[Patrick_Mucci]

Joey,

It's certainly a short hole, but I wouldn't call it "dicey"

It certainly lulls you to sleep with regard to the next 17 holes.

LJ drove it regularly.

[Pat Burke]

For the LA Open, either tee you started on at
Riviera made you feel that you needed birdie to get off to a start.
Obviously 1 as a par five may not fit this OP, but for such an
easy hole, the "need" for birdie added to the tightness I felt.

Starting on 10 was a nightmare.  Such an important tee shot, first of
the day.  Still makes my a$$ pucker thinking about it!

[Sean_A]

Carne comes to mind for a newer course.  I might also put Lederach in that category - not super short, but quite dicey.  Perhaps the diciest of all is from our own Adrian Stiff with his short par 3 opener at Players Stranahan.  An opening wedge shot with water front and back - gulp. Definitely short and dicey.


Ciao

[Mark Pearce]

Isn't there more danger when the short hole comes early but not first up?  I suspect many (most?) golfers might resist temptation on a first hole whereas they might take it on a hole or two later.  Scott MacPherson's Colt course at Close House has a moderate length opener (380 yds) which has trouble on both sides and a treacherous green.  However, he follows it with short par 4s at the 2nd and 3rd (one playing uphill, the other, at just over 300 yards and likely downwind almost crying out to be driven) both of which  are quite capable of generating a big score with very tricky green sites.

Since others have mentioned older courses, despite Patrick restricting his OP to courses built in he last thirty yers, Royal Porthcawl's opener is a great example.

[Rich Goodale]

Given Pat's condition of a hole built in the lat 30 years, I'd nominate Castle Stuart.  From the normal tees it is 330-360, and driveable by the better player.  I saw this done the first time I played the course, with a pro, who hit it to 6 feet and sank his putt for a 4.

[Dónal Ó Ceallaigh]

Given Pat's condition of a hole built in the lat 30 years, I'd nominate Castle Stuart.  From the normal tees it is 330-360, and driveable by the better player.  I saw this done the first time I played the course, with a pro, who hit it to 6 feet and sank his putt for a 4.

As they saying goes, you drive for show and putt for dough.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Has the shift in emphasis in the modern game from match to medal play been responsible for the paucity in short, dicey  opening holes ?

[Rich Goodale]

Has the shift in emphasis in the modern game from match to medal play been responsible for the paucity in short, dicey  opening holes ?

No, Pat

Why would it be so, even if your idea of a shift in emphasis is true, which I do not think so?

Rich

[Mark Pearce]

Has the shift in emphasis in the modern game from match to medal play been responsible for the paucity in short, dicey  opening holes ?

Echoing Rich, I'm not sure there has been such a shift, particularly at club level.  However, if we assume your premise is correct, wouldn't that encourage the sort of hole we're talking about?  A hole where a player might be tempted by the opportunity of an opening birdie but, in over-reaching, suffer bogey or worse?

[Patrick_Mucci]

Rich,

It could be so because at medal play noone wanted to see a round ruined on the first hole because it was dicey and prone to producing high scores.

Especially with the concurrent influence of TV where the ideal finish was a crescendo ending at a difficult 18th.

If the leader/s tripled the first, all the air would be out of the balloon.

If you don't think there was a shift in emphasis from match to medal play in the last 60 years when TV was coming into it's own, you're out of touch with reality.

Mark,

See the above response to Rich regarding triples and TV on first holes

[SteveOgulukian]

How about the GCA approved Westhampton Country Club?  1st hole is 340 with with water hazard roughly 50 yards short.  Ideal tee ball is 200 depending on the wind into a small double tiered green.  The best utility wood/wedge opener I can think of!

Tim,

How could I have forgotten the 1st at Westhampton, a fabulous short hole with X written all over it.

It's certainly got that "dicey" quality about it.

Good call.

It's amazing how the moat in front of the green expands from 5 yards in depth to 30 yards when you push your tee shot into the fairway bunker.  Catch the ball a touch fat, and you're taking a drop.  Catch it a bit thin and you're dead.  In hindsight, glad I opted for drop over dead my last time there.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Has the shift in emphasis in the modern game from match to medal play been responsible for the paucity in short, dicey  opening holes ?

Echoing Rich, I'm not sure there has been such a shift, particularly at club level. 

Mark,

I can't speak to the UK, but, in the U.S. the golfer is required to post every score for handicap purposes.

Hence medal play is the overriding method of play, even at the local level, and even when golfers are competing in a match.


However, if we assume your premise is correct, wouldn't that encourage the sort of hole we're talking about?  A hole where a player might be tempted by the opportunity of an opening birdie but, in over-reaching, suffer bogey or worse?

[Bill_McBride]

Ballyhack- short, dicey and delicious.

Isn't that quite the opening combo platter!

My hard-won bogey won the first in a four ball match at Ballyhack.   Never give up!

[Mark Pearce]

In the UK only competitive medal rounds count for handicapping purposes, so the vast majority of social golf is matchplay.  But doesn't the lure of a possible birdie still make these holes attractive starters in strokeplay, asking the golfer to decide whether to gamble straight off the first tee?

