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Tim Taylor

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Hershey CC South / Parkview
« on: April 19, 2006, 10:02:03 AM »
I was just having some fun looking at Google aerials of the courses I played in/around Harrisburg when first taking up the game. This lead me to the Golf Hershey web site where I stumbled across a note saying that Parkview has been closed.

For a kid who played his formative golf at Sportsmen's, Manada, and Sunset, Parkview was the "good" course we would save money to play once or twice a year.

Does anybody know what happened?

TimT

Steve_ Shaffer

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Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2006, 10:13:40 AM »
Tim

It's 130 acres available for development by Hershey Entertainment.

Here's the story:

http://tinyurl.com/pdgcw

www.pennlive.com/golf/patriotnews/index.ssf?/base/sports/1131099877220650.xml&coll=1
« Last Edit: April 19, 2006, 10:15:06 AM by Steve_ Shaffer »
"Some of us worship in churches, some in synagogues, some on golf courses ... "  Adlai Stevenson
Hyman Roth to Michael Corleone: "We're bigger than US Steel."
Ben Hogan “The most important shot in golf is the next one”

Mike_Cirba

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2006, 10:18:57 AM »
I was really saddened to read this recently.

It's where the PA State High School tournament was often held back in the 70s, when it was probably in the top 5 best public venues in the state.

It also made the first Golf Digest list of the best 50 public courses in the country back in the 70s.

The hole numbering changed a few times, but the 9th and 10 holes I remember were among my favorites anywhere.  Also, there were a few outstanding par threes including one severely uphill, and a few cutesy holes that wound along a creek that were lovely.

You hate to see the good ones go...

Mike_Cirba

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2006, 10:22:09 AM »
Tim,

On a semi-related note since you mentioned it, do you have any idea who designed the back nine holes at Sunset Golf Course?

I know the front nine was from Ed Ault in the 60s when the course was part of the Airforce military complex nearby.  It's pretty good, as well.  The back nine was built in the 70s, but I've never been able to find any information as to who designed it.

Thanks for any help!
 

Tim Taylor

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2006, 10:32:17 AM »
What a bummer! I remember the steeply up hill par 3 too. Never seen anything like it before or since. Not sure of the hole numbering since I moved, but the hardest hole to me was always #4 - long drive over a chasm, uphill approach to an impossibly back-to-front sloped green. It was a fun course that was always in great shape and had some things that the others I mentioned just didn't have - even though I didn't know crap about architecture back then, I could still tell that there was something special at Parkview.

Mike, my interest in GCA only dates back a few years while my time playing in Central PA ended in 1989 when I graduated from Shippensburg and moved to VA. So no idea about Sunset's architect. I do remember the cool drop shot par 4 10th tho! And the jets landing at nearby Harrisburg International Airport. It always cracked me up that it was international! What do they have? Like one flight a day to Toronto or something :)

My best back from Houston to Lancaster recently and we'd been talking about playing all those courses again, just for kicks and grins. Guess we can cross Parkview off the list.

TimT

Mike_Cirba

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2006, 11:10:55 AM »
The two splendid holes I mentioned can be seen at the far right-most side of this aerial.

The first was a swinging dogleg left par five with a really strategically used creek intervening.

The next is a lengthy par four which required a steeply uphill drive over a chasm with an approach to a devilishly sloped convex green (#4 in Tim's description)

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=Hershey,+PA&t=k&om=1&ll=40.283749,-76.667683&spn=0.007628,0.021458

Mark Leo

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2006, 12:09:53 PM »
What a shame.  I can remember playing in the PA High School Championships there back in the 80's.  Some very good players have played competitive golf there.  Long live Parkview!

Kyle Harris

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2006, 03:03:41 PM »
Manada? I liked it.

Play the US Publinks Qualifier there. Coincidentally, the US Junior Am qualifier that same year was at Hershey West - two weeks before the then Buy.com Tour came though.

