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David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Which will be more painful
« on: June 14, 2002, 12:06:48 PM »
I just saw the weather forecast for this weekend in Michigan.  It looks like rain.  That means I will spend it in front of the TV.  Which is going to be the least painful option?

1.  Tiger with a six stroke lead cruising to victory in the US Open.
2.  Annika walking away with the Evian masters.
3.  The US losing to Mexico (I hope) in soccer.
4.  Interleague midseason baseball.
5.  Bass Fishing
6.  NASCAR
7.  The WNBA

I never thought I would say this, but why couldn't the Stanley Cup finals go at least six games.  :'(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:06 PM by -1 »
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And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Will W

Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2002, 12:09:46 PM »
why would you want the U.S. to lose to mexico?

bass fishing tournaments on TV are IMO pretty fun to watch, but i'm just a good ole boy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2002, 12:10:18 PM »
Senor Wigler  - why would you hope the US would lose to Mexico?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2002, 12:16:52 PM »
Because I seriously dislike soccer and want it off my TV.  Once the US is eliminated (Which should have happened today if not for those darn Korean's) ESPN, ABC and all other media in the US will stop mentioning it.  

Why do I hate Soccer?  Because I cannot stand any sport, where it is considered strategic to be barely brushed and then cry as if you need a leg amputated.  Golf is a game of honor where you are expected to call penalties on yourself.  In hockey, you are expected to play no matter what (Witness Steve Duchene losing six teeth to a puck and missing exactly one two-minute shift).  In soccer, you are encouraged to cheat and fake injuries.  That is not a sport.  I think that they all should play in dresses (How's that for a milquetoast opinion).
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:06 PM by -1 »
Logged
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Will W

Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2002, 12:21:20 PM »
sorry to disappoint you, but even if the u.s. is eliminated, abc and espn will continue to show world cup and mention it.  they paid a bundle for the rights.

the gamesmanship of soccer is unfortunate.  some games have lots of "diving" others don't.  but there is nothing that compares to the grace and power of the game played at it's highest levels.  it appears in flashes and you have to wait for it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2002, 12:26:06 PM »
If you think Hockey is free from the sort of dramatics you describe, you should watch more closely.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2002, 12:28:47 PM »
Will,

I have to admit that I was leaning towards Bass Fishing.  I am a closet (Now out) TV fishing fan myself.  I was thinking you were pretty sharp for admitting that you like TV Bassmasters as well.  

Are you serious about the grace and power of soccer?  What grace and power.  To me, that's like saying Rosie O’Donnell is pretty hot so long as her mouth is shut and the light is hitting her just right to cover up the fact that she is fat, ugly and annoying.  The 10 seconds worth of excitement cannot overcome the utter boredom and disgust over fake injuries that make up the remaining two hours.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
Logged
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Dave_Miller

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2002, 12:32:39 PM »
David W is right on point.  Soccer is the most boring game ever wrought upon the good people of Planet Earth.  Any sport that has 40 games in a weekend with about 8 goals scored should be banned forever.  Even the architecture is boring.  

Will W: You hit the nail right on the head and described the problem in one sentence. The power and grace comes only in flashes and you have to wait for it. That alone is what's wrong with this sport.

Even is he has a six shot lead Tiger will display power and grace on every shot and be faced with the Challenge of The Black Course lying in wait to take away his lead.

Cheers
Dave Miller
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Kevin_Reilly

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Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2002, 12:34:11 PM »
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Wigler

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2002, 12:35:19 PM »
SPDB,

I watch Hockey very closely and have played, coached and been a fan my whole life.  I can count on one finger the times during this years playoffs where I saw a player fake that he was hit and sprawl out on the ice.  I certainly have seen players stay on the ice longer than the hit they took probably deserved.  They were hit though.  I also have nowhere near enough fingers and toes to count the guys who played through crushing hits, broken bones, lost teeth, etc.  Did you see the hit Draper took last night?  It would have caused 10 minutes of injury time in soccer.  He got off the ice and didn't miss a shift.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
Logged
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Donnie Beck

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2002, 12:38:04 PM »
I love the world cup, but would rather watch the open!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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RJ_Daley

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Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2002, 12:41:46 PM »
I'm with you all the way Wiggles  ;D

Sean, I reckon you are referring to the fine line of some hockey players taking a dive; which in Hockey is the difference between taking a puck in the mouth and it really causing some dental disturbance like Duchene's incident forcing a whole missed shift on the ice after loosing just 6 teeth (valid), and the mere crossstick gently applied to the small of the back causing the receiving party the slightest of whealts and giving him incentive to jump face first into the boards to draw a questionable penalty call (suspicious). :o

I like that sort of melodrama like Luc never even having touched the cup til he actually was on a team that won it.  But, I'm just a sentimental slob... ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Doane McTork

Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2002, 12:48:41 PM »
Option # 8.   Kill yer telly!  Don yer wellies and quit livin' vicariously through overpaid anybodies.  Life is for living...not watching.  

