[rjsimper]

Chester Washington isn't right next to LAX - it's in Hawthorne several miles away - Westchester is the one right next to LAX, with all 15 holes of its glory.

I believe Wilshire is one of the non NLE closest to USC's campus, as it's several miles east of LACC and well north of Chester Washington.

PS I use my real name because that's the rule and in exchange for the privilege of membership here, I follow the rules.

JK - Would you object if Mr. Woods joined this site with a first name other than Eldrick?

[Tom Huckaby]

Ryan - Wilshire would have been my best guess as well.  And yes... Westchester... the infamous back six.  Bring your hard-hat.

 

[Bob_Huntley]

Chester Washington isn't right next to LAX - it's in Hawthorne several miles away - Westchester is the one right next to LAX, with all 15 holes of its glory.


PS I use my real name because that's the rule and in exchange for the privilege of membership here, I follow the rules.

JK - Would you object if Mr. Woods joined this site with a first name other than Eldrick?

Ryan,

Tiger is his first name, he adopted by deed poll.

Bob

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

I think the OT threads are fun, just like when Pat and TE Paul go off into the hinderland on some obscure subject. Many of us have become friends and enjoy bantering around on OT subjects. One does not need to read them if one does not want too. No more than one could follow Pat and TE if they tried. I find this site to be a blessing which is evolving into something better all the time. I need to come to grips with the reality that many people read what we put forth here and give it weight and value beyond what was intended. A discussion group to me is significantly different than a position paper or a research document. I hope this stays a discusion group.

[RJ_Daley]

Thank you Tiger, well said!

I still think we ought to have an OT button on the left side of screen, although placing OT in the thread title is just as good.  

I want to know the people on here as much as I want to hear their opinions on GCA.  In fact, it helps to understand their POV when they say they like or dislike something on a golf course when you get some insight into their other likes and dislikes, IMHO.

Steve, oh yes that TUCO character was a hoot.

[Donnie Beck]

The bottom line is I remember very clearly the day Ran limited the board to 1500 members and requested that everyone post under their real names. I am here daily and don't recall that request being lifted.... After watching this board for several years I can say without a doubt posting under real names makes for a much better site. Over the last year this site has become a joke. The quality of the discussions is pathetic.. The OT posts are out of control... It is sad what this has become. A little accountability and class goes a long way.

[George Pazin]

After watching this board for several years I can say without a doubt posting under real names makes for a much better site. Over the last year this site has become a joke. The quality of the discussions is pathetic.. The OT posts are out of control... It is sad what this has become. A little accountability and class goes a long way.

Donnie, believe me when I say I have the utmost respect for you, but do you really believe this? It sounds more than a bit strong to me. I still find a great deal of interesting stuff, even amidst the OT threads and rankings threads. A quick scan of the topics on the first page shows well over half being on topic and full of information.

What do you feel is missing?

(Please take these questions in the spirit intended, one long time poster to another.)

[Tim Pitner]

I don't feel as strongly about the subject as John Kavanaugh does, but I can't think of a good reason why someone would be unwilling to post under their real name (assuming they have something to contribute), nor has anyone articulated one.  Is there a legitimate objection, Shivas, Racetrack George, etc?

[Patrick_Mucci]

The bottom line is I remember very clearly the day Ran limited the board to 1500 members and requested that everyone post under their real names. I am here daily and don't recall that request being lifted....

After watching this board for several years I can say without a doubt posting under real names makes for a much better site.

Over the last year this site has become a joke.

The quality of the discussions is pathetic..

The OT posts are out of control... It is sad what this has become. A little accountability and class goes a long way.

Donnie,

I couldn't agree more.

I will admit to an occassional foray into OT discussions, but, everything you said is on target.

OT topics and threads that ask inane questions should be deleted ASAP.

Like a lot of architecture, this site is being "dumbed down"

[Tom Huckaby]

Patrick:

An occasional foray?  OK, in the spirit of brotherhood, I'll let that go.  

As for the rest, Donnie's post assume this place was ever any different, which is by my take not a fair assumption at all.  GO back to the very old days and you'll see the same crap... just with less participants.

This forum is what it is, take it or leave it.

As for posting under one's own name, I've not opined before... but to me it's a tempest in a teapot.  How do I know you are really Pat Mucci and if there really is a Hamilton B. Hearst?  Anyone can post a fake name.... what's the big deal?

TH

[Patrick_Mucci]

An occasional foray?  OK, in the spirit of brotherhood, I'll let that go.  

I rarely, if ever, initiate an OT thread.
However, I plead guilty to occassionally participating in them.

As for the rest, Donnie's post assume this place was ever any different, which is by my take not a fair assumption at all.  GO back to the very old days and you'll see the same crap... just with less participants.

When you go back, examine the quality of the threads and the ratio of OT threads to Architectural threads.

This forum is what it is, take it or leave it.

Why not try to improve it ?

As for posting under one's own name, I've not opined before... but to me it's a tempest in a teapot.  How do I know you are really Pat Mucci and if there really is a Hamilton B. Hearst?  

Evindently, when we were playing at Sand Hills, HBH was posting on the site.  And, as you know, the only thing you can do at Sand Hills is play golf, eat, drink, have good conversations, or leave the door open in your room with the lights on before you go to dinner so that ten million bugs can have you for desert when you return.  A classic TEPaul move.

