GolfClubAtlas.com > Golf Course Architecture
Keiser's Coul Links Project (Embo/Dornoch)
Jud_T:
--- Quote from: Kris Shreiner on May 01, 2016, 01:43:44 PM ---Niall,
I want to respect the process. When do they ever say no when that economic gain is in play?
Cheers,
Kris
--- End quote ---
Kris,
Most species would be a lot better off if we wiped humans off the planet. You obviously have an axe to grind here. I know nothing of the site, and at the end of the day you may in fact be right that it is a special spot which should remain untouched. Keiser has been through this before, i.e. Bandon etc., and if there is a chance of doing something which can coexist and perhaps even give some funds back to help protect species, dunes etc. while helping the local area economically and building a low impact course, I'd suggest he may be the best candidate to do so. The cynic would say better him than someone else. I'm going to reserve judgement till the process unfolds. One would hope that lessons were learned from the Trump course and if mistakes were made there they would not be repeated here. Yes, Keiser is another rich guy who's likely used to getting what he wants, but the difference appears to be that he's not simply a real estate spiv looking to make a buck at all costs (maybe he can promise a huge hotel component with his name emblazoned in gold blinking lights!), but rather a guy who simply wants to build great courses on great sites and is not purely motivated by economics at this point in his career. This difference is not trivial.
BHoover:
--- Quote from: Dave McCollum on May 03, 2016, 11:00:04 AM ---There is a golf course in Yosemite at Wawona.
--- End quote ---
I stand corrected. Although, I prefer that golf courses and other developments stay out of national parks, national forests, etc. Obviously, not everyone agrees with me on this, and that's fine. But I still stand by my statement that there are certain places that should remain raw, natural spaces.
The national parks in this country also were intended as a place for the general public to enjoy nature. So if a golf course is built in these places, it ought to be easily accessible by all. There are other places for high-end destination courses. National parks are not those places, in my opinion.
Mark Bourgeois:
--- Quote from: Brian Hoover on May 03, 2016, 11:10:55 AM ---
--- Quote from: Dave McCollum on May 03, 2016, 11:00:04 AM ---There is a golf course in Yosemite at Wawona.
--- End quote ---
I stand corrected. Although, I prefer that golf courses and other developments stay out of national parks, national forests, etc. Obviously, not everyone agrees with me on this, and that's fine. But I still stand by my statement that there are certain places that should remain raw, natural spaces.
The national parks in this country also were intended as a place for the general public to enjoy nature. So if a golf course is built in these places, it ought to be easily accessible by all. There are other places for high-end destination courses. National parks are not those places, in my opinion.
--- End quote ---
Yosemite isn't the only one. Highland Links on Cape Cod and Furnace Creek in Death Valley come to mind. Jeez now that I think about it there are at least three in DC national parks alone. Rock Creek, Langston and East Potomac -- heck, if you were of a mind you could nail the NPS's national HQ from the White course.
Obviously the NPS believes golf is an important part of our national parks experience.
Dave McCollum:
Maybe some of our NPS employees and their families like to golf. I tried to make the point that golf and wildlife are not necessarily incompatible, but I really don't know squat about Coul, so concluded just to be an observer of the process. Having been involved in many land use and environmental debates and dealings with USA regulatory agencies, I'm pretty cynical about many things. I wish the good folks of Scotland and the Dornoch area the best in working this out.
Tom_Doak:
I'm not suggesting that we start building golf courses in National Parks. [State parks might be another story.] Just suggesting that golf goes not have to be a huge threat to the environment, and can coexist to the acceptance of nature lovers if done right. It's amazing how many times it's been done and done well, yet every new project must overcome the fear that it can't be done!
Niall, the SSSI designation of the dunesland areas at The Renaissance Club was actually VERY strict. They identified as untouchable both the steeper dune features and patchwork colonies of moss, to the point that 30-40% of the site was deemed untouchable, and the parts remaining were patches of such odd shape and size that we couldn't do very much with them. In the end, the new 9th green and 10th fairway are all built in areas that had been covered by buckthorn -- which we were mandated to remove as an invasive species -- and only the tees for the 10th are on the dunesland, located in between spots that were off limits. Sadly, there is no way you could build 18 holes on the 250 acres between Muirfield and The Renaissance and the Firth, based on those rules.
I noticed when I played Gullane after the permitting walk-through that there are many similar patches of moss in the roughs on those courses, but I would assume that there was also moss where there are now fairways before it was built 100+ years ago.
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