[Brad Tufts]

https://www.golfadvisor.com/photo-galleries/ozarks-national-at-big-cedar-lodge-hole-by-hole


Looks pretty cool, with commentary from our own Tim Gavrich!


BCL looks to be climbing the ladder as a golf destination...can't help thinking of flights being filled with a combo of Dollywood types and golf junkies, might be fun.

[PCCraig]

Honestly, it looks like a Tom Fazio course.

[Peter Pallotta]

Honestly, it looks like a Tom Fazio course.

A good job by Tim, but to me it looks like a C&C course, though I can't tell you which one..

I'm hardly ever critical of architects (specifically, by name) around here, but since Bill C's reputation won't be hurt by my two cents: I can't think of another architect whose style has become so 'settled'.

It may be that the sites he chooses (or are chosen for him) to work on are all remarkably similar, but other than Trinity Forest I can't think of the last time he seemed to challenge himself (or was challenged by) a site and/or approach that was outside either his own comfort zone or anyone else's.

Of course, he's long ago earned the right to do whatever he pleases.

[Matthew Petersen]

Strong echoes of Kapalua to me, the way many of the holes ride strong slopes with what looks like a canyon falling off to the other side.

[Brad Tufts]

Having not been there I can only comment on pictures, but it looks different considering so much C&C work is on sand and this one is not.  The ridge presentation seems to lend itself to some nice views...so much so that I'm surprised the name didn't have Ridge in it...

[Daryl David]

Meh. Not that interesting. Cart paths look horrible.

[Ryan Hillenbrand]

Can't seem to open the link, but as a Missourah'n I'm looking forward to having a C&C course nearby. Supposed to open for play in November.

I too am surprised on the name, originally it was going to be called Buffalo Ridge - Valley, to compliment Buffalo Ridge - Springs. There's already an Osage National in Lake of the Ozarks. Confusing.

It's shaping up to be a great golf facility. The accommodations at Big Cedar Lodge are fantastic, equal to IMO Pebble Beach and Kohler, without the ocean or Lake Michigan, and more family friendly.

[Brad Tufts]

Fixed the link, hopefully!

[Tim Gavrich]

Thanks for posting, Brad. I really enjoyed playing the course and think it will only improve as the fairway turf matures, firms up and is able to be mowed tighter.


Pat, interesting that you say it looks like a Fazio course. It might have been the expansiveness of the zoysia turf footprint and the general scale, but I found myself thinking about Alotian at times while playing Ozarks National.


Interesting how certain things crop up in photo tours of courses. I really didn't find the cart paths obstrusive in the slightest while playing the course, but I can see that they do peek out in places in photos.


I think Ozarks National will surprise a lot of golfers, especially since it will likely be the first C&C course a lot of resort guests play. There's a cerebral side to playing a lot of these modern architects' courses, and I think some of the strategic demands will take some getting used to. You need to think actively and puzzle out some of the holes and shots in a way that is less of a focus at other resort courses.


FWIW, given where Ozarks National is situated, I don't think "Valley" would have fit as an alternate name for the course. The new TW course being built will be called Payne's Valley, which does appear to be an apt name.

[Peter Flory]

Strong echoes of Kapalua to me, the way many of the holes ride strong slopes with what looks like a canyon falling off to the other side.

That was exactly what came to my mind when I went through the picture tour.  I thought I'd be the only one to see it that way. 

[Rob Rigg]

Is this track cart ball AF or what?
Looks more Fazio than Kapalua to me from the pics but totally understand that thought.

Not as visually appealing as many of C&C's courses. Only gonna get better looking with time though. Wouldn't say it was a mail in but I'm not seeing an effort at genius.

Evan Schiller posted some pics that look tight and quite a few of those holes look like they'd be fun to have a crack at.

Location doesn't seem super easy to get to unless you're rolling private iron?

[Tom_Doak]

Is this track cart ball AF or what?
Looks more Fazio than Kapalua to me from the pics but totally understand that thought.

