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Joel_Stewart

  • Karma: +0/-0
A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« on: April 23, 2003, 09:14:43 AM »
The new Links Magazine arrived yesterday filled with more ads and real estate articles then ever before.

I noticed on page 105 and ad for a new line of 18th century Persian and floral motif rugs designed by Jack and Barbara Nicklaus.  They are 100 wool and took Jack and Barb over 1 year to design.  

Next month I hoping that the new Nicklaus line of wallpaper, and draperies will be introduced.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

CHrisB

Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2003, 09:21:06 AM »
18th century??!!

I knew Jack was old but I didn't realize he was that old!  If he and Barbara made these rugs in the 18th century then why did they wait so long to sell them?

Look for Arnold Palmer to come out with his line of ancient pottery any day now...

 ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2003, 09:24:26 AM »
There is always such an odd dicotomy of what Jack has done in his career, and what he has said in his commentary about various issues of classic course designs and renovations and equipment issues which are right on correct, and what he actually designs and business practices and products he hustles.  :-/   He is a study in contradictions.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2003, 09:36:30 AM »
Perhaps Jack's greatest contradiction is the enormous success he has had on the golf course vs. the significant business failures he has had off the course. The publicly traded company he sponsored in the 1990's was a disaster (I should know, I held shares that went to zero!) and I recall reading that his win of the Masters in 1986 was very timely in generating enough buzz to keep several of his business ventures at that time from going bankrupt.
When it comes to business, Jack ain't no Greg Norman!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2003, 09:50:11 AM »
But, at the end of the day, if all the "appearances" about Jack being the great family man are true and not some public relations scheme, then all the rest of it is secondary and not the defining aspects of ones life.  While it generally helps to have a career that has generated so much money inandout, it is also a great detriment for a person to maintain strong family ties under such conditions of fame, time demands, and noteriety.  If he has done that, I say good on him.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

John_Conley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2003, 10:16:30 AM »
Dave Tepper:

I think you have it backward.  Jack is a pretty astute person in that any business worth having was kept for himself and anything tougher to operate - even with his name attached - wound up in the publicly traded (Other People's Money) pile.  

Equipment?  Apparel?  It isn't like Nicklaus was alone in having a failed business.  Golf Design?  Pretty easy to make money with, so I think I'll keep that to myself.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

JohnV

Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #6 on: April 23, 2003, 10:21:01 AM »
Also today came news that Jack has sued Wilson Sporting Goods for selling a golf ball named "Jack".  I guess he owns the name just like Al Davis owns all representations of pirate symbols in California.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

George Pazin

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Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #7 on: April 23, 2003, 11:10:11 AM »

Quote
Golf Design?  Pretty easy to make money with, so I think I'll keep that to myself.


I always knew all those complaining archies were lying. ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
Big drivers and hot balls are the product of golf course design that rewards the hit one far then hit one high strategy.  Shinny showed everyone how to take care of this whole technology dilemma. - Pat Brockwell, 6/24/04

David_Tepper

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2003, 11:31:30 AM »
John Conley-

You may very well be correct. However, I distinctly remeber reading that Nicklaus was skating on VERY thin ice financially in the mid 1980's. I think he was on the hook for the St. Andrews golf course development in Westchester County, NY when the economy went south back then.  I know Golf World ran an article highlighting his history of business problems several years ago. The traits that made him a great golfer (ego, self-confidence, pride, etc.) made him a poor businessman. He was a bit of a know-it-all and was not inclined to ask for or take advice.
I also believe that Nicklaus has created and held on to several of his businesses in order to provide job opportunities for his sons. There is nothing wrong with nepotism provided it is not paid for from someone else's pocket!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

A.G._Crockett

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2003, 12:40:35 PM »
O.K., everybody who believes that Jack actually spent even one instant during the last year designing rugs raise your hand.

