[MCirba]

Sven,


I'll go through each club/course in coming days and see if I have anything additional.   Thanks.

[MCirba]

Sven,


Two quick questions/observations.   Here is the late Tom MacWood's synopsis of Barker's involvement at Merion based on the contemporaneous info provided from Merion Cricket Club documents unearthed during those long threads;


"Sometime before June 10, Joseph Connell, on his own account, retains H. H. Barker to inspect the Haverford property, sketch the  property and provide a rough lay-out of a course.  On June 10, 1910, Barker inspected the property and submitted a letter, sketch of the property and lay-out of the course to Connell."   



Connell, representing the sellers, offers to sell Merion (paraphrasing) "100 acres, or whatever is needed for the golf course", which is likely his interpretation of what Barker sketched out.   It wasn't until late in June that Rodman Griscom of Merion had CBM and Whigham out to the property for the first time and CBM's subsequent letter to the club discussing a theoretical make-up of an "ideal" 6,000 yard course does not mention Barker.   In any case, if they did recommend Barker, which is certainly possible, there is no other supporting documentation I'm aware of.   

One other quick thing...one of the later articles you posted mentions that Barker was brought to GCGC by "Jerome Travers".   I'm not sure if Travers was a member of the club in 1907...competitive reports list his home club in 1907 as "Montclair".  Might the reporter confused Travers with Travis?

Just some initial thoughts/questions before digging deeper, thanks.

[MCirba]

I wanted to try to do this more systematically (i.e. chronologically) but just as an example of some of why I'm exploring the Travis/Barker architectural relationship/overlap, here's the report on changes to Atlantic City CC in late 1909/early 1910 as reported in the Brooklyn Times Union in April of 1910.

[Sven Nilsen]

It wasn't until late in June that Rodman Griscom of Merion had CBM and Whigham out to the property for the first time and CBM's subsequent letter to the club discussing a theoretical make-up of an "ideal" 6,000 yard course does not mention Barker.   

Correct me if I'm wrong, but nowhere in all those Merion threads is there confirmation of exactly when M&W visited Merion, just that the letter they sent was recorded by the board at a meeting on July 1, 1910.  It is entirely possible [SPECULATION ALERT] that M&W visited before Barker, recommended Barker, Barker visited afterwards, M&W sent a letter to the club (which may not have been written or sent immediately subsequent to their visit) which was recorded in the minutes at the next board meeting.


I don't think there's enough out there right now to confirm or deny the M&W recommending Barker thought.  But it does make some sense, and it opens up a whole line of questions as to what the relationship may have been between the two men and Barker.  They would certainly have known him, and probably played with him at GCGC.  It is possible that CBM and Barker shared ideas relevant to the development of NGLA, or at least CBM discussed his ideas on an ideal course with him.  I would think that Barker would have visited the NGLA site while the course was being built.  It also raises the possibility that Raynor might not have become the force he was if Barker had somehow become CBM's go to guy.  And it definitely raises some question as to what exactly happened at Westhampton

[MCirba]

It wasn't until late in June that Rodman Griscom of Merion had CBM and Whigham out to the property for the first time and CBM's subsequent letter to the club discussing a theoretical make-up of an "ideal" 6,000 yard course does not mention Barker.   

Correct me if I'm wrong, but nowhere in all those Merion threads is there confirmation of exactly when M&W visited Merion, just that the letter they sent was recorded by the board at a meeting on July 1, 1910.  It is entirely possible [SPECULATION ALERT] that M&W visited before Barker, recommended Barker, Barker visited afterwards, M&W sent a letter to the club (which may not have been written or sent immediately subsequent to their visit) which was recorded in the minutes at the next board meeting.


I don't think there's enough out there right now to confirm or deny the M&W recommending Barker thought.  But it does make some sense, and it opens up a whole line of questions as to what the relationship may have been between the two men and Barker.  They would certainly have known him, and probably played with him at GCGC.  It is possible that CBM and Barker shared ideas relevant to the development of NGLA, or at least CBM discussed his ideas on an ideal course with him.  I would think that Barker would have visited the NGLA site while the course was being built.  It also raises the possibility that Raynor might not have become the force he was if Barker had somehow become CBM's go to guy.  And it definitely raises some question as to what exactly happened at Westhampton

Sven,


I'll check the Merion stuff for any further clarity. 