Anyone can post a fake name.... what's the big deal?

The big deal is responsibility and accountability.
AKA, INTEGRITY.

[Tom Huckaby]

Patrick:

Understand I don't disagree with the concepts of showing one's best self on here, having integrity, etc.  I also firmly believe that you are who you are and Hammy is who he is.  The specifics weren't the point....

The point is that this place has always ebbed and flowed, as did its predecessor forums.  People come and go, the level of discourse rises and falls, some people post under fake names while most use their own, troublemakers come on and try to ruin things... it's just the nature of the internet.  It seems silly to me to complain about.  As I say, it is what it is.

But mainly my point was Donnie seems to be longing for a time that never really did exist.  Not that that matters a whole hell of a lot, but well.....

[Patrick_Mucci]

Tom Huckaby,

Prior to this thread I had never discussed the issue with Donnie Beck, but, I felt as he did.  And, I"m not alone.
Numerous people have told me that the site is drifing away from its core values, that it's being diluted by OT and inane threads.

These people are knowledgeable individuals that I respect.

When you dilute your product, you cease to attract and retain valueable participants.

Donnie voiced a concern shared by many.

You can ignore it or you can try to improve the site with focused threads and intelligent discussions.

I've seen interesting threads go unaddressed.

Then, I've seen questions like, "how much do I tip my forecaddy ?" and "where can I get invited to play when I'm in _________?" get several pages.

Quality, not quantity is what should be strived for.

[Tom Huckaby]

Patrick:

Well, I've been around here as long as anyone more or less, and I'll humbly disagree.  I don't find the quality diluted at all... at least not any more than can be expected with the massive increase in participation PERIOD that has occurred over the years.  Perhaps you prefer discussions with 25 like-minded people... I kinda like the diversity.

In any case, of course we should strive for the best.  But then again I'm also way more interested in how much I should tip a forcaddie than the arts and crafts movement and how it pertains to golf course architecture, so perhaps I am not the best assessor of this.

BTW, I have also talked to many people who love the site the way it is today.... not surprising we run in different crowds.

 

TH

ps - the access thing is a totally separate issue, one I feel very safe in saying we are in concurrence on.

[Sean Leary]

If I just found GCA.com yesterday, had never seen it before, and started reading threads back for weeks, I wouldn't find it diluted or inane at all.  I would learn more than I could conceivably learn anywhere else on the planet.

[Patrick_Mucci]

If I just found GCA.com yesterday, had never seen it before, and started reading threads back for weeks, I wouldn't find it diluted or inane at all.  I would learn more than I could conceivably learn anywhere else on the planet.

Sean,

Ran has you listed as having been registered on this site as of
February 29, 2004, that's two years and 8 months ago.

False in one ...... false in many.

[Chris Kane]

Did you actually read Sean's post Patrick?

[Tom Huckaby]

Did you actually read Sean's post Patrick?

Of course he didn't - it refutes his take, and in a very perfect manner, I might add.

Chris, you have to realize obstinance and obfuscation are Patrick's standard operating procedures.  Just grin and take him for what he is - a loveable old curmudgeon, the ancient mariner of this site.

TH

[Voytek Wilczak]

If I just found GCA.com yesterday, had never seen it before, and started reading threads back for weeks, I wouldn't find it diluted or inane at all.  I would learn more than I could conceivably learn anywhere else on the planet.

Sean,

Ran has you listed as having been registered on this site as of
February 29, 2004, that's two years and 8 months ago.

False in one ...... false in many.

False teeth?

[Michael Dugger]

It comes down to this.  Many of us have profited greatly by being on this site and it is very popular in the golfing world.  

That is quite possibly the most absurd thing I've ever read here.

Surely, I have not!!!

Maybe you midwesterners take your internet personalities a little more serious than us here in Oregon.

[Tiger_Bernhardt]

Okie dokie, now Pat has chimed in. Huck, please take my advice and run for the hills, any hills. Mucci is on the warpath and actually misread a post. Sean I agree with you.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Sean Leary,

I missed the "If" in your post.
My appologies.

There's no doubt that you would have learned a lot.

But, think how much more you would have learned four years ago.

[Tom Huckaby]

EUREKA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please someone mark this date for posterity - this is the first, and only time, in the long history of this forum that Mr. Mucci has even hinted at imperfection.

See Patrick, I knew there was hope for you.

 

As for the substance... I was here 4 years ago - he would have learned less, I think.  What he would have received more is group-speak.

TH

[Patrick_Mucci]

EUREKA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please someone mark this date for posterity - this is the first, and only time, in the long history of this forum that Mr. Mucci has even hinted at imperfection.

That's because it rarely occurs.

[Sean Leary]

Sean Leary,

I missed the "If" in your post.
My appologies.

There's no doubt that you would have learned a lot.

But, think how much more you would have learned four years ago.

No worries.

4 years ago, the topics were being addressed for the 1st and second time.  Now the same topics are coming up over and over again and for an avid, long timer it certainly gets repetitive.  Hell you' ve been called out for starting similar threads at times.  If you read here every day, its bound to happen because there is only so much to talk about.

You clearly try harder than anybody on here to start more thought provoking threads than anybody else, and for that you should be thanked and appreciated.  But different people get different things out of this site (access, etc ), and I am OK with that as it is.

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