[Scott_Burroughs]

Here's one that was requested awhile ago.  Unfortuantely, it's
name does not lend itself well to double entendre-ing and
clue giving.  It might not even be a Native American name.

[WilliamWang]

no, you're right scott, it's not a native american name.
rather, i believe, it is a french dancer's name.

[ChipOat]

Hmmm. I think I see a Biarritz just below the practice
area.  Otherwise, it looks like a bunch of worms in this one.

Is this the only AOTD to pick up a "normal" fairway mowing
pattern that I see or is this course's approach unusual?

Need clues.

[SPDB]

I love this place. Best collection of par 3s by this arch.

For some reason from the air, the bunkers look very strange - and not very geometric.

[WilliamWang]

chip - do you want us to pamper you in your ivory tower?
(there's a clue in above )

[SPDB]

The 12th hole (bottom center with 2 diag. cross bunkers), was supposed to be a "channel" hole.
the only other one i know of beside a certain
course that was built on a beach in Long Island.

[SPDB]

There is enough native american stuff around the course to
use as clues, including the town that this club in, and the
road that runs across the top, separating the 1st hole from
the range. That road has something in common with a past
AOTD.

[Scott_Burroughs]

William,

You mean there were 2 clues in your post, not 1!  I guess if
one half of the Dick Daley property course's design team
went to Vegas to try to win money, then that would also be a clue?

[THuckaby2]

Love the up and back mowing
pattern - very cool.

But gasp - are those CARTS
I see dotting some of the
fairways?

William Wang's clue has me
thinking of our most bitter
competitor, maker of
many cleaning and laundry
products as well as
PAMPERS and IVORY
soap... am I at least
going in the right direction there?

Need a few more clues for
this one.  

TH
tom.huckaby@CLOROX.com

[THuckaby2]

Scott answered my question!
So oh yes, this does have
something to do with
Clorox's bitter rival....

Location?

I looked up courses where said
rival is headquartered and nothing
jumped out...

Help!

TH

[Scott_Burroughs]

Huck,

Someone above mentioned a Biarritz sighting....



I noticed that there doesn't seem to be nearly as much
fairway bunkering as this archie normally would have.  Six
holes have no fairway bunkers.

[THuckaby2]

GOT IT!

I am so dense at times
it's scary.  

Thanks, Scott!

TH

[SPDB]

Scott - we can Hagge-L over why some of the bunkering
may look out of place. My sense is that there is a lot of bunkers that have been grassed over - you can see some
outlines in the aerial.


Take for instance the 17th, which moves E-W from the left
corner. Do you recognize that the hole is a tribute to a hole of
the same number in a sleepy university town in Scotland?

[Scott_Burroughs]

The hole before that has the only bunker of the style I was
referring to on the entire course.


"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." -'Big
Guy' Mr. Carlson.

http://freepages.tv.rootsweb.com/~eeyore/sounds/fly2.wav

[SPDB]

I am of the opinion that the short 11th, is better
than its sister hole in Southhampton. I hit a wedge
to ~ 4 ft. (pin was cut mid-right), bent down to pick up my tee, extremely pleased with my effort.
Walked up to the green, only to find my
ball sitting in the middle of the front bunker.
It is the toughest 130-140 you will find anywhere.

[Robert Kimball]

Whew!!  Kinda tough today, but I am pretty
sure I got it.  You are right, Scott, not too
many double-entendreing opportunites on the
name.  

I wonder if Pete Rose is banned here as well??!!

[Scott_Burroughs]

Not too many clues today.  Tough one for that.

This is Camargo Club, in Indian Hill, OH, just outside on
Cincinnati, designed by Seth Raynor.  Supposedly the best
set of par 3's of any Raynor influenced design, and some
consider of any course.

Besides the interesting logo (with a shoe that I assume has
something to do with the French dancer mentioned earlier.  
What is that with the rope on it in the center?):



A few pics can be found on the GCA write-up here:

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/camargo1.html


clues include:

Biarritz points to Raynor ("channel", too)

"pamper" and "ivory" refer Cincinnati-based Proctor &
Gamble products.  P&G is a "bitter" rival of Huckster's Clorox.

"1/2 of Dick Daley property course architects" refers to
Dan "Proctor" who co-designed Wild Horse in Nebraska, and
if he went to Vegas to try to win money he "gambles"
= "Proctor gamble"  

Native american town ("Indian Hill") and adjacent road
("Shawnee" Run like previous AOTD "Shawnee Inn")

I'm assuming Robert Von "Hagge" did some work here.

reference to Road Hole

"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." -'Big
Guy' Mr. Carlson - is a classic line from the TV show WKRP in Cincinnati.

Pete Rose played most of his career for the Cincinnati Reds.  
Even has a street named after him.

[WilliamWang]

the camargo club was started as an offshoot of the camargo
realty company which developed the village of indian hill in the
northeastern suburbs of cincinnati in the 1920s.

i think that's a riding crop in the center logo and also a polo
mallet.

there is still a camargo hunt club in cincinnati, but i don't
think it's connected with the camargo club.

the club donated their grounds for indian hill's fourth of july
celebration for many years, but have since discontinued
that tradition.

marie camargo is the french ballet dancer of the 18th century
from whom the club takes it's name, i believe.

[Scott_Burroughs]

You mean that's not a croquet mallet in the logo instead of a
polo stick?      Pinehurst has great croquet!

[Robert Kimball]

From the GCA write-up: mention of the von Hagge bunker work. . . .

4th hole, 455 yards; Perhaps the least offensive von Hagge bunkers dot the inside of this dogleg to the left. They serve as a general indication as to the flow of the hole.

[SPDB]

oddly enough i have the scorecard in my desk
drawer.

1. OUT
2. VALLEY
3. LEVEN
4. NARROW
5. EDEN
6. KNOLL
7. ALPS
8. BIARRITZ
9. LONG

10. SHINNECOCK
11. SHORT
12.CHANNEL
13. BOTTLE
14. HOGBACK
15. REDAN
16. PLATEAU
17. ROAD
18. HOME

What's strange about these holes, is that a number
seem to have been inappropriately named. The "leven"
hole doesn't appear to resemble the leven hole at NGLA (17),
in fact it is largely the opposite, uphill with no carry, or
negotiable hazard. Same goes with the Knoll hole,
comparing it to #13 at Piping, the two holes couldn't be
more different. I understand that the Channel and
Bottle holes were designed true to their names by Raynor,
 but were rejected by members as too difficult.
I would like to see some of Raynor's original plans, which
I imagine look a lot different than what is there today.

The alps hole is particularly interesting in that it is the only
one I know of that is laid out over a flat piece of land,
which is strange given that Camargo has plenty of land
on which a more appropriate alps hole could be routed.
still is a very interesting hole, though.

[Scott_Burroughs]

Sean,

The pic of the Alps hole on the write-up show a hill and virtually blind shot to the green (and over the blind bunkers).  Doesn't look terribly flat in the second half of the hole.  The Alps hole at Yeamans Hall is truly dead flat with no blindness/hill at all.

Camargo:


Yeamans Hall:

[SPDB]

Scott - its flat. that you can see the flag is proof enough.
the hill feature is also a function of the fact that the green is
somewhat sunken. I read the course review, and Ran notes
that the Biarritz is laid over level land - the alps hole occupies
the very same stretch. He also wonders where Raynor got
the fill for the biarritz - my guess is it came from the
punchbowl green of the alps hole.

its definitely flat, though.

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