Anyone?
Anyone?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"Golf...is usually played with the outward appearance of great dignity.  It is, nevertheless, a game of considerable passion, either of the explosive type, or that which burns inwardly and sears the soul."      Bobby Jones

Carlyle Rood

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Nicklaus unsuccessful?
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2003, 06:04:29 PM »
Most of the genuinely successful (and wealthy) people I know have had several setbacks in business.  Many millionaires flirt with bankruptcy.  It's inherent in business.  Part of growing wealth requires risk-taking.

Nicklaus has had a few businesses falter; but, he keeps resurrecting them.  He's got remarkable resilience.

I'm not getting on this bandwagon.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2003, 07:39:23 PM »
JohnV,
"Bobby","Byron", "Arnie", "Ben",- put any of those names in context with golf and whom do you think of?
I'm sure Wilson will have no problem changing the name of their ball now that they've garnered the free publicity.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Tommy_Naccarato

Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2003, 07:49:14 PM »
What ALL of us are not noticing is the two very excellent articles by Geoff Shackelford in that issue.

Geoff's review of Rancho Sante Fe is not only information filled with Max Behr quotes, hopefully it will be a sign of things to come from the magazine. His other article is on Championship Course Set-ups, and it is not only food for thought, but how bizarre it has become.

Great job Geoff.


« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

tyelder

Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2003, 06:13:20 AM »
That's a Shaw rug. It should be endorsed by Fazio.

Seriously, If you get a chance to play Mr. Shaw's course, I would highly recommend doing so. If you enjoy 18" putts that make your knees buckle, you will like The Farm.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

Lou_Duran

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A new low for Jack Nicklaus
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2003, 07:01:04 AM »
If Jack Nicklaus is able to endorse some home products and people are willing to buy them, what is the man doing wrong?  How is this low?  Perhaps Jack has some skills, interest, and tastes in this area.  The story we heard in Columbus when Muirfield Village was being built is that he was involved in every facet, including choosing the colors of wall and floor coverings, china, and silverware.

As Carlyle points out, his failures in some businesses are not at all unusual for an entreprenuer that's out there risking his capital.  In fact, in this area, Jack is probably unusual in that he actually put considerable amounts of his own money into some deals.  Some of you may think that this is a sign of a poor businessman; I think that he is an honest guy who believes in what he is doing.

Recently, I read in the paper about a local developer who is aggresively buying vineyards north of San Francisco.  Apparently, he is spending $40,000+ per acre for land on severe slopes, a price that was thought to be well above market.  The writer though focused on how the developer had done over a billion in real estate deals, and how savvy he was in these wine country acquisitions.   Somehow, the story was left out of how this guy had walked out on several thousand apartment units that he "paid" with others people's money more than double what they were worth (getting all sorts of fees along the way, which he protected through fancy lawyering).  Nicklaus gets involved in a few bad deals, despite all he has done, he is considered to be a business failure?  We should all be such failures.

No one is perfect.  But from everything I've seen, Jack Nicklaus has comported himself with honor and unusual grace.  So what if a few of his much lesser peers made jealous remarks about him.  Nicklaus has voiced strong opinions which some have criticized him for.  I have followed his career closely, and I can't remember a single instance where I disagreed strongly about what he said.  I have been around him on numerous occasions, and not once did I observe him acting in any way that is distasteful or unbecoming a man of his stature.  More importantly, I know people who are intimate friends of the man, and, without exception, they have nothing but respect and affection for him.  In fact, the only thing that I've ever heard about him that can be construed as a negative is that he likes to kid his friends and gets a little heavy-handed sometimes doing in.

We need heroes and role models today, and Jack is one of mine.  He can endorse all the rugs he wants, and all the more power to him if he can make a couple of bucks.  And if I see one that I like and can afford, maybe I'll buy it.  I hope that he keeps creating businesses which will be turned over to his kids, and his kids' kids.  I hope that he keeps building golf courses and that I have the good fortune to play a few of them.
    
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »

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