The rest is some interesting, educated speculation as you noted but hopefully I'll have more to come shortly.  Thanks.

[Sven Nilsen]

One other quick thing...one of the later articles you posted mentions that Barker was brought to GCGC by "Jerome Travers".   I'm not sure if Travers was a member of the club in 1907...competitive reports list his home club in 1907 as "Montclair".  Might the reporter confused Travers with Travis?

There are reports of Travers being associated with GCGC in early June of 1907.

[Bret Lawrence]

I don’t have a lot to add to this thread, but I am intrigued by the topic.  Just  a thought: Would Macdonald and Whigham have to be at Merion to recommend Barker, or could they have recommended him prior to their initial visit?


What was the first course Walter Travis routed?

[MCirba]

Bret,


I'll get to the Barker/Merion question later, but to your question about Travis and his earliest courses, I'll shamelessly point you in the direction of the 3-Part IMO articles I wrote a few years back that detail all of his pioneering architectural (and other) work from the late 1890's onward.   Happy to take any follow-up questions, thanks.


Cirba, Mike – Walter J. Travis “Dropped” at National Golf Links of America Truth or Travesty? – Part 1 – Golf Club Atlas


Cirba, Mike – Walter J. Travis “Dropped” at National Golf Links of America Truth or Travesty? – Part 2 – Golf Club Atlas


Cirba, Mike – Walter J. Travis “Dropped” at National Golf Links of America Truth or Travesty? – Part 3 – Golf Club Atlas

[MCirba]

Other than the 1909 "American Golfer" attribution (among others) listing courses Barker designed, I'm having trouble tying him to the Mayfield Club golf course in Cleveland that opened in 1911, still attributed to this day to W.H. "Bert" Way.   News articles from 1911 refer to it as the "new Mayfield" club so any help as regards the Barker attribution is most appreciated, thanks.

[Bret Lawrence]

Mike,


On page 97, Golf Architecture in America written by George Thomas you will see Thomas gave credit to Barker and Way for Mayfield.


It should be noted that Thomas also gives credit to Mackenzie and Hunter for Monterey Peninsula Country Club in his book. Raynor routed the course and Mackenzie and Hunter changed the greens (but not the routing) before it opened, so I am a little surprised Thomas didn’t include Raynor for that course.


Bret

[MCirba]

Thanks, Bret...I see that and also see where Travis mentions encouraging Barker to take up architecture in a 1920 American Golfer article, citing Mayfield as one course Vardon was impressed with during his 1913 visit.   


What is very confusing is that Mayfield seems to have spawned from the uncertainty of lease arrangements for the former Euclid Club which lived on for awhile after Mayfield opened.   I have found no references to the "Mayfield Club" as early as the 1909 American Golfer article that cited the course as the work of Barker and several that cited Mayfield as the work of Bert Way, including his obit.


For what it's worth, George Thomas also listed Kittansett (twice in materials seemingly received from Frederic Hood) as the work of "Wilson, Flynn, and Hood", referring to Hugh Wilson first.   

[Sven Nilsen]

Other than the 1909 "American Golfer" attribution (among others) listing courses Barker designed, I'm having trouble tying him to the Mayfield Club golf course in Cleveland that opened in 1911, still attributed to this day to W.H. "Bert" Way.   News articles from 1911 refer to it as the "new Mayfield" club so any help as regards the Barker attribution is most appreciated, thanks.

Mike:


Attributed by who?  There are a number of sources that attribute it to Way and Barker.


I posted the Dec. 1, 1909 New York Tribune article earlier in the thread noting Barker spent three days in Cleveland routing a course.  Mayfield is the only course that fits.


In addition, there were numerous mentions after the club opened noting it was planned by Barker, including a Jan. 1914 American Golfer Ad in which Barker noted he laid out the course four years ago and a Nov. 1914 American Golfer article noting he designed it.  And here are a Nov. 15, 1914 Philadelphia Inquirer article by Verdant Green and a Dec. 9, 1914 Times Union article both noting he laid it out.

[MCirba]

Thanks, Sven.   