Tim Taylor

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Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2006, 04:59:28 PM »
Someone told me a few years back that Manada had received some irrigation upgrades and was in much better shape. I remember it as a big ole patch of weeds. Not that it mattered much. I didn't have a chance in hell of breaking 100 back then anyways.

Another course I enjoyed back in the day (mid-late 80s) was Monroe Valley. I used to be in the National Guard at Ft. Indiantown Gap and I'd sneak over to Monroe sometimes as soon as they dismissed us from weekend duty.

TimT

Manada? I liked it.

Play the US Publinks Qualifier there. Coincidentally, the US Junior Am qualifier that same year was at Hershey West - two weeks before the then Buy.com Tour came though.

Matt_Ward

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2006, 08:02:43 PM »
Parkview had a major re-routing a number of years back. The old 18th -- the superb S-shaped par-5 with the creek cutting into play was a grand hole indeed. I believe they changed that when the clubhouse was moved. The new routing had it as the 3rd hole.

The hole that followed -- the existing 4th -- was also a tough long par-4.

Parkview was designed by Maurice McCarthy who also did the original 18 at Hershey.

You have to say one thing about Parkview -- it was built on a touch site yet the overall routing works very well.

Sorry to see it go.

Mike_Cirba

Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2006, 11:20:23 AM »
Another course I enjoyed back in the day (mid-late 80s) was Monroe Valley. I used to be in the National Guard at Ft. Indiantown Gap and I'd sneak over to Monroe sometimes as soon as they dismissed us from weekend duty.

TimT


Tim,

For a long time the Harrisburg area public courses (with the exception of Hershey Parkview, RIP) were like a who's who of 60's design.

Some examples;

Armitage - Ed Ault
Cumberland - James Harrison/Ferdinand Garbin
Felicita - David Gordon (Formerly Colonial CC?)
Shade Mountain - Ed Ault
Manada - David Gordon
Lost Creek - Ed Ault
Monroe Valley - Ed Ault
Sportsmans - James Harrison/Ferdinand Garbin
Sunset - Ed Ault (first nine)

Tim Taylor

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Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2006, 12:43:43 PM »
Man, this thread is bringing back some memories.

I never had any idea who designed Cumberland. I went to college at Shippensburg. We could get $7 passes to play all day. I remember walking 54 holes several times back in 87, 88. My best friend and I play it every year or two just for kicks. It's a pretty decent course from the back tees, although the loss of the big tree on 17 has radically changed the nature of that hole.

Colonial CC is still Colonial CC. I grew up two blocks from there on Linglestown Road. My friends and I used to hunt for lost balls and sell them.

Felicita used to be called something else ... for some reason Fishing Creek Valley CC or some such is sticking in my brain. Maybe Blue Mountain CC?

I made my first ace on #14 at Armitage. I made two aces before I ever broke 90 and haven't come within two feet since.

TimT

Tim,

For a long time the Harrisburg area public courses (with the exception of Hershey Parkview, RIP) were like a who's who of 60's design.

Some examples;

Armitage - Ed Ault
Cumberland - James Harrison/Ferdinand Garbin
Felicita - David Gordon (Formerly Colonial CC?)
Shade Mountain - Ed Ault
Manada - David Gordon
Lost Creek - Ed Ault
Monroe Valley - Ed Ault
Sportsmans - James Harrison/Ferdinand Garbin
Sunset - Ed Ault (first nine)

Dan Herrmann

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2006, 04:52:19 PM »
What about Caledonia State Park's course?  I've never played but when I saw it, it seemed to be caught in a 1920's time warp.

Craig_Rokke

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Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2006, 08:43:48 PM »
Dan-

I assume you speak of the course in Fayettevillle, near Gettysburg? Though I've not seen the course, I remember
looking pretty hard in my books, and on the net, to try to determine who built this 1924 course. No luck.

Dan Herrmann

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Re:Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2006, 10:21:06 PM »
Craig - that's the one - right off US30 up in the state park.  I think it's like a golf time capsule.  Not necessarily great golf, but it's worth some study - if nothing else, but to see how municipal golf architecture has changed.

