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Anthony Butler

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #50 on: March 10, 2010, 01:09:17 PM »

Is Pinehurst the only course in the USGA rota at the moment where you could host a F&F Open?

I imagine they chose Chambers Bay with the intention of F&F. And Shinnecock, assuming that's still in the queue.

Thanks... for some reason I was thinking of Flat, Fast and Firm. Chambers Bay seems to have even more dramatic elevation changes than Shinnecock. I'll be interested to see how much roll off they have at the front of the greens. On the other hand, with lower spin rates, there's less likelihood of sucking it back off the green and rolling 30 yards down the hill.
Next!

john_stiles

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #51 on: March 10, 2010, 01:15:14 PM »
C & C  has been pouring over all the historical photos in the Tufts Archives as well according to Audrey.  One of the articles did mentioned this.

Steve Kline

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #52 on: March 16, 2010, 04:23:38 PM »
I have some pictures of the work that my dad just sent me. If anyone's interested let me know and I'll send them to you. Hopefully you can post them here as I'm totally inept in that area.

Jim Colton

Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #53 on: March 16, 2010, 04:38:23 PM »
Here you go Steve...

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PCCraig

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #54 on: March 16, 2010, 04:43:00 PM »
Great pictures, thanks for posting.

Looks like the fairway lines haven't or aren't going to change much. Would be nice if they added the big waste areas, but then added some fairway on the opposite side of the fairways.
H.P.S.

John Mayhugh

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #55 on: March 16, 2010, 05:26:38 PM »
Wow.  A few complaints from Jim Thornton and people jump into action!  I wish I had that kind of influence.   ;D

Thanks Steve (and Jim C for posting) for the pics.

Steve Kline

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #56 on: March 16, 2010, 08:05:26 PM »
Great pictures, thanks for posting.

Looks like the fairway lines haven't or aren't going to change much. Would be nice if they added the big waste areas, but then added some fairway on the opposite side of the fairways.

This is not true. All of the dark green areas are fairway and they are much wider than before. I'll detail the photos in my next post.

Chris Buie

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #57 on: March 16, 2010, 08:30:03 PM »
Nice photos Jim/Steve.  I played #1 on Sunday and looking over there I could see that things really are moving in the right direction.  
The USGA website has the best look at #2 I have ever seen.  Aerial photos from the 30's.  It is only as I post this now that I see the irony of the USGA being the ones with the best look at the authentic #2.

http://architecturearchive.usgamuseum.com

It requires registration.  It's worth it.

« Last Edit: March 17, 2010, 06:31:04 AM by Chris Buie »

Steve Kline

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #58 on: March 16, 2010, 09:18:05 PM »
As I've said, I've been playing the course for 20 years and have several hundred rounds under my belt. My dad is probably pushing close to 750-1,000. Here are my descriptions of the photos he sent me. My dad has played the course several times since they have started the work but I'm doing this all from the photos and memory.

1. #11 from the tee. Tan area in the bottom right is dormant bermuda rough - you won't see much (or any) of this in the rest of the pictures. All dark green areas are now fairway. In mid left of picture you can see the fairway bunker. The bunker used to be well into the rough but now the fairway goes right up to it. This added 10-20 yards of fairway to the left side. Fairway has been expanded to the right as well - probably 10 yards or so. This fairway is at least double the size and my previous estimates are probably conservative.

2. #11 from tee, close up of right side. The waste area has been expanded to the left. Note the line of love grass (or whatever you call the grass clumps). Everything to the left of those is new waste area. A little left of waste area is a tan line. I'm pretty sure that is the old rough line. Now all the green is fairway. There is no more rough on the right side at all - it goes straight from fairway to waste area.

3. #11 from tee, close up of left side. Fairway goes right up to bunker when it hadn't before. This makes front right pin placements completely visible whereas they are semi-blind from middle of fairway. Also, it allows you to run the ball on to the right side of the green and not to have to carry the bunker, but it lengthens the hole dramatically. Green angles from front right to back left so this side of the fairway is useless if pin is on left. On right side of picture about midway up is a faint tan line which I think was the old rough line. All dark green to the left is now fairway - much, much wider. All rough left of fairway is gone leaving just waste area.

4. Right of 11 green looking back to fairway. Note brown area left of bunker. This used to be rough but all the rough has been removed to be replaced by waste area. Fairway goes right up to that bunker when it didn't before.

5. 12 tee looking toward 12 green. Formerly 10-20 yards of rough right of fairway before getting to waste area. Fairway extended to waste area and bunkers.

6. 12 tee looking to left side of hole. The fairway bunker used to be way into the rough and completely out of play. Now the fairway goes right up to it. This makes the right hand pin placements more accessible without having to worry about going in right greenside bunker but  makes the hole much longer. Fairway is easily twice as wide, if not more, than before. Rough appears to have been completely removed left of tee and fairway.

7. Close up of right side of #12. Fairway clearly goes right up to bunkers. Challenging those bunkers shortens the hole and opens up back left hole location which is protected by a swale in the middle left of the green. All rough removed leaving just waste area.

8. 12 green looking back to tee. Waste area was extended closer to fairway. Given the width between the tree lines the fairway looks to be over 50 yards wide.

9. 12 green looking back to left side of fairway. Fairway now goes right up to tree line. Easily added 20 yards of fairway on that side.

10. 13 tee looking to green. All rough on the hole appears to have been removed. Probably 10-20 yards of fairway added to left side.

11. Close up of right side of 13 fairway. Where there is no grass will be waste area. This goes all the way to the 14th fairway right of the picture. Fairway goes right up to bunker where there used to be 5-10 yards of fairway between the fairway and the bunker.

12. 13 green back to tee. No more rough between holes 13 and 14 - all waste area. Note tire tracks in the fairway - that was approximately the old rough line.

13. 13 green looking back to left of fairway. All rough is gone. Look closely and you can see the old rough line - about 5-10 more yards of fairway.

14. 13 green looking down 14 fairway. Waste area goes down entire right side of 14. Fairway goes right up to fairway bunkers on both sides, close to doubling the fairway width.

15. Close up of previous photo.

16. 14 green to tee. Fairway used to be a narrow strip between the fairway bunkers. Now it is expanded all the way to fairway bunkers on both sides.

Last two photos are same as 16.

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re: Coore & Crenshaw to renovate Pinehurst #2?
« Reply #59 on: November 04, 2010, 10:04:59 PM »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

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