Perhaps I should clarify.   What I'm looking for primarily are contemporaneous, local accounts of the attributions and work as it is progressing.   I've sure you've seen cases where those "retrospective" articles tend to be reiterative of each other, even when partially or wholly inaccurate.   Also, sometimes an architect would come in and stake out a course which then went through multiple iterations and revisions while being constructed.   And finally, much like some architects today, they claim attribution for any course they put together a plan for, even if the course was never built or their changes were never implemented.   


I'm not saying this was the case with Barker, to be clear.   But many of the articles about him read a bit like PR press releases, such as the notion he had laid out more courses than virtually anyone when people like Bendelow and Findlay clearly had much deeper resumes by this time.   Also, I found it interesting to note the whole "professional v. amateur" dichotomy pervasive at that time, and how poorly professionals were treated, such that maintaining one's amateur status was as much protecting one's social standing as any competitive distinction.

[Sven Nilsen]

Thanks, Sven.   


Perhaps I should clarify.   What I'm looking for primarily are contemporaneous, local accounts of the attributions and work as it is progressing.   I've sure you've seen cases where those "retrospective" articles tend to be reiterative of each other, even when partially or wholly inaccurate.   Also, sometimes an architect would come in and stake out a course which then went through multiple iterations and revisions while being constructed.   And finally, much like some architects today, they claim attribution for any course they put together a plan for, even if the course was never built or their changes were never implemented.   


I'm not saying this was the case with Barker, to be clear.   But many of the articles about him read a bit like PR press releases, such as the notion he had laid out more courses than virtually anyone when people like Bendelow and Findlay clearly had much deeper resumes by this time.   Also, I found it interesting to note the whole "professional v. amateur" dichotomy pervasive at that time, and how poorly professionals were treated, such that maintaining one's amateur status was as much protecting one's social standing as any competitive distinction.

Mike:


As far as I'm concerned Barker at Mayfield is settled law.  If Travis allowed it to be printed in American Golfer on multiple occasions a mere three years after the course opened, I don't think there should be any doubt.  (If you want some contemporaneous accounts, I suggest you try to get behind the paywall for the Cleveland Plains Dealer or other local papers.  Ohio is a blind spot for the other bigger newspaper archives.)


Let's not obfuscate the issue any further.


As for the Pro/Am issue, I'm still confused as to what exactly you're trying to get at with respect to Travis.  Do you think Travis was taking money for any design work he did between 1907 and 1915?  Certainly he wouldn't have, the risks were too great for him.  And if that was the case what would have been the harm in letting the press discuss any work that he did?  No one was jeopardizing their amateur status just by doing design work.  CBM, Wilson and a host of others would have had some problems if this was an issue.  None of them would have wanted to jeopardize their access to the clubhouse.


Why would Travis have anything to hide?


Sven

[Sven Nilsen]

What was the first course Walter Travis routed?

According to the Travis Society, WT had five projects under his belt by the time Barker showed up in the US.  [It should be noted that the TS gives him consultation credit on a few other projects where he offered advice, but these were not hands on design work.]


Ekwanok - he assisted J. D. Dunn who laid out the course


Flushing - again assisting JDD


Mt. Pocono - most likely his first routing in 1903


Oakland - with Stewart Gardner, adding 9 holes


Garden City - the ongoing improvements to the course


Travis was much more focused on his playing career in the first decade of the last century.  Any design work was a secondary pursuit, and perhaps even took a back seat to the launch of American Golfer.  I don't think one can easily say that he was an expert in the field at this point.

[MCirba]

What was the first course Walter Travis routed?

According to the Travis Society, WT had five projects under his belt by the time Barker showed up in the US.  [It should be noted that the TS gives him consultation credit on a few other projects where he offered advice, but these were not hands on design work.]


Ekwanok - he assisted J. D. Dunn who laid out the course


Flushing - again assisting JDD


Mt. Pocono - most likely his first routing in 1903


Oakland - with Stewart Gardner, adding 9 holes


Garden City - the ongoing improvements to the course


Travis was much more focused on his playing career in the first decade of the last century.  Any design work was a secondary pursuit, and perhaps even took a back seat to the launch of American Golfer.  I don't think one can easily say that he was an expert in the field at this point.

We'll be updating the Travis Society website over coming months.   I would also disagree with much of the last paragraph here as Travis was a passionate, vocal, active in the field participant in bringing American golf course architecture out of the steeplechase era to "scientific", strategic, "ideal" golf courses as much as Macdonald during these years.

