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Jon Spaulding

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Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« on: July 16, 2008, 02:48:05 PM »
Had the opportunity to see Annandale GC in Pasadena last week for the first time. Have heard mixed reviews throughout the years….but came away fairly impressed with the current version. Most may know this as the club where Paul Runyan served as the pro for many years. The course was recently renovated and reopened in November, 2007. The scorecard lists Watson (1906), Bell Sr. (1928), and Silva (2007). The recent work is marketed as a “renovation to recreate historic views and reshape every hole for playability”.

I’m hoping for some posts by some of the locals which can help establish a design litany, especially pre -1940. There is a letter from Bell Jr. posted in the grill room, dated 1980 which details Watson converting the course in 1919 from sand greens to grass, with Bell Sr. handling the construction. Adjacent to the letter is a drawing of the 3rd greensite on Watson’s original drafting paper with handwritten notes. Other photos on display, from the same period show a Watson-esque style of bunkering (including some wild ones, and a punchbowl green). The property saw major change in 1961 with the “insertion” of the 134 freeway, wherein a fair bit of acreage was lost.

The course was a delight; very efficient use of a small/undulating piece of property, reminds one of Claremont CC with a few similarities to Pasatiempo (difficulty/tree planting for adjacent holes). Plays to a par 70, 6612 yards, 72.6/131.

The new bunkering, routing and a few green contours are the highlights; the bunkering being a bit over the top and superfluous in a few places but I would say it’s a vast improvement over the “Bell” bunkering being attempted at locales such as Brookside, San Clemente, etc. The detail edgework is quite elaborate, but looks as though it can be maintained for some time due to the shallowness of many of the bunkers. The work done at La Cumbre looks to be the best but I have only seen in photos to date.

The turf selction is not my favorite, with overwatered bentgrass greens, Bermuda fairways, and a rye/bluegrass rough brought right up to the edges of the putting surface (ugh).

Attached are a few photos (with “July gloom”) which hopefully capture the “new Annandale”; if anything’s missing please ask!

Opening tee shot

#1 approach

#1 greensite with kickboard on the front RH side

#2 teeshot with no look at preferred line

#2 approach with preferred angle from RH side of fairway

#3 approach

#4 tee shot

#4 approach

#5 tee shot

#5 greenside bunker

#6 approach

#6 green

#7 tee shot with preferred line/carry bunker on the RH side

#7 approach with green sloping front-back, right-left

#7 behind green

#8 tee shot

#8 greensite

#9 – I don’t get the bunkering here

#10 tee shot

#10 approach

#11 approach

#12

#12 greensite

#13 approach

#13 greensite

#14 approach

#14 greensite

#14 green from behind

#15

#15 green

#16 tee shot

#16 approach

#17 tee shot

#17 green

#18 second shot

#18 greensite

You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

David Stamm

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2008, 04:23:06 PM »
Great photos bud. While a little over the top in spots, overall I like the bunker work. Silva has improved it. I really like the opening tee shot as well as #4. 10 looks very solid and #6, 12, 13, 14, 15 and 18's greens look very cool.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Thomas MacWood

Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2008, 04:38:51 PM »
The golf course really twists and turns with the land. It looks like an interesting layout.

John Mayhugh

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2008, 04:57:59 PM »
Looks sporty.  Thanks for posting the pics.

How long is the 13th?

Matt Bosela

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2008, 05:04:04 PM »
Great photos - looks like a fun golf course.

Wyatt Halliday

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #5 on: July 16, 2008, 05:44:02 PM »
Thanks for the pics and the insight. At first glance it appears the tee shots at 2 & 7 are similar. Is it just the one ridgeline forming the border on most holes? The look back valley shot of #14 has me thrown off a bit.

WH

David Druzisky

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2008, 06:02:13 PM »
Nice work by Brian.  The details of the bunkering look very good. 

I agree that you could think areas/holes are too busy with the bunkering.  The forms of the bunkers are very active yet they are surrounded by the opposite with consistent green and healthy or thick turf.  Sometime the jagged edge style of bunker needs to be complimented by similar not so perfect areas around them so they appear fitting and not too strong.  As we have manicured these courses those bunker styles start not making as much sense.

