[Philip Gawith]

I am curious as to what the best advice is to someone who wants to become a golf course architect. What should they study? Where are the best places to study - in the US and elsewhere? If you are not a big name player, do you need an academic qualification to get going?

[Michael Dugger]

Oh good lord, this question again.

My advice.....pray to God.

[Jeff_Mingay]

1. Win a lottery to bankroll the 10 years it'll take you to find steady work;

2. Make very friendly connections in wealthy circles throughout the world; and,  

3. Forget architecture and agronomy, study salesmanship  

[Philip Gawith]

I did not think it was an original question, but nor did I realise it would elicit such counsels of despair! Clearly easier to turn pro!

Can anyone point me towards the threads where this was previously discussed? I would still be interested in the received wisdom about how people go about it, even if the the consensus seems to be that it is a hopeless endeavour.

[Jeff_Mingay]

Philip,

Turn pro... at least you might convince a few corporations to sponsor your efforts.

It's much more difficult to convince a company to sponsor you're endeavours in golf course architecture  

[Tyler Kearns]

Philip,

I think a strong majority of golf architects who have entered the field in the last 20 years have a formal education in architecture. I do not know of a under-graduate program that has anything relating specifically to golf course architecture. The MLA (Master's Landscape Arch.) program at Kansas State offers courses dealing directly with golf design, as does St. Andrew's University in Scotland. Without an education in architecture, it would seem an "architect" would have to rely on others for the technical aspects of the trade, which are essential to getting a project approved and built.

TK  

[Philip Gawith]

Alas Jeff, a 7 handicap 41 year old PR consultant is neither turning pro nor becoming an architect! My question is more a case of curiosity than career advice (though one can dream!)

[ed_getka]

Philip,
  From what I have observed and learned over the years. Most seem to get the landscape architecture degree at some point. Getting out in the field and getting your hands in the dirt seems to be the biggest key. One should be prepared to do this for free and keep pestering the people you would like to learn from. I believe Tom Doak approached Pete Dye numerous times before Pete gave him an opportunity. Tom would probably be a good one to answer this question since he takes on interns each year. Martin Bonnar is not long removed from school and he would be a good one to ask this question.
    Diplomatic and selling skills are VERY important from what I have seen, and once you have the basic skills to work as an architect the ability to sell yourself and deal with egos becomes very important.
     Read Driving the Green by John Strawn, is advice I would give to anyone thinking about going into the field.
     

[Philip Gawith]

Thanks Ed - I had not heard of that book. I will look it up. Oh to be 20 years younger!

Separately, are you coming over this way again this year? If not, what trip do you have lined up to fill the space?

[Mike Nuzzo]

Philip,

Another book to look up will be the up and coming Golf Architecture III - by Paul Daley.
The full title of my essay is "Where else to begin:  Non-traditional paths to becoming a golf course designer" (it was abbreviated in Paul's table of contents that he recently posted).

I detailed the non-traditional entrance of several architects and interwove some of my varried experiences of getting my start.  While I've always been a designer, there were a few other product types that I practiced on first.

Have you done any PR for local firms?  That's how you'd get your start.  I'm sure they could use some.  (Don't forget the builders, developers and individual clubs)

Cheers

[Michael Plunkett]

"built it and they will come."    at least in the 90's

[Tom_Doak]

Philip:  I'll throw in a couple that Jeff Brauer left out:

4.  Be so naive and/or so determined that you can ignore the strong odds against success.  

5.  Be happy just being a small part of the big picture, and be humble if you ever get the opportunity to design on your own.

6.  Be fully prepared to take advantage of said opportunity.

I don't discourage anyone from attending college, and future clients will probably respect you more if you have a college degree (at least, the Cornell story works for me; though I'm curious if other designers believe their college background was important in business).  However, you are not going to learn too much about golf architecture at any college; you're going to learn it over a long apprenticeship in the business.

[Mark Brown]

By the grace of God, I am now co-designing an 18 hole resort course in the Pocono Mountains-my first. I didn't get into the golf business until I was 35, no formal training in anything I've done since 1983. In 1981 I moved from PA to Hilton Head Is. as a financial analyst At GE. Hated it. My dream was to design and build golf courses. I had no money.

 Started a local golf magazine in '83 then Links Magazine in '87, with no money of my own. After editor at Links, I did Golf writing, photography, PR, Marketing,'95 to 2004 consulting for golf communities. Never worked for anyone because I had no experience. I figured to reach my goals I would have to start my own businesses.

From 1983 to present I spent my spare time reading arch. books, talking to and getting to know architects and spending time on sites with them. Learned a lot from Smyers, Coore, Doak. And played all over the U.S. and British Isles.

Worked with Terry LaGree, CEO at Black Diamond for one year. He's a developer, golf course builder and designer. We left Black Diamond 9 months ago, formed parnteship, got Pocono job and started Prestwick 12 Golf (to build affordable courses with 6 hole loops instead of 9) and are promoting and developing it now. Also for cash flow I'm creating Golf Real Estate OnLine a comprehensive website for golf communities.

End and  beginning of story.

If you want something don't take no for an answer, learn from other people, read and never doubt your faith in yourself and God.  

[Jeff_Mingay]

Hey Tom D.,

Your typo is one of the greatest compliments I've received in my young life...

Being mistaken for Jeff Brauer  

[ed_getka]

Philip,
  Dornoch is never far from my mind, but my next overseas trip will be to Australia, most likely next winter (their summer). This year I will be at Bandon for the opening of the new course for three days. Later in the summer or early fall a trip to the east coast for a week.
    When are you coming over for a visit?
 

[Philip Gawith]

Thanks for the feedback:

Mike - I have ordered PD's book so I look forward to reading your contribution.

Tom - thanks for your thoughts. I am interested, though not surprised, at the relatively low premium placed on the utility of an academic education. The only analogy I can think of, in my limited experience, is with journalism, something much better learnt "on the job" from people who can do it, rather than at some institution (though the latter does no harm).

Mark - thanks for relaying your story, and a great story it is too. I trust the course is only the first of many!

I think I am getting the gist - a lot of luck, a lot of self-belief, a lot of patience, a lot of perserverance, a high risk-appetite. And that's before you get to talent!

[ian]

LUCK

1. You can accumulate all the knowledge and all the training but never see your own project or even a job.

2. You may find your work limited to renovations or smaller roles in projects.

3. You may shape and build for others and very rarely get an opportunity to design in the field.

4. Openings to apprentice are far and few between.

BUT, you can't be a golf architect without putting in all the time, and by hustling your ass off to get projects.

[Tyler Kearns]

Philip,

Just ran across this today, from the 1991 ASGCA membership who have academic degrees, 53% have degrees in landscape architecture, 7.6% in turfgrass/agronomy, 7.6% in civil engineering and 3.4% in architecture.  

TK

[Philip Gawith]

that leaves about 30% then for classicists, philosphers and other riff-raff!

[Sean_A]

Philip

Don't get down on riff- raff.  Us folks are the flotsam and jetsam of life.  You surely wouldn't want us wasting our lives on golf architecture.

Ciao

Sean

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