[Sven Nilsen]

"It wasn't until 1916, when he officially retired from amateur golf competition, that his career as a golf course designer fully emerged."

-Ed Homsey 

[Anthony Gholz]

Mike/Sven:


I wouldn't argue about Barker at Mayfield.  I think it happened, but what did he do?  I also think there's still a possibility, for which I have no absolute evidence, that Colt drove by one day and offered advice regarding the bunkering.  The bunkering scheme looks far beyond Bert Way's and could be Colt's or Barker's.  I think its worth holding an open mind on that.


I believe the routing, however, is Way's.



Anthony

[MCirba]

Anthony,


There is no question that Barker did something at Mayfield in 1909 and was likely a routing on the new property during a short stay.  What I'm trying to determine are the details.


Was that routing used?   Or was it like Merion in 1910 where we don't really know for certain (perhaps some was used in portions of the property) but the likely scenario is that it was not as additional study and planning and development took place.


The club's website history states; "Under the leadership of Benjamin E. Bourne and Malcolm B. Johnson, W.H. "Bertie" Way, the former Euclid Club Professional, designed the golf course."


The Encyclopedia of Cleveland History at Case Western Reserve University goes even further, stating, "W.H. Bertie" Way, a former professional at the Euclid Club, searched for, selected, and designed the golf course."


The Golf course opened almost two years after Barker's visit and sadly in 1914 the clubhouse burned down, likely destroying definitive documents detailing the club's origins.


More to come.

[MCirba]

This article unearthed a few months ago by Karl Jensen shows the Akron (OH) Beacon Journal's synopsis of "Bertie" Way's life and golf career.   Both Way and Barker were from England and we know many of the early courses were somewhat collaborative affairs.   Perhaps Way had Barker out to look at the property and work with him on a routing?   I'm also trying to determine if Walter Travis ever played at Mayfield.

[Sven Nilsen]

Mike:


It would be helpful if you could fully source the articles you post.


Thanks,


Sven

[Sven Nilsen]

Mike/Sven:


I wouldn't argue about Barker at Mayfield.  I think it happened, but what did he do? 


I believe the routing, however, is Way's.



Anthony

Anthony:

I'd tend to believe the opposite, that the routing was Barker and the fine-tuning and adjusting were Way.  Here's a 1926 article discussing the origins of the club (although it doesn't meet Mike's demand for contemporaneous accounts, it does a good job of telling the story from a local source).  It is also of interest to note that this was another project where Travis referred Barker.  One of a number from that era where Travis provided the connection, and Barker took on the travel and work.

March 28, 1926 Cleveland Plain Dealer -



The story of Mayfield follows this basic timeline -

Around 1907 - The idea of Mayfield is originated as a replacement for the Euclid Club course when its lease runs out.

July 1909 - Land starts to be purchased for the project.

July 31, 1909 Cleveland Plain Dealer -



Around Sept. 1909 - Barker shows up for a short visit and routes the course, most likely with input from the membership and Bertie Way

Spring 1910 - Work starts on the course under the direction of Bertie Way

April 10, 1910 Cleveland Plain Dealer -



June 5, 1910 Cleveland Plain Dealer -



July 1911 - Course opens

[Sven Nilsen]

One additional note.  For a while, the Ross society had Mayfield as a new 18 hole Ross course with a date of 1935.  This was changed a few years ago in a revision to their listing to an 18 hole remodel with dates of 1911-12.  The most recent version of their listing doesn't contain Mayfield at all.


Ross did work at Mayfield in the fall of 1913 doing a bunkering system.

[MCirba]

Thanks for all of that additional information on Mayfield, Sven.   The holidays and getting back to work have not been helpful to my progress here but hoping to add to your materials here shortly.


Just so folks understand...in no way am I suggesting that Travis was "on the take" financially for Barker's projects.   What I am suggesting is that it was almost unheard of at this time for an "amateur" to be involved in the design of other far-flung clubs and things like travel, lodging, etc. could be viewed as becoming the dreaded "professional" and at various times in his career his detractors levied that charge.   I would add that almost inevitably, all of those early design efforts would be accompanied by a "professional", from Tom Bendelow, to John Duncan Dunn, to Tom Anderson, to Stewart Gardner, and then most prominently, to Herbert Barker after his arrival in the states.


