know, it is the only course to host the PGA, Negro National Open and the USGA Public Links championships.

This November Cedar Crest will be the site of a new, annual amateur tournament. It has been named the "Southwest Airlines Showcase at Cedar Crest." It is a unique event as there will be 42 invitation sent out, these going to the "top 21 male and female black collegiate golfers in the country." It will be a three-day, 54-hole tournament debuting on November 13, 2023 and each day's play will be televised live by the Golf Channel.

The course will have a tweaking to it later this year and a restorative renovation to take place over the next several years, allowing the course to be open for regular play and the tournament to be played as well. This is going to be an exciting event.   


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« Last Edit: February 18, 2023, 05:32:06 PM by Phil Young »

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2023, 06:50:57 PM »
How about a public course that began as a private club? Tilly, who was inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame, redesigned and rerouted the existing Cedar Crest Country Club course in 1920. The original course was designed and built in 1919 by S. J. Cooper. He was quite upset when the club hired tilly to rip up what he built and create a new course, so he quite his job and went to another club. He brought with him his son, Harry" not yet Lighthorse" Cooper who, the year before, set the record for the original course  at 14 years of age.
 
In 1926, Macdonald Smith won the Texas Open Championship, today's Valero Open, Smith would be inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame.

Another 14-year old who caddied at the club in 1928, was a young man named Lloyd Mangrum, who turned professional the next year. Both "Lighthorse" Harry Cooper and Lloyd Mangrum were also inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame. In 1927 the course hosted the PGA Championship, won for the last time by Walter Hagen.
 
Like many clubs of its time, the financial strain of the Great depression drove it into bankruptcy. It was purchased by the city of Dallas, Texas and has been enjoyed by many public players ever since.

In 1954, the course hosted the UGA Negro National Open, won by Charlie Sifford. He would be inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame as well. That same year, Gene Andrews would win the USGA Public Links championship, also contested at Cedar Crest. As far as I know, it is the only course to host the PGA, Negro National Open and the USGA Public Links championships.

This November Cedar Crest will be the site of a new, annual amateur tournament. It has been named the "Southwest Airlines Showcase at Cedar Crest." It is a unique event as there will be 42 invitation sent out, these going to the "top 21 male and female black collegiate golfers in the country." It will be a three-day, 54-hole tournament debuting on November 13, 2023 and each day's play will be televised live by the Golf Channel.

The course will have a tweaking to it later this year and a restorative renovation to take place over the next several years, allowing the course to be open for regular play and the tournament to be played as well. This is going to be an exciting event.   


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Absolutely anything that is a muni. Doesn't matter how it started or how it got there. Cedar Crest sounds like an incredible story. It's definitely going into the notebook. Thank you Phil.

Stewart Abramson

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2023, 08:46:00 PM »
Rackham, originally designed by Donald Ross, in the Detroit suburb of Huntington Woods



Rackham Ben Davis memorabila in club house




Rackham Ben Davis memorabila in cub house

JLahrman

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2023, 10:00:37 PM »
In my hometown, Avon Fields: https://web.archive.org/web/20151120010742/http://www.wcpo.com/sports/golf/avon-fields-the-black-country-club-of-cincinnati-turns-100


I suppose it's not a muni anymore but it has been for the vast majority of its 100+ year history.





Tim Leahy

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2023, 02:45:54 AM »
Rancho Park in LA has a ton of history that could be a book on its own including hosting the LA Open including a plaque on the 18th tee to Arnold Palmer commemorating his 12 on the hole which included 4 fairway woods OB after a perfect drive. When asked about it he said he missed a 25 ft putt for an 11. Rancho was once the busiest course in the US and has history with Charlie Safford also.
Another muni with history is Haggin Oaks in Sacramento, CA designed by Allister MacKenzie. Unfortunately it has been hacked up by freeways and bad architectural choices but is still one of the busiest courses in America with a 24 hour driving range. The clubhouse snackbar has the original Mac plans and every table has newspaper clippings including the course's history which included an exhibition with Babe Ruth, Walter Hagen, the governor at the time and a celebrity whose name escapes me. The course has held professional events in the past and the state open for years.
Santa Anita muni has a great history being built by hand during the Depression with remnants of the original Santa Anita racetrack still visible on the course.
Good hunting 8) .
I love golf, the fightin irish, and beautiful women depending on the season and availability.

Philip Gordillo

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2023, 04:33:57 AM »
Rich,


Check out the story of Audubon Golf Course in New Orleans.  It started as a private club in 1899 on leased land in Audubon Park.  The city took over the golf course by the 1920s.  A young prodigy Joe Bartholomew got his start there as did many generations of caddies and players.  The first pro was a Scot named William Stoddard from Brookline.  Later Fred McLeod was the professional.  Audubon Park was laid out by the Olmsted Bros. after the New Orleans hosted the World’s Fair in 1884.  The golf course was converted to a par 60 executive course in 2002.  The golf course shares space with hundreds of joggers, walkers, cyclist, tourist, students, etc. on a daily basis.  There is also a world class zoo so close that your can hear the lions roar.  A little nerve racking to say the least!   Good luck with your project.

Mark Kiely

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2023, 11:16:14 AM »
Desert Willow Golf Resort in Palm Desert, CA is an unusual muni in that it feels and plays much like any of the surrounding high-end resort courses. There are two Hurdzan-Fry designs (with consultation from John Cook) that opened in the late '90s.
My golf course photo albums on Flickr: https://goo.gl/dWPF9z

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2023, 11:18:16 AM »
Stewart - That looks interesting. I will definitely look into Rackham.


JLahrman -  Avon Fields sounds amazing. Stories like these are what I want to bring to the golf world, and not keep them just local stories.