  (I should smash this computer after submitting this, eh?)

   Carpe niblick !

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2002, 12:55:45 PM »
I'm not disputing the toughness of hockey players - that would be absurd. I'm a hockey fan, and I can count on 4 hands, the amount of times I have seen Theo Fleury, or Darcy Tucker take a dive or feign a blade to the face when no contact was made.

You're free to dislike soccer, but you made a mistake by using your criteria vis-a-vis hockey.

fair is fair.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Wigler

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Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2002, 01:02:45 PM »
SPDB,

I have not watched Fleury, so I will not comment on him.  I have watched Tucker play.  Never once have I seen him fake contact.  Never once.  Dick Daley explained it far better than me.  I have seen Tucker get a cross-check to the back and fall harder than he probably needed to but always get back up.  I agree that fair is fair.  I just do not think you are right.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
Logged
And I took full blame then, and retain such now.  My utter ignorance in not trumpeting a course I have never seen remains inexcusable.
Tom Huckaby 2/24/04

Will W

Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2002, 01:04:58 PM »
dave and dave-

that waiting is what separates fans from those that despise the game.  it's a tough sell, and i don't even try to convert my friends.

i don't think it's necessary to compare soccer to other sports and determine why you like one versus the other.  i love soccer and i love golf, and i accept the bad with the good (with golf, i have to admit, there isn't much that's bad).

now, bass fishing, on the other hand.  who can't appreciate watching sportsmen haul in pound after pound of lunker bass.  i think what i appreciate most is that they're able to catch so darn many fish.  whenever i go out (which is seldom), all i end up with are a few juvenile bass, crappie, or sunfish.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Scott_Burroughs

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Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #16 on: June 14, 2002, 01:14:04 PM »
Quite possibly the stupidest rule in sports:  Offsides in hockey.

Offsides in hockey prevents almost everything that is otherwise exciting about the sport, such as breakaways, and one-on-ones, that makes basketball exciting, becuase it isn't a rule.

Next would be to enforce all instances of hooking and interference, which goes on about 3000 times a game in today's hockey, which prevents many passes, shots, and breakaways.  It's not good defense, it's illegal and boring.

Last night's game averaged about one shot per team every three minutes.  Yawn.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:06 PM by -1 »
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RJ_Daley

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2002, 01:20:43 PM »
Bass fishing makes me puke.  Lowrance fish locators, 150horse engines on a low skimming bassbuster boat to cross a 1 mile lake in 15 seconds, stiff rods with crank baits with 15lb test to jerk them out like so much tuna.  Beer swilling bubbas whose only vocabulary is "yup Bubba that's a real big fish".  ::)

How about making it sporting at least.  I love the solitary hike to a mountain or woodland or meadow stream-creek.  Make your own bait, flyrod or ultra light poles using hand made flys or maribou jigs, stealty sneak up the stream and read the water and lairs where they may be hiding, and use a little hand eye co-ordination to actually catch the fish when they swing out to take the presentation.   8)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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No actual golf rounds were ruined or delayed, nor golf rules broken, in the taking of any photographs that may be displayed by the above forum user.

Dave_Miller

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2002, 01:33:24 PM »
Scott:  As a long time member of the Hockey establishment in NE the problem is not the offsides rule but the red line preventing the breakaways etc.  
Playoff hockey can be boring at times because they play such a tight checking game and forecheck nowadays in the neutral zone.  
Eliminating the red line would open things up somewhat.   You're also right about the interference etc. that should be called.
The archtecture ain't a changin' so the rules should.
Cheers,
Dave Miller
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Andy Hodson

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2002, 01:57:59 PM »
But at least in indoor soccer, they actually score. The most revealing thing that shows how silly soccer is, is the size of the goal...its big enough to carry six lanes of traffic through it. And still no one gets close to it.

Watching soccer is like chaperoning a junior high school dance...there's a whole lot of action going on, but you know no one is going to score.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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SPDB

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #20 on: June 14, 2002, 02:06:17 PM »

Quote
SPDB,

I have not watched Fleury, so I will not comment on him.  I have watched Tucker play.  Never once have I seen him fake contact.  Never once.  Dick Daley explained it far better than me.  I have seen Tucker get a cross-check to the back and fall harder than he probably needed to but always get back up.  I agree that fair is fair.  I just do not think you are right.