From my IMO piece;  (Sorry for the formatting flotsam and jetsam one gets on a copy and paste on this forum)


It should be noted that the “Walter J. Travis Society” does not believe that there is sufficient contemporaneous evidence of Travis’ design involvement to list Salibury Links as one of his courses at this time. While not entirely conclusive in terms of origin, it seems this speculation may be somewhat moot and misses a larger point. What is undisputable is that at the opening of the new course both Travis and Emmet were in close agreement as to what constituted a soundly designed golf course and those guiding principles of eliminating cross bunkers and instead fashioning “scientific bunkering” to tempt the better player, creating multiple avenues of play to accommodate all classes of golfers, and providing varied and undulating greens were the same ones being advocated by Travis since his 1901 Great Britain visit.
This is not to conclude that Emmet wasn’t similarly inspired by what he observed during his frequent travels abroad. However, it seems from the historical record that Travis was the first to take the lessons of the great historical links abroad, and the words and writings of learned men like John Low and interpret and codify them for an American audience in his writings and then sought practical applications for the realization of those principles on golf courses in the states. He also preached these innovative ideas to his friends and contemporaries at every opportunity.
It is interesting to note that at no time during this period did Travis either mention or promote his design efforts at those courses were he clearly did architectural work between 1897 and 1907, as documented herein. This omission was despite the fact that he wrote extensively for several publications during this period and authored a number of golf-related books. The only exception were those changes he was advocating for at his home club of Garden City, which would have been understandable and acceptable in his role as Captain of the club and Chairman of the Green Committee.
Although this may seem unusual today, when one considers that the USGA rules of “Amateur Standing” were so broadly construed at the time, it’s easy to see how perhaps a comped stay at the Equinox Hotel in Vermont, or rail transportation provided to the Pocono Mountains gratis, or just the loose nature of some of the financial arrangements of these large undertakings could bring one under suspicion and charges of, sin of sins, professionalism! It is also a fact that almost every golf course in America at this time was either laid out by a foreign professional or, a rudimentary affair by club members themselves to bat some balls around a field. Laying out a golf course was largely viewed as a working man’s endeavor, after all, and whether Travis felt he needed professional “cover” to maintain his unsullied amateur status at this time through collaboration with professionals like John Duncan Dunn, Stewart Gardner, Thomas Bendelow, or Tom Anderson is certainly a very real possibility.
Travis was attempting to walk a very fine line as an amateur with his unprecedented attempts to transform American golf course architecture at a time when nearly all “design” work was done by foreign “professionals” who were believed to have an innate talent for the work by virtue of their birthplace and prior exposure to the game abroad. This break from accepted tradition and even class structure was noted in the June, 1906 Brooklyn Daily Eagle” article below. (Author’s note – the article neglects the prior amateur work of men like Macdonald at Chicago, Emmet at Garden City, and Leeds at Myopia but each of those men came from an unassailable patrician background and Travis by this time had already been charged in the press with prior offenses.)
One One also needs to consider that Walter Travis at this time was the greatest amateur golfer in the world and his competitive goals required him to stay an amateur. Not that there weren’t professional tournaments, but those were viewed with much less prestige and even dignity. By now Walter Travis was working for a brokerage firm in New York City, a gentleman about town, and his standing in golf needed to reflect that.
The question of amateur/professional as related to golf course architecture wasn’t fully settled until 1916, when it was determined that it was only the acceptance of money specifically for laying out a golf course, and not just the perimeter associated activities that deemed one a professional. By that time in his life, Walter Travis had given up on his competitive career, and had quit the business world, and became a professional golf course architect for the remainder of his life, along with his related golf and golf publication activities.
But the fact remains that by the end of 1906, Walter Travis had now been involved in the architectural design and planning of more golf courses and more progressively strategic golf courses than any man in America. He had studied the great courses abroad and had come back a convert and a zealot, and a preacher. His revolutionary ideas about eliminating what he saw as the evils of banal, rote golf course design and the elevation of architectural principles consistent with the great courses abroad had now gained broad acceptance from the American golf community (see April 1907 Buffalo Courier article below) and he would soon have a publication of his own to trumpet his strongly held opinions on these and other golf-related matters.

[Niall C]

One also needs to consider that Walter Travis at this time was the greatest amateur golfer in the world

?

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