9 is wild and yes the bunkering is a bit of a ? other than just pure look, which on that hole may be the best thing.

Gosh, how many courses have been interrupted by highways!?

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2008, 09:05:53 PM »
Looks sporty.  Thanks for posting the pics.

How long is the 13th?

Without the card handy, I think it was 540 from the back tee, which I was told is new and way up on the hill behind the 12th green. The LZ is quite narrow, with OB on the left and the 12th tee/wasteland on the right. The hole starts out straight and makes a hard turn to the left. A very tough layup if you miss left at all.
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2008, 09:12:35 PM »
Thanks for the pics and the insight. At first glance it appears the tee shots at 2 & 7 are similar. Is it just the one ridgeline forming the border on most holes? The look back valley shot of #14 has me thrown off a bit.

WH

#2 is somewhat uphill and about 420; #7 downhill and roughly 470. The tee shot on the 2nd is far more forgiving than the one on the 7th, but the green on the 7th is more receptive. The photo on the 7th was taken a little bit forward. From the rear box it is fairly blind and wonderful, with a speed slot on the right side just over the bunker. The bermuda fairways play reasonably firm so things are a bit shorter than the yardage.

I was told that #14 is somewhat of a lightning rod with the membership. The fairway is about 1/2 as narrow as most others, and the hole plays 430 uphill. That and #6 are the two most difficult on the course from what I could tell....but the LZ on 6 is a bit wider with OB only on the right side. On 14, you miss either side and you can kiss the ball goodbye.
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2008, 09:17:13 PM »

Gosh, how many courses have been interrupted by highways!?

Way too many! Another one that pops to mind out this way is Montecito CC, originally designed by Max Behr and wiped out by the 101. I would imagine that it was one hell of a layout. Today it's a cramped mess with a few interesting things going on, but not enough to justify a visit. :'(
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Scott Stambaugh

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2008, 10:37:37 PM »
I seem to recall about five years ago that Schmidt-Curley was being credited for renovation work.  Now, no mention of it whatsoever. 

Do I remember this correctly, or has Brian Silva always been the architect on this project?

Scott

David Stamm

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2008, 10:59:29 PM »
I seem to recall about five years ago that Schmidt-Curley was being credited for renovation work.  Now, no mention of it whatsoever. 

Do I remember this correctly, or has Brian Silva always been the architect on this project?

Scott


Scott, you may be thinking of Oakmont. They are getting ready to commence work there.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2008, 11:12:00 PM »
I seem to recall about five years ago that Schmidt-Curley was being credited for renovation work.  Now, no mention of it whatsoever. 

Do I remember this correctly, or has Brian Silva always been the architect on this project?

Scott

I heard something to this effect recently, but also that whatever they did was very minor in nature. Either way, the selection of Silva was a damn good one considering all the poor choices they could have made.
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

Jordan Caron

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2008, 11:14:47 PM »
Those bunkers look like there work of Thomas McBroom and his crew.  Thanks again Jon for the pics.  We had 4 Annandale members play our course 2 weeks ago so I check out the website but there are no pics. 

Lester George

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2008, 11:16:43 PM »
I am soooo tired of Silva copying my  bunkers.  Sheeeeeesh!

Lester

David Kelly

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2008, 11:20:53 PM »
Schmidt-Curley did do some remodel work at Annandale but not nearly to the extent that Silva did.  They were the ones who changed the sand to Augusta white from the more natural color it was before.

Even though the course is only about 2 miles from my house I haven't played it since the the work was completed.  I always liked the front nine much better than the back and thought #14 was a real dog of a hole.  The hole rises up through a very narrow canyon with ob on both sides and then gives way to the short 15th which plays right over the corner of the 14th green which can be seen in the pic.  Then the 16th tees off at the top of the canyon with the fairway 50-100 feet below.  I think that is the weak part of the course.

"Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent." - Judge Holden, Blood Meridian.

Bill_McBride

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2008, 12:11:38 AM »
I played Annandale once in 1962, in a match against LA State.   I liked the feel of the holes going up into the canyons, and a lot of nice terrain changes.

