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Jason Thurman

  • Karma: +1/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #25 on: July 29, 2014, 11:33:52 AM »
Beacon Hill Golf Course (about 45 miles from the White House) was transferred from the lienholder to the local homeowners association for $1.   Although the 27 hole Johnny Miller designed course reportedly cost over $20M to build, itís not clear that the homeowners association can break even if they decide to operate it.  The land is zoned so as to have no value as home sites or commercial development, so public space or a golf course are about the only options.  And this is in an area of the country where greens fees and memberships are among the highest in the nation.

This is very similar to the case at Indian Springs Golf Course in Louisville, KY. The course closed earlier this year and was sold to the homeowners association, allegedly for $1 as well. The original course owner retained two sections of land which are being converted to retail space (an Aldi, McDonald's, and a hotel). For the rest of the land, the homeowners association brought in a few consultants to discuss possible continued operation of the course and determined that they're better off converting it to green space instead.

It is likely that the course's architecture contributed to that decision, in the sense that the playing corridors in many spots are VERY narrow. I haven't been on the course in many years, but my recollection from driving by is that some hole corridors for par 4s and 5s may be less than 40-50 yards from OB left to OB right. The land is zoned for recreation currently, and it would be very difficult to rezone it for any development considering that many of the hole corridors are too tight to add a road and lots for homes or other buildings.
"There will always be haters. Thatís just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Ian Mackenzie

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #26 on: July 29, 2014, 11:37:41 AM »
My Role...?...: the Marshall.

Rounds would be played in 3:15 or less. (3:00 is ideal for a 4-ball but I understand it's a challenge for most.)
When players check in, they are given a 4" x 5" card that tells them how to play fast.


John Kavanaugh

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #27 on: July 29, 2014, 12:32:17 PM »
My Role...?...: the Marshall.

Rounds would be played in 3:15 or less. (3:00 is ideal for a 4-ball but I understand it's a challenge for most.)
When players check in, they are given a 4" x 5" card that tells them how to play fast.



My role will be Gatekeeper.  I will assure you that anyone with 4" x 5" cards will not get through the gate.  I will pioneer the web site NotGolfNow.com whose tag line will be "Go Away!"

With the destruction of the middle class a greater percentage of golfers will quit than courses will close.  Courses will be few, empty and very expensive, just like it was in the old days.

Ken Moum

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #28 on: July 29, 2014, 12:56:25 PM »
John,
Here's some food for thought.  While I don't think we will lose 50% of the golf courses in the future, I do think we might lose that many clubhouses via conversions to other uses or elimination. 

Now THAT would be a huge move forward for the game of golf.... screw the golf "industry."

To support some of your points, and as an example of how it might work...

These people http://www.greatlifegolf.com/ offer:

  • 23 locations

    1 membership

    unlimited golf

    unlimited fitness

    family membership

    $29.99/month and up

Now, their courses are generally in such condition that NO ONE plays the ball as it lies, even in club and city tournaments. One owner who sold out to them apparently once said that watching them run the course was, "like watching a child die."

Regardless, they've taken over or bought more than a dozen courses in the last few years, and they are all still open.  I don't know for certain, but I would wager that they haven't paid more than $600K and some of them had to be way less than that.

Are they my favorite people?  No.  But they are providing golf all around Kansas and parts of Missouri at a price that's driving the market down. My wife and I paid ~$800 this year to play our course and 11 others.

And now they've begun a takeover of Sioux Falls, SD http://www.joingreatlife.com/, although they have a partner there who might try to hold the courses to a higher standard.

K
Over time, the guy in the ideal position derives an advantage, and delivering him further  advantage is not worth making the rest of the players suffer at the expense of fun, variety, and ultimately cost -- Jeff Warne, 12-08-2010

Peter Pallotta

Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #29 on: July 29, 2014, 02:39:12 PM »
Geez, this is depressing (except for Mark B's suggestion of hiring a great super and watching his back).

Ok, then - I'll be the Greek Chorus: bitter tears mixing with maniacal laughter and the gnashing of teeth as in long, drawn-out drones of anguished lament I bemoan the fate of a once great game, of golfing lives un-lived and of memories fading and skills eroding irrovocably, and watching from high in the rafters stage left I'll cry out thin wailing warnings of hubris and the fall as Gate-keepers and Dictators tempt fate, vainly waiting for the deus ex machina or for Mike Kieser's offspring to appear on the fake backdrop of blue horizon and grandly intone that all is well, and that all will be well, and that all manner of things will be well. I'll wear a flowing white calico knee-length dress tied with soft green stems at the waist, and wear dried flowers in my hair and sandals on my feet, and in my hand will wield as an old crone's staff one of Lee Trevino's first 1 irons.

