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Ben Hollerbach

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Mystery Course Test
« on: January 13, 2023, 02:42:20 PM »
The following video was recorded in the 1970's of a course that had recently completed a renovation.

Mystery Course Test

Any guesses as to what course it is, or who the architect is?
« Last Edit: January 13, 2023, 02:46:28 PM by Ben Hollerbach »

Charlie Goerges

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2023, 02:52:51 PM »
Is that all the longer the clip was or would playing more have given away the course? I'm not good at this sort of thing, so I have no guess. That said, that opening bunker complex looks pretty distinctive, I'm guessing someone should be able to guess it.




Also, I see the director is Steve Sabol, is it he of NFL Films fame?
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Brian Ross

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2023, 03:31:49 PM »
I know this one, but I won't ruin the fun just yet.
Time is but the stream I go a-fishing in.

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Sean_A

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2023, 03:37:05 PM »
I know this one, but I won't ruin the fun just yet.

Is it in NY?

Ciao
New plays planned for 2023: Cardigan, St David's City, Panmure, Kinghorn, Harrogate, Hinckley, Robin Hood & Ladybank

Brian Ross

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2023, 03:38:37 PM »
Time is but the stream I go a-fishing in.

http://www.rossgolfarchitects.com

Sean_A

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2023, 03:48:48 PM »
New plays planned for 2023: Cardigan, St David's City, Panmure, Kinghorn, Harrogate, Hinckley, Robin Hood & Ladybank

Kalen Braley

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2023, 04:40:56 PM »
I'm gonna take a stab at who did the renovation....RTJ.  ;)

Don't recognize the course, but looks like North Carolina terrain.

Tom_Doak

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2023, 07:42:05 PM »
It definitely looks like Trent Jones's work.  Apparently frilly edged bunkers were a thing back then, too.

Matthew Rose

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2023, 09:40:18 PM »
I know it too, but only because I know what event is being covered here.
American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

Billsteele

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2023, 09:16:08 AM »
The film is definitely the work of NFL Films...right down to the narration by John Facenda (who could make the phrase "frozen tundra" compelling). The only thing missing is the distinctive music that they used.

Mike Worth

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2023, 10:27:06 AM »
Most if not all of those listed in the credits are Philly area people.


Based on nothing other than Internet research itís either Metedeconk or Aronimink?

Tom_Doak

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2023, 10:31:43 AM »

Based on nothing other than Internet research itís either Metedeconk or Aronimink?


Metedeconk isn't that old, unless there was an earlier version.  I played it when it was pretty new, around 1990.

Mike Worth

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2023, 10:34:55 AM »

Based on nothing other than Internet research itís either Metedeconk or Aronimink?


Metedeconk isn't that old, unless there was an earlier version.  I played it when it was pretty new, around 1990.


I made an assumption that the video didnít date from the 70s ó that it was a bit newer.


Also itís a mystery game lol

Tommy Williamsen

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2023, 02:16:32 PM »
It looks like Bermuda grass to me. If that is true, it must be in the south.
I'm gonna guess Southern Pines. It looks as hilly and treed. I'm just not sure the bunkers ever looked like that. A second guess is Pinehurst #4
« Last Edit: January 14, 2023, 03:08:16 PM by Tommy Williamsen »
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Ira Fishman

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2023, 03:01:43 PM »
Pinehurst 2?

Greg Krueger

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2023, 03:18:08 PM »
Is it Tangelwood? If so I will be playing it next week!

John Kirk

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2023, 03:20:16 PM »
This is a fun test.  I have no idea.  That sea of sand guarding the direct approach to that first green is way too penal for anybody with a handicap over 15 or so.


Mike Hendren

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2023, 05:16:21 PM »
Was Arnold the original architect?
Two Corinthians walk into a bar ....

Mike Worth

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2023, 05:31:46 PM »
Iím still looking at the Philadelphia connection. Everyone credited in that 30 sec video is from Philly/South Jersey.  Doesnít seem likely that everyone took a golf trip somewhere; so Iím thinking local to Philadelphia.


How about Tavistock?  I havenít played there in a few years but that green looks similar to #12


Second choice is Pinehurst #4


Also Rancocas Woods (Willingboro NJ) was a thought ó but that was not a renovation that was RTJ original work in 1959. I used to play there quite a bit in the 1990s when I first moved to the area but I donít remember any bunker complexes like the ones in the video
« Last Edit: January 14, 2023, 05:40:42 PM by Mike Worth »

hhuffines

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2023, 05:33:54 PM »
Looks dreadful to me. Doesnít make think of NC either.

MCirba

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2023, 05:44:29 PM »
Wild guess from my phone is Doral Blue or Pine Tree.
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Erik J. Barzeski

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2023, 06:14:16 PM »
Tanglewood.

The first hole is #8, formerly #17. The second hole is 14, formerly #5. Both par fives.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2023, 06:18:39 PM by Erik J. Barzeski »
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Matthew Rose

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2023, 09:39:42 PM »
Yep, Tanglewood is right.

The footage is from the official 1974 PGA Championship film, which was done by NFL Films and is to my knowledge the only golf major they have done this for.

The entire thing is actually on Youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ni_UWDTaf8Q&list=PLw4xNppEFcRXmMU8NSmywcq5JFNuBwVrj&index=1

(12 parts)
American-Australian. Trackman Course Guy. Fatalistic sports fan. Drummer. Bass player. Father. Cat lover.

Ben Hollerbach

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2023, 10:22:54 PM »
As pointed out, The answer is Tanglewood Park, and the video is from the 1974 PGA Championship film.

RTJ built Tanglewood in 1958 and then renovated the course in the early 70's in preparation for the PGA Championship. During the renovation very few bunkers were removed or added, but the bunkering style on the original course was starkly different than what he did just a decade later.
What stood out to me, and the generation for this thread, was how "modern" the green contouring and bunkering looked in the highlight film. If the quality of the footage was better It would have be curious to see how many would have placed this course as something that was renovated 5 years ago, vs. 50 years ago.
Was this an oddity in RTJ's portfolio? The '72 PGA was played at RTJ's renovated Oakland hills and the '75 PGA was played at RTJ's Firestone and neither of those courses had bunkering that resembled Tanglewood in '74.



Ian Andrew

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Re: Mystery Course Test
« Reply #24 on: January 15, 2023, 10:53:21 AM »
Ben.


I found an old 1938 brochure from RTJ. It had pictures of Durrand Eastman, Green Lakes, Garden City and Montclair.
What I see in the film feels similar to that dramatic and elaborate bunkering.
I really like his very early work.
We're starting to behave as if we've reached the end of human knowledge. And while that notion is undoubtedly false, the certitude it generates is paralyzing.Ē ó Chuck Klosterman, But What If We're Wrong

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