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Ira Fishman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Current Big 3
« on: June 07, 2022, 11:44:06 AM »
This a riff on the thread about Mike Strantz and Jim Engh that I started yesterday where I had no real experience with their courses  (already learned a lot). I have played a few each of C&C, Doak, and Hanse courses (alphabetical order). Btw, no disrespect to some other architects regarding the subject line, particularly those working primarily overseas, whose work I am not familiar with.


Of the courses I have played, I have them ranked as follows:


Ballyneal
Friarís Head
Bandon Trails
Streamsong Blue
Pacific Dunes
Streamsong Red
Bandon Preserve
Streamsong Black
Old Mac
The Mulligan
Castle Stuart
Kapalua Plantation
Pinehurst 4


A bunch are coin flips particularly through the top half.


For those of you who have played these and/or others, what say you? Clearly my list skews toward C&C and Doak, but the sample size still is small, and I was lucky to play a couple of their better private courses which has not been the case with Hanse courses (yet).


Thanks.


Ira


Jim Hoak

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2022, 11:59:58 AM »
Good list, Ira.
You definitely need to add Sand Hills to make it more complete.
I'm sure you'd love it.

Ira Fishman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2022, 12:15:02 PM »
Jim,


I tried my best last year with a hand written note to Mr. Youngscap. I received a very nice email from the club that they were not allowing unaccompanied guests until 2023 at the earliest.


And I would love to see your ranking of C&C. Doak, and Hanse courses.


Ira

Jim Hoak

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2022, 12:19:05 PM »
I would put Sand Hills, Friar's Head and Pac Dunes tied at the top for the best modern course, but I haven't played the full list you have.

Jim Hoak

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2022, 12:43:59 PM »
I have played a few Hanse redos and think he is terrific, but I don't believe I ever played an original he has done until I recently played the new PGA course in Frisco, which will open soon--and is really good.  What do you like best of his courses?
« Last Edit: June 07, 2022, 02:42:33 PM by Jim Hoak »

Ira Fishman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2022, 02:58:17 PM »
Jim,


My list is in order of my personal likings so SS Black is my favorite Hanse original design so far. It is a bit over the top, but my guess is that is what the developer wanted. There are some really strong holes and overall there is a nice variety among the holes.


I am hoping that his expertise at restorations will extend to Yale which I know is a course important to you. I have not played it in over 40 years, but definitely will get back there post-restoration.


Ira

Joe_Tucholski

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2022, 03:25:15 PM »
Is Hanse really one of the big 3 right now?  Maybe on this board.  I went to the Hanse website and see the first original design listed is LA CC - South.  Anyone know (have guesses) how they differentiate original designs, renovations and restorations?  Folks seem to have a tough time with the Hanse originals because there are relatively few.  I've only played Rustic Canyon. 


If including the courses Hanse has worked on do you include places that Doak consults?


My preference are (all public):
Barnbougle Dunes
Lost Farm
Old MacDonald
Pac Dunes
Dormie Club
Rustic Canyon
Bandon Trails
St. Andrews Beach
Kapalua Plantation
Common Ground
Legends Golf Resort
« Last Edit: June 08, 2022, 11:24:16 AM by Joe_Tucholski »

Jimmy Muratt

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2022, 03:37:26 PM »
Anyone that has doubts on the quality of Hanse's original work should go see Boston Golf Club, Ohoopee Match Club and Caprock Ranch.   In my opinion, all three are among the best modern courses.

Ira Fishman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #8 on: June 09, 2022, 10:39:39 AM »
Anyone that has doubts on the quality of Hanse's original work should go see Boston Golf Club, Ohoopee Match Club and Caprock Ranch.   In my opinion, all three are among the best modern courses.


I have a friend who is a member at Boston Golf who has good appreciation for gca. He loves the course, but he also is a strong player which seems valuable based on looking at the hole-by-hole.


Ira

Tim Martin

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Current Big 3
« Reply #9 on: June 09, 2022, 11:05:37 AM »
Anyone that has doubts on the quality of Hanse's original work should go see Boston Golf Club, Ohoopee Match Club and Caprock Ranch.   In my opinion, all three are among the best modern courses.


I have a friend who is a member at Boston Golf who has good appreciation for gca. He loves the course, but he also is a strong player which seems valuable based on looking at the hole-by-hole.


Ira


After a couple plays on each itís close to a coin flip between Boston GC and Old Sandwich for me. Given one play I like Boston GC.

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