[Patrick_Mucci]

In the UK only competitive medal rounds count for handicapping purposes, so the vast majority of social golf is matchplay.  

But doesn't the lure of a possible birdie still make these holes attractive starters in strokeplay, asking the golfer to decide whether to gamble straight off the first tee?

Sure, but at what risk ?

The "short" opening par 4 appeals to the golfer's ego.
Thoughts of birdie are prevalent, despite the golfer not yet being into the round.
On the other hand, there are always first tee jitters.

The "dicey" element says "danger Will Robinson"

Some short opening holes present the "dicey" nature off the tee, like Prestwick and GCGC, whereas others like Sebonack and NGLA have equal or greater "diciness" at the green end.

"Birdie" isn't my primary thought when I step on the first tee at Sebonack or NGLA.
My main thought, other than where to hit my drive, is to walk to the second tee at no more than par.
I don't want to start my round with a double or worse, and those scores are easy to come by on those holes, which are barely 300 yards,

Westhampton is another hole where birdie is possible, but so is a triple, although, with a good tee shot, I think that Westhampton offers a better birdie opportunity.

[Tim Martin]

Wanumetonomy gets you off and running with a 318 yd 1st and a 313 yd 2nd. Both pack their punch on and around the greens.

[jonathan_becker]

Friar's Head.  Since there are no yardages, Google Earth has told me it's roughly 350 or so from the back tee.

Jonathan,

The 1st at Friars Head is no short hole.

The steeply uphill nature of the approach adds to the linear yardage.
Ain't nobody driving that green.

The fw is 55+ yards wide at it's peak, but trying to judge a short iron to a putting surface that's elevated and out of view doesn't make for an easy approach.  The last thing you want is to walk up to the green and find yourself having to putt back downhill.   It's not an easy shot.

Patrick, Ok , I'll give you that the first at FH isn't driveable.  But you did say, "some" of these holes are driveable.   

I can't currently think of another short/driveable opening hole built in the last 30 years that hasn't already been mentioned that I've played, but I can say that the opening hole at Philadelphia CC is a short and dicey opening hole.  325 from the back tee with a green that has a large ridge running through it and the player has to contend with the eight bunkers that are along the route to the putting surface.  A few of those bunkers aren't in play too much, but the three that reside on the inside of the hole are definitely in play.  The last shot a player wants is to hit a 20-30 yard bunker shot for the second swing of the day.

[Lenny Polakoff]

Its been quite a few years since I have played it and i don't know if longer tees have since been built.  But I recall #1 at Old Marsh being a short, dicey hole

[Jeffrey Conners]

I nominate Secession, especially at high tide.

[Matthew Petersen]

A good and relatively recent example is the first at WeKoPa (Cholla).

The hole measures no more than 350 from the tips and the tee is elevated. It's also not nearly that long on a direct line from the tee to the green. Thus it's theoretically quite driveable. However, I doubt anyone tries much.

The hole is a sever dogleg. you play off the hill down to a fairway that sits on the other side of a large waste area. It's cape-like in that you can kind of choose to just play a little iron, or a hybrid or fairway wood, with ever increasing degrees of carry and risk, though shortening the approach.

To play directly at the green, you would actually be playing blind, to the best of my memory. At the far left side of the waste area it turns to desert and mesquite and cholla trees block the view. Nonetheless, from the tee a driver hit on a good line over those trees could reach the green or find the fairway just short of it. Missing with that shot could obviously lead to a major penalty, however.

As it is mostly played, an enjoyable little pitch and putt start. But theoretically it could really be an interesting hole.

[Russell Lo]

In Hawaii, Kapalua Plantation and Princeville Prince course are two interesting starters. The Prince, espeically can get in your melon.

[Tom_Doak]

The first hole at Streamsong (Blue) will be another for this category.  +/- 340 yards from an elevated tee, so it's possible to go for it, but there is a lot of trouble to either side if you go that route.  Wide fairway for those who play safely, although the closer you hug the left side, the better chance you have of seeing the flag for your second shot.  Bail right, and the second shot is mostly blind.

[Bob_Huntley]

I think that the first hole at Traig could be considered dicey, though it is but a 130 yard par three. The trouble is that the green is seventy feet above the tee. Most first time players take too much club and then have to dunk it out from the rough behind the green.

I do believe Traig is one of the most delightful small courses in Scotland.

http://www.traighgolf.co.uk/

Bob

[Bradley Anderson]

1st hole at Beverly is short and simple but if you push the ball off the back of the green you're screwed.

[Mark Johnson]

Minnikahda fits the bill nicely

got to disagree on this one.. (I know we dont see eye to eye on this course.)

Once I figured out that the best way to play the hole is just to hit a 3-wood (driver for some) and try to dump it into the greenside bunker (about 260 to the front edge) for a not that tough up and down for most pins..   I can't put my finger on it but that holes is just missing something.

I actually like #5 at Minikahda much better.   The hole is a driveable but requires you to work the ball a bit and it is more penal if you miss.

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