Greg Hohman

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2020, 06:40:54 PM »
For those who enjoyed Parkview, a perhaps bittersweet tour of the property as a x-c course, not the worst of fates:


https://pa.milesplit.com/articles/221802/take-a-tour-of-hersheys-parkview-xc-course


Could golfers really hear people on the roller coaster(s?) of the amusement park?
newmonumentsgc.com

SB

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Re: Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2020, 11:52:44 AM »
For those who enjoyed Parkview, a perhaps bittersweet tour of the property as a x-c course, not the worst of fates:


https://pa.milesplit.com/articles/221802/take-a-tour-of-hersheys-parkview-xc-course


Could golfers really hear people on the roller coaster(s?) of the amusement park?
From one of the tees, it was only 180 yards to the park.

Jim Sherma

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Re: Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2020, 12:01:35 PM »
Hershey Parkview is an NLE near and dear to my heart. For 15 or so years prior to moving to Hershey Parkview was a regular road trip for me from the Lehigh Valley and it never was anything other than a great day out. I moved to Hershey right as it was getting ready to close and I played it on it's last day open on a cold day in November.


Wonderful old Maurice McCarthy course with a bunch of holes that could result in a wide spread of scores. There were many different numberings for the course over the years first driven by the move to the new club house and then they would take the uphill par 3 in and out of the routing for some reason. This necessitated making a par five a par 4 - par 3 to fill in the 18 holes.


Some of the great holes included:


Original #1 that started from the old clubhouse - Crazy difficult hole ending at an elevated green smack next to the OB railroad tracks. Forces carry drive similar to Phoenixville's 1st but much more demanding. With the old equipment an excellent drive might get you to a 3 or 4 iron up the hill for your second.


Original #8 - Slight dogleg par 4 with the green in a corner of the property with OB left and long. If you held your drive along the inside of the dogleg near the drop-off you had a much easier second. However, there was all the room in the world to the right and it was very easy to just bail out there, leaving yourself a longer shot from the rough to a green close by the OB from a lousy angle.


Original #13 - Short par 4 that had a meandering stream moving down the middle of the playing corridor. Your options were to play it something like 7-iron - 7-iron to an area where the stream jigged left to leave a wider landing area - or, you could blow a driver up the right side and try to either hit the thin neck of fairway or even get it to release up to the green.


Original #15-#18 - Great run of holes - 15 had the green hard next to a public road - 16 had a beautiful fall away green - 17 had a weird drop off in the right side of the fairway an a beautiful very large elevated green - 18 was a cool par 5 with a winding stream impacting every sot from the drive to how ever many mistakes you might make (I know I've scored everything from a couple of 3's to a bunch of 7's or worse.


The loss of the course was sad. The architecture and the history were both exceptional. Unfortunately it was land-locked and playing shorter and shorter. Even in the 90's there were 4 par 4's that could be driven in the right conditions. Also, it was the only land that was contiguous with Hershey Park that could be used for expansion. The course closed with the building of the Giant Center Arena (Used parts of 16 and 17). The park (and some new access roads) was expanded over parts of number 1, 2, 3, 4 and 18. I've walked the cross country course a few times and have some great memories.

MCirba

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Re: Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2020, 12:39:14 PM »
Jim,


I only played there once but it was quite the memorable course.  Thanks for the nice eulogy.
"Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent" - Calvin Coolidge

https://cobbscreek.org/

Chris_Blakely

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Re: Hershey CC South / Parkview
« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2020, 02:07:53 PM »
I only played the course once, but I remember a lot about the course.  I remember the severely uphill blind par three, I remember the original grand clubhouse that was not in use for the course anymore (the member I played with said they Hershey CC made them take out of use as it was more grand then theirs, I remember the green on the original #1 WOW . . .


All in all, it was a fun day of golf where I also played Galen Hall, Green Hills and the Hershey Hotel 9 hole course.


I believe I took film photos of all of the courses.  I have planned to get a negative image scanner for XMAS, if I do, I will try to upload some of them.  It was a very cool course.


Chris


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