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David_Tepper

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #100 on: July 28, 2015, 10:56:41 PM »
"BTW  Isn't the bunkering on the parallel hole beautiful!"

Jim C. -

Not sure about beautiful, but it sure is plentiful. ;)

DT

Pete_Pittock

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #101 on: July 28, 2015, 11:02:01 PM »
I think it the two trees on the left in front of the runway tees. Golfers have to aim too far to the right.

In all seriousness, what about a house which was positioned not in a landing area, but is now in the LZ because of improvements in technology, coaching, etc.? He hasn't moved, but the nuisance came to him.

mike_beene

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #102 on: July 29, 2015, 12:24:13 AM »
Many years ago I represented the Dallas Athletic Club in a case brought by adjoining homeowners after Nicklaus redesigned the course(the redesign made it safer, actually). Somewhere out there is an appellate court opinion with DAC in the name of the case. In researching the matter, I recall a nice Ohio opinion where the justices took shots at each other's propensity to spray the ball.

Jon Cavalier

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #103 on: July 29, 2015, 01:32:15 AM »
Mike:

That's great stuff. Looks like your case was Malouf v. Dallas Athletic Club, 837 S.W.2d 674 (Tx. App. 1992).

The Ohio case you referenced appears to be Patton v. Westwood Country Club, 18 Ohio App.2d 13 (1969), in which the court noted: "One nationally known amateur, Judge Don C. Miller, of Notre Dame's famed ‘Four Horsemen,’ employs such an educated slice regularly. It is a matter of common knowledge that he can curl a drive around a Thujopsis dolobrata one hundred and fifty yards out and split the fairway ahead of it. This is one of his things of life. An uneducated slice apparently is a thing of life for some Westwood members or guests."

For what it's worth, the Malouf court ruled for the golf course and held that the plaintiff failed to prove trespass or negligent redesign (though from a GCA standpoint, the latter is debatable), and the Patton court held that the homeowner, who bought the property and built the house despite knowing that a golf course abutted her land, had come to the nuisance and was not entitled to injunctive relief.
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Rich Goodale

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #104 on: July 29, 2015, 02:33:09 AM »
Wayne,
 
Thanks for posting that, that surely explains it, he's right in the slice zone.  I'm not surprised he gets 60 balls per month in his yard based on that configuration....

That property is not in the "slice" zone, it is in the "shank" zone, and how many golfers are skilled enough to hit a shank with their driver?
Life is good.

Any afterlife is unlikely and/or dodgy.

Jean-Paul Parodi

mike_beene

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #105 on: July 30, 2015, 12:49:35 AM »
Jon, those are the cases. I played the Gold course at the DAC a few times last year during my home course renovation. It occurred to me that the bushes down the 6th hole( I think) survived because we won. I hadn't thought about the case in years. I always aim way left there because it would be too ironic to hit one of the houses even if it's been 20 something years.

Wayne_Kozun

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #106 on: July 30, 2015, 01:38:55 PM »
"One nationally known amateur, Judge Don C. Miller, of Notre Dame's famed ‘Four Horsemen,’ employs such an educated slice regularly. It is a matter of common knowledge that he can curl a drive around a Thujopsis dolobrata one hundred and fifty yards out and split the fairway ahead of it. This is one of his things of life. An uneducated slice apparently is a thing of life for some Westwood members or guests."
Anyone know the backstory to this?  What was the relationship between the Judge(s) that wrote this decision and the learned Judge Miller?  It seems like they have a bit of a sense of humour!

Bob Montle

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #107 on: July 30, 2015, 03:46:58 PM »


That property is not in the "slice" zone, it is in the "shank" zone, and how many golfers are skilled enough to hit a shank with their driver?

Me!   Me!
I can do that!
"If you're the swearing type, golf will give you plenty to swear about.  If you're the type to get down on yourself, you'll have ample opportunities to get depressed.  If you like to stop and smell the roses, here's your chance.  Golf never judges; it just brings out who you are."

Steve_ Shaffer

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« Last Edit: October 12, 2016, 09:08:08 PM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #109 on: March 14, 2016, 09:23:25 AM »
Trial recently started on assessment of damages. Stay tuned.
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

jeffwarne

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #110 on: March 14, 2016, 10:48:25 AM »

   ... and is now using a BS theory and idiot judges to help him try to scramble his way out of his own crappy timing at somebody else's expense.


happens every day.
Justices quite often don't do "justice"
and even if you win, it's still time and money expensive
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Jon Cavalier

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #111 on: March 15, 2016, 12:24:02 AM »
Trial recently started on assessment of damages. Stay tuned.

Thanks for the update, Steve. Looking forward to seeing how this plays out.

Does the fact that the issue is damages mean that injunctive relief (i.e., an order to modify the hole) is off the table?
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Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #112 on: March 16, 2016, 08:01:23 PM »
This was a non-jury trial. Testimony concluded today after about 2 weeks. The transcript will be furnished to both sides around April 2. The court directed the filing of a post trial memorandum by each side (maximum 20 pages in length, not including addendum material) within 45 days of the receipt of the transcript and reply briefs no later then 5 days thereafter. The Court should then issue its decision within 90 days of receipt of the reply briefs. It looks like it will be sometime in September for the Trial Court's decision. Stay tuned.
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Jim_Coleman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #113 on: July 14, 2016, 08:58:13 PM »
    Returned to Quaker Ridge yesterday.  Still no change.  Played hole #2 from 275 yards.  The law is an ass.

Steve_ Shaffer

  • Karma: +0/-0
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Jim_Coleman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #115 on: October 12, 2016, 11:18:03 PM »
Faith renewed!

Jon Cavalier

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #116 on: October 14, 2016, 02:40:01 AM »
At last.... a decision:

Homeowner loses!!!

http://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/scarsdale/2016/10/12/quaker-ridge-must-pay-homeowners-7k-stray-golf-balls/91905444/

Excellent. Sounds like the judge got it right.

A question: Was there any injunctive relief awarded (i.e., will the hole remain shortened to 275yds)?

Thanks for keeping us updated on this Steve - an interesting legal issue for sure. 
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jeffwarne

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Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #117 on: October 18, 2016, 10:40:02 PM »
If I were a member, with this resolved (for the moment) it would be difficult for me to refrain from firing a ball over the net.......
"Let's slow the damned greens down a bit, not take the character out of them." Tom Doak
"Take their focus off the grass and put it squarely on interesting golf." Don Mahaffey

Sean_A

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: A Golf Course Can Be A Nuisance
« Reply #118 on: October 19, 2016, 03:52:05 AM »
At last.... a decision:

Homeowner loses!!!

http://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/scarsdale/2016/10/12/quaker-ridge-must-pay-homeowners-7k-stray-golf-balls/91905444/


??? It sounds to like a compromise from where I am standing.  Both sides did things to mitigate what was clearly a problem. There was no way a judge was going to award $3.7 Million, but if one is going to court why not shoot for the sky?  That said, in time, this idea 3-5 golf ball bombarding an adjacent property on any given day will not be tolerated because its insanely dangerous...wait and see folks.

Ciao
New plays planned for 2023: Cardigan, St David's City, Panmure, Kinghorn, Harrogate, Hinckley, Robin Hood & Ladybank

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