[David Ober]

Played it twice, once in a 25 sustained, 40+ gusts condition, and once in 15/25 conditions.


When it was downwind at 25, gusting to 40+ it just seemed silly, as there was nowhere to hit it that you could control your ball and not run into trouble. At least that was my view that day.


When it was less windy, I lofted a hybrid over the edge of the chasm and was able to stop the ball from running out too far long or left and was left with a pretty simple LW from 70 yards or so.


How does someone who carries it 225 in the air with driver play that hole in that kind of wind?

[Alex Miller]

Played it twice, once in a 25 sustained, 40+ gusts condition, and once in 15/25 conditions.


When it was downwind at 25, gusting to 40+ it just seemed silly, as there was nowhere to hit it that you could control your ball and not run into trouble. At least that was my view that day.


When it was less windy, I lofted a hybrid over the edge of the chasm and was able to stop the ball from running out too far long or left and was left with a pretty simple LW from 70 yards or so.


How does someone who carries it 225 in the air with driver play that hole in that kind of wind?

David - could you clarify? With hybrid you were able to loft it to the upper deck to leave a 70 yard pitch? It's 100+ yards in if you lay back to the lower level.


I don't see why hybrid wouldn't work with more wind if that's the case, just to keep it further left toward the fairway out wide. Hybrid for a front pin and driver for a back pin to run as far down there as possible to get around the greenside bunker.

[Sven Nilsen]

Its an 180 yard carry over the sandy ridge to the safe zone (well left of the flag) from the green tees.  If someone carries driver 225, they should probably hit 3 wood.  They'll end up short of pin high (which is around 275) in the sweet spot of the fairway.  Even if you hit driver, there's still plenty of room to run out on that line even in a big wind.


With a 225 yard carry, if you wanted to get risky you could try to play a fade that works back towards the left edge of the green.  Its a 200 yard carry on that line, and you have space all the way through the 17th tee if you get past the green.



From your description, I don't think you have a very good handle on the hole. 


There were a number of shots into that hole yesterday during the US AM that demonstrated the different options.  Most players were laying up to the left.  One shot took the left edge approach and fed perfectly onto the green.  Another player carried it on the direct line to the front edge and held the green.  If he had carried it two feet further he was probably off the back.


The hardest shot on the hole is the approach.  You have to match the shot shape to the angle of attach and the distance you play.  Anything moving with the wind is probably going to run through the green.

[David Ober]

Its an 180 yard carry over the sandy ridge to the safe zone (well left of the flag) from the green tees.  If someone carries driver 225, they should probably hit 3 wood.  They'll end up short of pin high (which is around 275) in the sweet spot of the fairway.  Even if you hit driver, there's still plenty of room to run out on that line even in a big wind.


With a 225 yard carry, if you wanted to get risky you could try to play a fade that works back towards the left edge of the green.  Its a 200 yard carry on that line, and you have space all the way through the 17th tee if you get past the green.



From your description, I don't think you have a very good handle on the hole. 


There were a number of shots into that hole yesterday during the US AM that demonstrated the different options.  Most players were laying up to the left.  One shot took the left edge approach and fed perfectly onto the green.  Another player carried it on the direct line to the front edge and held the green.  If he had carried it two feet further he was probably off the back.


The hardest shot on the hole is the approach.  You have to match the shot shape to the angle of attach and the distance you play.  Anything moving with the wind is probably going to run through the green.

Yeah, I honestly don't think I do have a good handle on it. The left lay-up seemed ... not prudent. But maybe it is. Is that the "safe" play? Seemed fraught over there, too.

[David Ober]

Played it twice, once in a 25 sustained, 40+ gusts condition, and once in 15/25 conditions.


When it was downwind at 25, gusting to 40+ it just seemed silly, as there was nowhere to hit it that you could control your ball and not run into trouble. At least that was my view that day.


When it was less windy, I lofted a hybrid over the edge of the chasm and was able to stop the ball from running out too far long or left and was left with a pretty simple LW from 70 yards or so.


How does someone who carries it 225 in the air with driver play that hole in that kind of wind?

David - could you clarify? With hybrid you were able to loft it to the upper deck to leave a 70 yard pitch? It's 100+ yards in if you lay back to the lower level.


I don't see why hybrid wouldn't work with more wind if that's the case, just to keep it further left toward the fairway out wide. Hybrid for a front pin and driver for a back pin to run as far down there as possible to get around the greenside bunker.

Yes, I was able to loft it to the upper level with hybrid and leave me 70. I think I just completely discounted the "lower level" because it kind of seemed penal. But I never went down there. LOL

[Kalen Braley]

David,


I use Google Earth to take the following measurements per Sven's post.

[Matt_Cohn]

Justin Leonard just described 16 as, "There are lots of great options—actually there are a lot of options, I'm not sure if any of them are great."

[David Ober]

Justin Leonard just described 16 as, "There are lots of great options—actually there are a lot of options, I'm not sure if any of them are great."

Was just watching that! LOL


I think I didn't have the correct yardage is when I first played it. We were playing it in an almost identical wind today.

[Sven Nilsen]

Justin Leonard just described 16 as, "There are lots of great options—actually there are a lot of options, I'm not sure if any of them are great."

And he's not even considering what the hole plays like in the winter.

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