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Matthew Mollica

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Refinements at Pasatiempo
« on: December 27, 2002, 04:46:47 AM »

Just a quick question regarding remodelling / refinements
at Pasatiempo. I was very interested to see that one particular design company has listed Pasa in the catalogue of courses on which they have previously been contracted.

Can someone enlighten me as to how often, by who, when, and the extent to which the course has been modified. I know I'm young, and on the other side of the world, but the only times I can remember, are April 2001, when #10? or #11? green was relaid, as well as many years ago, when the string of 6,7,8 became sectioned off with trees.

Matthew
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"The truth about golf courses has a slightly different expression for every golfer. Which of them, one might ask, is without the most definitive convictions concerning the merits or deficiencies of the links he plays over? Freedom of criticism is one of the last privileges he is likely to forgo."

Joel_Stewart

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Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2002, 10:02:01 AM »
You must be talking about Tom Doak and his team which worked on the course 3 years ago?

Perhaps Tom or Jim could comment but the 10th was the most work with the large bunker being restored.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Daniel Wexler

Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2002, 01:20:11 PM »
Well before Tom Doak (and not counting MacKenzie's early moving of #17 green, or the loss of the fairway tree at #16)....

-- Holes #2 (originally 510 yds) and #10 (originally 495 yds) were converted from par 5s to par 4s, I believe to avoid crossing entry road.

-- #6 shortened when original tee (located to right of #5 green) was removed.

-- At #9, the present green was built in the 30’s (possibly by MacKenzie), though for a time this version and the original existed side-by-side.

-- At #10 and #12, barrancas fronting the putting surfaces were filled in/minimized.

-- At #15, some wild bunkering within the fronting barranca was largely grassed over.

-- Some MASSIVE tree growth.

-- A fair number of original bunkers are missing throughout, though having examined pre-War aerials, I can categorically refute the claim (made in Margaret Koch's The Pasatiempo Story) that "During the 1940s, approximately 100 bunkers were removed to facilitate play time."

Cornish & Whitten list Robert Muir Graves, Gary Roger Baird, R.T. Jones Jr. and Clark Glasson (no middle name?) as having made changes but when I inquired a few years back, the club could not confirm the presence of all four.

I'm quite certain that Tom Doak has made a positive difference, but Pasatiempo does not play precisely as Dr. MacKenzie designed it....

DW



« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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THuckaby2

Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2002, 02:14:58 PM »
Well said - thank you Daniel!  A more perfect source couldn't have possibly appeared to answer this.

The most important thing here is this:  "Pasatiempo does not play precisely as Dr. MacKenzie designed it...."

Boy, ain't that the truth.  As much as they love to sell the "McKenzie design" aspects, it's not very close to his intent, and it's not going back.  The Doak group has done great things towards TRYING to make this happen though, which is encouraging... but when you contemplate all the changes that have occurred, it's easy to see today's course isn't Mackenzie's, to a large extent.

Interesting tidbit - last Saturday, I complimented them on the great tree removal between 1 and 9... there's as little growth there now as there has been in my 21 years playing the course... I was told Mother Nature did a lot of the work, in our recent storms!  Natural deforestation... gotta love it.  Now if only she'd attack the forest around 6-7-8...  ;)

TH
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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Matthew Mollica

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Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2002, 04:53:52 PM »
Thank you for the in-depth reports of course changes at Pasa guys.

Your accurate answers are really appreciated !

As an aside, is it true that Mackenzie's ashes are spread over the course ???

Matthew
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"The truth about golf courses has a slightly different expression for every golfer. Which of them, one might ask, is without the most definitive convictions concerning the merits or deficiencies of the links he plays over? Freedom of criticism is one of the last privileges he is likely to forgo."

Tom Doak

Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2002, 12:03:20 AM »
Daniel:  I'm not sure if there are any courses which play precisely the way that MacKenzie (or any other designer of the 1920's) left them.  We have "unfilled" most of the barranca in front of the tenth green, though.

Matthew:  Prior to our work at #10, we have rebuilt the first tee, restored the bunkers at the first green (removing a frontal bunker which wasn't original), restored the bunkers as best we could on #9 (the road is a bit in the way of the left greenside bunker), and restored bunkers on #12 and #13 and #15.  There's a lot more which may be done someday, and a few things which really cannot be done because of safety concerns.

« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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ed_getka

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Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2002, 09:45:12 AM »
Tom,
 Did you do any work on the right side of #2 green at Pasa?
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:00 PM by 1056376800 »
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"Perimeter-weighted fairways", The best euphemism for containment mounding I've ever heard.

Bill_McBride

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Re: Refinements at Pasatiempo
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2002, 09:51:54 AM »
Tom Doak, that front bunker on #1 worked well when it was a par 5, but not when it's a long par 4!  

Looking at the recent aerial of the course (although pre-Doak work I guess from view of #10), there appears to be a fully bunkered green next to the first tee.  Is that a practice green?  Looks pretty high maintenance for a public access albeit high dollar course!

Looking forward to a couple of rounds at Apache Stronghold mid January -- hope it's not too cold!

Bill McBride
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 07:00:12 PM by -1 »
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