Tim - I already had Rancho Park and Santa Anita on my list to look at.


Philip - Thank you for the info on Audubon.

Kalen Braley

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2023, 11:18:36 AM »
Rich,

Indian Canyon in Spokane, WA is one to consider.

Designed by Chandler Egan and hosted several USGA events in the past.  The original clubhouse and pro shop still in use, built out of lava rock that is common in the area give it a great old time feel. Its the one course i'm most familiar with that really begs for a restoration, a real gem.




JLahrman

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2023, 11:58:55 AM »
JLahrman -  Avon Fields sounds amazing. Stories like these are what I want to bring to the golf world, and not keep them just local stories.


Rich, I believe (and I think the article mentions) that Avon Fields was the first municipal course west of the Allegheny Mountains. It is a quirky but fun layout, a bit clausterphobic so hardhats are a good idea! In addition it was where most of the Black players around Cincinnati were welcome and learned to play back when things were more segregated. Avon Fields was operated through the city via the Cincinnati Recreation Commission, one of perhaps a half dozen courses. Separately, Hamilton County operates several courses of its own including Sharon Woods which I would consider to be my childhood home course. It's fun to play as well, and Bobby Jones drove the ceremonial first ball back in 1938. But for a unique course with historical relevance Avon Fields would probably be your best bet in Cincinnati.


Thanks for bringing up this topic, I also agree that municipal golf is the heartbeat of golf in the US. Of the meager amount of golf I play, probably 80% of it is at municipal courses. I've found a few good ones here in my new hometown of Grand Rapids MI.


D_Malley

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2023, 12:17:53 PM »
No discussion of American Munis is complete without Cobbs Creek in Philadelphia:

https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,31872.0.html

Might as well add Paxon Hollow:
https://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,70039.0.html

Also, Try Torresdale-Frankford, Walnut Lane, Juniata, FDR and Five Ponds


Rich,
i am happy to give you more info and stories regarding Paxon Hollow
feel free to contact me directly.

D_Malley

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2023, 12:26:08 PM »

Here is one intersting story in regards to Paxon Hollow

The (1940) PGA Championship returned to the Section at the
Hershey Country Club and the Philadelphia Section had seven places to qualify for. The Section qualifying was held at the Paxon Hollow Country Club on the second Monday in August. Ted Turner was the low qualifier with a nine-under-par (69-66) 135. Charlie Sheppard was second with a 136 and Jimmy Thomsonfinished third at 137. Walter Brickley,the professional at the Riverton Country Club,and Bruce Coltarttied for fourth with 138s. Five professionals tied at 139 for the last two qualifying places in their national championship. In an 18-hole playoff the next morning Ed Dudley and George Fazio secured the last two places. Dudleyshot a ten-under-par 62 which was thought to be the lowest competitive round ever shot in the Philadelphia area, pro or amateur, and Fazio’sscore was 65.The three that didn’t make it were Gene Kunes(71), Matt Kowal(73) and Jimmy D’Angelo(74).  Leo Diegelwas exempt as a former PGA champion and Sam Sneadhad an exemption as a member of the Ryder Cup team. Henry Picardwas exempt as the defending champion and the host professional.

interesting side note is that "62" is still the lowest "compeitive" round ever recorded at Paxon Hollow and my father witnessed this first hand as he was caddying for one of the other players in the playoff that day. "Gene Kunes"
« Last Edit: February 19, 2023, 12:29:32 PM by D_Malley »

Philip Caccamise

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2023, 12:26:23 PM »
Rich,


Check out the story of Audubon Golf Course in New Orleans.  It started as a private club in 1899 on leased land in Audubon Park.  The city took over the golf course by the 1920s.  A young prodigy Joe Bartholomew got his start there as did many generations of caddies and players.  The first pro was a Scot named William Stoddard from Brookline.  Later Fred McLeod was the professional.  Audubon Park was laid out by the Olmsted Bros. after the New Orleans hosted the World’s Fair in 1884.  The golf course was converted to a par 60 executive course in 2002.  The golf course shares space with hundreds of joggers, walkers, cyclist, tourist, students, etc. on a daily basis.  There is also a world class zoo so close that your can hear the lions roar.  A little nerve racking to say the least!   Good luck with your project.


Peeking through the trees at Audubon Golf Course from the walking path a few weeks ago. A truly special park and place.



Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2023, 01:07:21 PM »
Walnut Lane in Philadelphia designed by Alex Findlay, par 62, 4510y:

https://golfclubatlas.com/countries/walnut-lane/

After finishing your round, a walk nearby to D'Allesandro's for their famous cheesesteak can't be beat,
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Rich Thomas

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2023, 01:27:22 PM »
Walnut Lane in Philadelphia designed by Alex Findlay, par 62, 4510y:

https://golfclubatlas.com/countries/walnut-lane/

After finishing your round, a walk nearby to D'Allesandro's for their famous cheesesteak can't be beat,




You had me at cheesesteak ;)

Tom_Doak

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Re: The American Muni
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2023, 01:31:54 PM »
There were a lot of stories around Memorial Park from the older guys when we were starting to rebuild the golf course.  Dave Marr practically grew up on the grounds, and rumor has it his ashes were spread there.  Memorial was the place for money games back in that era . . . all of the Texas players knew it well.  Even until just before he died, Doug Sanders was hanging around the practice tee, giving lessons.  Unfortunately, most of those who knew them are going to join them in the beyond, and there aren't many guys around who remember that generation anymore.


But I hope you don't just stick to the courses of architectural interest.  So many of us in the golf business grew up on a muni or we never would have had access to the game.  Everyone thinks Ben Crenshaw was a country-club kid from CC of Austin, but he grew up walking distance from Lions Muni, which he is now trying to save from redevelopment by the University which he attended.

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