Peter 

Michael Whitaker

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #30 on: July 29, 2014, 04:14:21 PM »
My Role...?...: the Marshall.

Rounds would be played in 3:15 or less. (3:00 is ideal for a 4-ball but I understand it's a challenge for most.)
When players check in, they are given a 4" x 5" card that tells them how to play fast.



My role will be Gatekeeper.  I will assure you that anyone with 4" x 5" cards will not get through the gate.  I will pioneer the web site NotGolfNow.com whose tag line will be "Go Away!"

With the destruction of the middle class a greater percentage of golfers will quit than courses will close.  Courses will be few, empty and very expensive, just like it was in the old days.

You've got one big problem... My guess is Ian's times are for playing golf on foot, with carts only available for those with a medical certificate. You might never get to play again!
"Solving the paradox of proportionality is the heart of golf architecture."  - Tom Doak (11/20/05)

Ian Mackenzie

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2014, 04:29:51 PM »
My Role...?...: the Marshall.

Rounds would be played in 3:15 or less. (3:00 is ideal for a 4-ball but I understand it's a challenge for most.)
When players check in, they are given a 4" x 5" card that tells them how to play fast.



My role will be Gatekeeper.  I will assure you that anyone with 4" x 5" cards will not get through the gate.  I will pioneer the web site NotGolfNow.com whose tag line will be "Go Away!"

With the destruction of the middle class a greater percentage of golfers will quit than courses will close.  Courses will be few, empty and very expensive, just like it was in the old days.

Ah....but, but that's why the cards are given at check in. So, "my players" will get past you (as gatekeeper) and will learn about fast play before they tee off. No driving range either!

Paul Gray

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2014, 07:14:43 PM »
Step 1: Hire a Greenkeeper that really 'gets it.'
Step 2: Form a Greens Committee
Step 3: Disband the Greens Committee
Step 4: Alienate the rest of the membership
Step 5: File for bankruptcy
« Last Edit: July 29, 2014, 08:06:31 PM by Paul Gray »
In the places where golf cuts through pretension and elitism, it thrives and will continue to thrive because the simple virtues of the game and its attendant culture are allowed to be most apparent. - Tim Gavrich

Daryl David

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2014, 07:18:57 PM »
Step 1: High a Greenkeeper that really 'gets in.'
Step 2: Form a Greens Committee
Step 3: Disband the Greens Committee
Step 4: Alienate the rest of the membership
Step 5: File for bankruptcy

You left out step 4.5.

Step 4.5:  Steal and hide what remains of the investors money and membership deposits

Tom Bacsanyi

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2014, 07:44:10 PM »
Geez, this is depressing (except for Mark B's suggestion of hiring a great super and watching his back).

Ok, then - I'll be the Greek Chorus: bitter tears mixing with maniacal laughter and the gnashing of teeth as in long, drawn-out drones of anguished lament I bemoan the fate of a once great game, of golfing lives un-lived and of memories fading and skills eroding irrovocably, and watching from high in the rafters stage left I'll cry out thin wailing warnings of hubris and the fall as Gate-keepers and Dictators tempt fate, vainly waiting for the deus ex machina or for Mike Kieser's offspring to appear on the fake backdrop of blue horizon and grandly intone that all is well, and that all will be well, and that all manner of things will be well. I'll wear a flowing white calico knee-length dress tied with soft green stems at the waist, and wear dried flowers in my hair and sandals on my feet, and in my hand will wield as an old crone's staff one of Lee Trevino's first 1 irons.

Peter 

Post of the Year.
Don't play too much golf. Two rounds a day are plenty.

--Harry Vardon

Mike Sweeney

Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #35 on: July 30, 2014, 10:33:43 AM »

What do you think the prospects are for being a club pro in the next several years? Is the employed and happiest pro going to be the one who has some ownership in a course?

Weíre dealing with it -- weíve got to get better at it -- but I see a lot of bright spots. Iím very bullish on the future of the game both here in the United States and globally, where itís growing quite nicely. And with golf going in the Olympics, thatís going to be accelerated.Ē


http://www.golfdigest.com/blogs/the-loop/2014/07/has-golfs-demise-been-greatly.html


John Kirk

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: The JK Apocalypse Hits: What is YOUR role in Golf ?
« Reply #36 on: July 30, 2014, 12:24:18 PM »
So now we know what role Golf Digest and Tim Finchem play.  Sort of like CNBC's role with Wall Street.

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