Not as visually appealing as many of C&C's courses. Only gonna get better looking with time though. Wouldn't say it was a mail in but I'm not seeing an effort at genius.

Evan Schiller posted some pics that look tight and quite a few of those holes look like they'd be fun to have a crack at.

Location doesn't seem super easy to get to unless you're rolling private iron?

Rob:


How are you, man?


Was this a deliberate imitation of an old Matt Ward review or did it just come out that way?

[Tim Gavrich]

Is this track cart ball AF or what?
Looks more Fazio than Kapalua to me from the pics but totally understand that thought.

Not as visually appealing as many of C&C's courses. Only gonna get better looking with time though. Wouldn't say it was a mail in but I'm not seeing an effort at genius.

Evan Schiller posted some pics that look tight and quite a few of those holes look like they'd be fun to have a crack at.

Location doesn't seem super easy to get to unless you're rolling private iron?

Robb--


The course will be very walkable. I didn't detect any mail-in holes - every single one is interesting, and 12 is one of the most thrilling long par-3 tee shots I've ever confronted. The short par-4 fifth is brilliant as well. I can imagine the exceptionally well-traveled golfer to be less enthused about this course, but for several visitors it will be among the most interesting courses they will ever play.


It's an hour from Springfield, MO's airport, which is itself accessible from several major cities. And Branson has a small airport that has flights from Frontier. That airport is a five-minute drive from Ozarks National.

[Joel_Stewart]

Bill Coore seems obsessed with Zoysia grass?  Perhaps this should be a subject on itself.


He used it at Trinity Forest and now he's  pushing for it on a new project in Northern California against an agronomist recommendation.


Hope it works.

[Anthony_Nysse]

Bill Coore seems obsessed with Zoysia grass?  Perhaps this should be a subject on itself.


He used it at Trinity Forest and now he's  pushing for it on a new project in Northern California against an agronomist recommendation.


Hope it works.

In the both the DFW and Missouri, zoysia is very commonly used on middle to higher end clubs. Im not so sure Northern CA is a good spot for it, though.

[Rob Rigg]

Is this track cart ball AF or what?
Looks more Fazio than Kapalua to me from the pics but totally understand that thought.

Not as visually appealing as many of C&C's courses. Only gonna get better looking with time though. Wouldn't say it was a mail in but I'm not seeing an effort at genius.

Evan Schiller posted some pics that look tight and quite a few of those holes look like they'd be fun to have a crack at.

Location doesn't seem super easy to get to unless you're rolling private iron?

Rob:


How are you, man?


Was this a deliberate imitation of an old Matt Ward review or did it just come out that way?

Hi Tom,
I'm super bueno - Hope you are awesome as well!
I was hoping to throw something out there that was kind of Thursday evening amusing so if it ended up hitting that Matt Ward level of commentary I guess I sort of ticked the box.

Tim - Thanks for the response! Great to hear that's it's totally walkable despite a lot of movement to the land. I saw the carts and worried that the Green to Tee transfers could be painful.

Probably a tough call for someone like me to get there from the Upper Left but the scenery is amazing and from your review/response it sounds like the course has a lot of interesting holes as well.

A walkable Kapalua fun factor experience will make most golfers leave with a big smile.

[Jim_Kennedy]

jad·ed

ˈjādəd/

adjective





tired, bored, or lacking enthusiasm, typically after having had too much of something.







...is the only way to describe the negative commentary about this course.

[Jaeger Kovich]

Is this track cart ball AF or what?
Looks more Fazio than Kapalua to me from the pics but totally understand that thought.

So a friend pointed out that it couldn't possibly be Fazio because you can see the cart paths!!!


Glad you are super bueno!- J

[Buck Wolter]

This looks pretty good to me  -super bueno even

[Rob Rigg]

On the short par 5 11th - Doesn't it seem strange that the pine was kept around to influence the hole, especially with the bunker perched behind it? There were a lot of pines they worked around in Tahoe but I don't recall any standing out like that.