Not much more, that was a long time ago!

What I do remember very clearly though, was how I lost the first hole in my singles match that day.  It was one of those days where you couldn't see very far, a combination of haze and smog.  We both hit pretty good drives in the fairway and you couldn't see much of the green.  I hit a 4 iron toward the middle of the green, and my opponent followed suit.

When we got up to the green I was 20' away and his ball was in the hole!  :o

That was one tough match.....

TEPaul

Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2008, 12:30:02 AM »
I don't know the place but from those comprehensive photos, I'm impressed, particularly the bunkers.

Brian Silva is a friend and basically he just cracks me up, always has. I surely wouldn't want to speak for him but last time I spoke to him I asked him if he'd consider coming back on here and he basically said: "What, are you nuts?"

Can't say I blame him.

From those photos, I'd have to say, great job Brian.

Thanks for those photos Jon.

DMoriarty

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2008, 12:32:35 AM »
I really liked the feel of the old 5th hole.  I wish I had a photo of it for comparison.

Here are three photos that fit together as a panorama, from the Library of Congress Collection, 1910.   I think much of the land in the foreground is no longer part of the course.  David can you tell?





Golf history can be quite interesting if you just let your favorite legends go and allow the truth to take you where it will.
--Tom MacWood (1958-2012)

David Stamm

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2008, 12:36:06 AM »
I really liked the feel of the old 5th hole.  I wish I had a photo of it for comparison.

Here are three photos that fit together as a panorama, from the Library of Congress Collection, 1910.   I think much of the land in the foreground is no longer part of the course.  David can you tell?

 


I can't. I've never been there. Jon might be able to tell. Great pics, BTW.
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

DMoriarty

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2008, 12:42:14 AM »
I really liked the feel of the old 5th hole.  I wish I had a photo of it for comparison.

Here are three photos that fit together as a panorama, from the Library of Congress Collection, 1910.   I think much of the land in the foreground is no longer part of the course.  David can you tell?

 


I can't. I've never been there. Jon might be able to tell. Great pics, BTW.

Wrong David.  I meant the one who lives two minutes from the course.  You're so vane.  I bet you think this post is about you.  Dont you? Dont you? Dont you?
« Last Edit: July 17, 2008, 12:44:37 AM by DMoriarty »
Golf history can be quite interesting if you just let your favorite legends go and allow the truth to take you where it will.
--Tom MacWood (1958-2012)

David Stamm

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2008, 12:44:56 AM »
I really liked the feel of the old 5th hole.  I wish I had a photo of it for comparison.

Here are three photos that fit together as a panorama, from the Library of Congress Collection, 1910.   I think much of the land in the foreground is no longer part of the course.  David can you tell?

 


I can't. I've never been there. Jon might be able to tell. Great pics, BTW.

Wrong David.  You're so vane.  I bet you think this post is about you.  Dont you? Dont you? Dont you?


I'm just so used to being called out anymore these days it was a automatic reaction..... :-[ 
"The object of golf architecture is to give an intelligent purpose to the striking of a golf ball."- Max Behr

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #22 on: July 17, 2008, 12:52:26 AM »
I think he's looking for DK....the locals should have a sense of the terrain. If not there's always the pinball wizard.

Based on what I saw from a few minutes in the clubhouse, I might extrapolate the club having some pack rats and a fair bit of information is intact. A couple of choice nuggets from my "Wang" moment in the dark of the grill...apologies for the flash:











You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

TEPaul

Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2008, 12:53:36 AM »
You know something---the trees and bushes and shit you boys got out there is a whole lot more interesting than most of what we have back here in the east.

But how much have the Japanese influenced you all that way at this point---a little or a lot?   :-\
« Last Edit: July 17, 2008, 12:55:20 AM by TEPaul »

Jon Spaulding

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Re: Annandale GC (Watson/Bell/Silva)(pics)
« Reply #24 on: July 17, 2008, 01:09:32 AM »
We come for the trees & bushes, but we stay for the sushi and cougars. :o
You'd make a fine little helper. What's your name?

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