Dave - If the players in both sports are taking an unneccesary dive in order to attract a whistle which, all things fair and truthful, shouldn't be blown, what's the difference?  They both get up, whether they convince or not.
It just strikes me that you're taking a strange high road here.

will is right, the grace and precision of top notch players is unmistakable.

soccer will never catch on in america as a spectator sport, which is a shame. americans don't have the attention span to allow themselves to like it.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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David Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #21 on: June 14, 2002, 02:31:42 PM »
I agree wholeheartedly with this anonymous quote that I read on another website
"I would rather pluck my eyes out with a cocktail fork than watch a soccer game. Soccer is boring; that's why Americans don't watch it. One of the key reasons the rest of the world plays soccer is that it is the most inexpensive game there is: you need a round ball and a flat field. A good baseball glove costs over $40, not to mention bats and balls. Even a high school football player wears over $100 worth of equipment. Soccer's low costs make it egalitarian; perfect for Europeans and third worlders."

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Brian Phillips

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Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #22 on: June 15, 2002, 11:01:15 AM »
David,

I can't comment too much on American sport but I know a hell of alot about 'football' as it is called in the rest of the world.

I will now call it soccer so as not to confuse anyone.

The soccer you get to watch on your side of the pond is the most boring soccer I have ever seen.  It is full of crap players and retired European soccer stars that cannot get a job in Europe.  

I agree with many of you that when a game of soccer is boring it is really boring however for you to comment on soccer without having been to a real game (and I mean a real game here in Europe) would be like me commenting on American Football.

I have seen many boring American Football games on TV but I have also seen many exiting ones as well.  I could say the same about Baseball.  Here is a game with hardly any scoring as well.  You have ten innings and what happens...not very much if you do not really understand the strategy of the game.  It is the same with soccer, unless you really understand the strategy both teams are playing then yes it can be boring.

I have been to Ice Hockey matches and those that I have been to are crap and boring but that is probably because of the crap standard over her in Scandinavia.  Watching Ice Hockey on TV is worse all you see is a load of men in padded pajamas skating around after a puck that I cannot see on TV!!

I used to play Rugby at a high level and I think that American Football players are a bunch of wimps with all that protection but hey everything is relative!!

Soccer is not a boring game when you understand it.  How many people do you speak to that think golf is boring to watch?  However if you get them to watch the British Open or the Masters for a day they are hooked!!

I also agree with the reasoning for why so many play the game in relation to the price of playing.  That is the beauty of the game!!

I don't think so many billion people can be that wrong can they!!

It is a great game and the best in the world.  Try to watch a couple of the great games this month and maybe try to learn the game instead of hating it.  The USA have great chance of beating Mexico with a bit of luck they really could win.  Brad Friedel is one of the best keepers in the world and is worth watching.


I hope that USA never falls in love with soccer as I think it would ruin the game and advertising and TV would take over too much.

Watch the USA against Mexico with an open mind and maybe just maybe you will enjoy it!!

Brian Phillips

England 3 -  Denmark 0
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Bunkers, if they be good bunkers, and bunkers of strong character, refuse to be disregarded, and insist on asserting themselves; they do not mind being avoided, but they decline to be ignored - John Low Concerning Golf

David Kelly

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2002, 11:30:46 AM »
Brian,
Of course a billion people can be wrong. A billion Islamists are most defintely wrong.

I played AYSO soccer in the 70s and went to a few NASL games back then. In the past I have also seen English league games on TV and in 1998 went to a game between Arsenal and Aston Villa. So I have been exposed to the game and yet I still find it boring and no longer bother with it.  But that is just my opinion and you are free to think of me as someone who is missing out. Just like I think of people who badmouth golf.

BTW, in terms of US and advertising it seems that English league soccer is all about advertising as it is and it has nothing to do with the Americans.  After all the Americans don't corrupt everything despite what Europeans might think.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Brian Phillips

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Which will be more painful
« Reply #24 on: June 15, 2002, 12:31:52 PM »
Steady on David,

Nothing wrong with Islam dude or the billion that believe in it.  Just because a few thousand idiotic islamic millitants go around trying to ruin the world does not mean the that Islam is a bad religion. :-*

The thing I meant about USA changing and ruining the game is meant by the way advertising dictates much of your sports.  The match in an American Football game is usually set up for commercials isn't it?  Isn't that why the Superbowl takes so long?

I feel sorry for you that you had to sit through Arsenal..one of the most boring teams in the Premiership!! ;D

I also agree with you that advertising is very important for the game in England but there is no way the game will be divided into 4 quarters for advertising the way the Americans wanted to do it a few years ago.

I love sport and enjoy American sport but yes I do think that you guys on the otherside of the pond have not been given the fair deal on soccer yet.  I don't think many of you really know what good soccer is.

I am one boring bastard as I can watch any sport!! ;D

Cheers for the response anyway..

Brian.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Bunkers, if they be good bunkers, and bunkers of strong character, refuse to be disregarded, and insist on asserting themselves; they do not mind being avoided, but they decline to be ignored - John Low Concerning Golf
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