Have C&C used trees to influence the direction of play on a course before? Seems out of character doesn't it? There is obviously plenty of space to the right so was it left there for an aesthetic reason or does it make sense to anyone who has played the course to keep it around? Living in the PNW it's easy to get frustrated with trees influencing play . . .

I'd agree that the par 3 8th does look super bueno, it's a very pretty hole making use of the vista and could be fun AF if you can hit it long with the right pin and watch the ball roll back onto the putting surface. I'd say that it's a hole that the Faz would have found - and will admire - but it's likely people will take that negatively which wouldn't be the intention at all.

Hope you are super bueno as well J! You've been doing some great work!

Indeed, the cart path visuals on a couple pics had my eyes like  . Glad to hear that it's walkable for those who choose to do so.

[Tim Gavrich]

On the short par 5 11th - Doesn't it seem strange that the pine was kept around to influence the hole, especially with the bunker perched behind it? There were a lot of pines they worked around in Tahoe but I don't recall any standing out like that.

Have C&C used trees to influence the direction of play on a course before? Seems out of character doesn't it? There is obviously plenty of space to the right so was it left there for an aesthetic reason or does it make sense to anyone who has played the course to keep it around? Living in the PNW it's easy to get frustrated with trees influencing play . . .

Robb--


That photo may be a little misleading; it was taken from right of the fairway so it makes the bunker look more in line with that tree than it really is. It's actually a centerline tree, which encourages a tee shot to either of the margins. The bunker is a carry bunker that sits on the left side of the hole if you're marching straight from tee to green. I hit my tee shot down the left edge of the fairway, quite by accident, but ended up with the perfect angle from which to go for the green in two. The tree wasn't an issue, nor would it be for a player making the 11th a three-shot hole by hitting a tee ball up the right side of the hole. I know centerline trees are somewhat controversial but I think this one works nicely.





Here's a crummy but instructive photo from the 11th tee. The tree from the other photo is the second one along. As you can see, there's actually a second tree that further complicates the playing of the hole. Not knowing exactly how to play the hole, I took the bunkers on the right to be a cue for me to drive it up the right. I hit a huge block about 60 yards left, over that first tree, that gave me a direct look at the green from the left side. A golfer who takes a tee shot over the first tree and down the left is rewarded with the chance to get there in two. Drives up the right are okay, too - it's just the basis for the three-shot strategy for the hole.

[Matt Kardash]

I feel like this is practically a C&C template par 3. I feel like I have seem them do this exact hole many times.

This looks pretty good to me  -super bueno even

[Josh Tarble]

I haven't seen much chatter about this course...tried using the search function so apologies if I missed another thread.


I just wanted to say that this course might go on my all-time "exceeded expectations" list and really high on my list in general.  Every fan of golf architecture should try to play this course.  In my mind, it make Big Cedar a must-visit destination for golf fans.  The golf infrastructure isn't quite up to standards (in comparison to other golf-specific destinations), but that's for another thread.


I cannot believe what C&C were able to accomplish at Ozark National.  In my opinion it could be their best work (not best course, but most impressive design) due to the nature of the land and what they built.  Just judging what is there, Ozark National stands up to the best of C&C.  Just to compare two recent designs, I played Ozark National and Sand Valley very close together, and thought Ozark National to be far superior.


The design is really walkable, with a great, intertwined routing.  That is probably the most impressive aspect given it's basically a mountain course.  The holes are varied, some great strategy, and fairly playable.  Playability is probably my main issue with the course, the maintenance makes the edges of the native super thick, while a couple feet into it is much thinner, almost playable.  I'm sure they'll get that figured out though.  One other unique aspect is that holes 13 - 18 feature all par 4s and just one par three (17).  Some may be critical of that aspect/lack of variety, but I thought it speaks to the variety of the design in that none of the par 4s feel similar or repetitive. Plus a few are some of the most visually attractive holes in the midwest.  Overall, it is tough, but the fairways are plenty wide and give you a preferred side to target.  And the greens are large targets.


The course is unlike many in the C&C portfolio and very different from most courses in general.  It really is in the top echelon of courses in my eyes, everyone should make the effort to see it.

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