[ed_getka]

We have had a last minute cancellation for golf at Bandon Dunes on June 1-3. Anyone interested in joining us contact me at 415 353-1565 or via IM here or email egetka@earthlink.net. June 1 Opening day festivities Bandon Trails 36 holes, June 2   36 holes Pac Dunes,  June 3  18 holes Bandon Trails  18holes Bandon Dunes. We are staying in the Lily Pond cottages on site at Bandon Dunes, but that can be changed if necessary.

[Joel_Stewart]

I'm just back from Bandon and played Bandon Trails twice.  Its a very special place and a wonderful addition to the resort.  

My expectations were very high, and in hindsight almost unrealistic.  If you are expecting another Friars Head or Sand Hills (which I was) then you may be disappointed.

I'll post more later.

[ed_getka]

Joel,
   I would love to hear more of your thoughts on the course.

[Mike Erdmann]

Ed, just sent you an IM.

[PThomas]

I wish I could, I wish I could.....

[Joel_Stewart]

Joel,
   I would love to hear more of your thoughts on the course.

I'm not sure what you want me to say and I don't want to spoil it for you or the others that are heading up.  Its obviously very-very good but I don't think its as good as Pacific or Bandon Dunes.

There are 4 or 5 world class golf holes.  The par 3's are brilliant.  A few of the par 4's are also brilliant and a few are just OK.  The par 5's although pretty and well bunkered are disappointing and almost forgettable.  Every par 5 plays straight (although 16 is straight up a hill) and each is reachable in two if you hit it well and in the right place.  The fairways are over 100 yards wide in spots, almost excessively wide.  The course like Bandon and Pacific Dunes is all fescue  including the greens.

The course is well thought out and every detail is executed nearly perfect by Bill and his staff which is what you would expect.  Bill Coore takes his time and does everything the right way.  The shorter holes have smaller greens and the longer holes have larger greens.  Most of the greens give you many different options on how you want to approch.  The greens have some interesting undulations but not as severe as Sand Hills or Friars Head.  The greens are currently running at about a 5 on the stimp because they are new and not being rolled.  Most of the people in our group ended up putting with 3 woods to help offset the slow speed.  The greens at Pacific and Bandon Dunes are rolling at about 8 or 9 so the entire resort is not about speed.

All in all its spectacular and I'm still in a buzz.  Its probably not a Golf Digest Top 100 course but if Trump International and Rich Harvest can make it then why not Bandon Trails.

[Michael Dugger]

Joel,

I commend you for going on the record regarding the golf course in a tasteful, yet still honest, fashion.  Everyone has unrealistic expectations, probably, and we ought to give the place a chance to grow on us and mature a little before totally commiting to a position.

How does the transition from dunes to meadow to trees and back again work?  

What are your 4-5 world class holes out there?  

[RJ_Daley]

Well stated Mike...

[Anthony_Nysse]

The greens are fescue...? I always thought that fescue was a fatter bladed grass; a fine fescue for fairways can be mowed at .5". Weren't they doing some test plots with some poa plugs (aerification plugs) from Eugune CC a little while back to see if it's be fesable at BTrails?

Tony Nysse
Asst. Supt.
Long Cove Club
HHI, SC

[Joel_Stewart]

I'll answer quickly because my kids are yelling at me to take them to the pool.

Anthony:
The entire course is a mix of fescue made up mostly of slender creeping red fescue.

Michael:
I agree and trying not to pass judgement.  These are my first impressions.  The course is generally cut through trees and sand dunes so there is not a lot of maturity except for the grass.  7 of the holes have been finished for over a year.

Alex:
You can see the ocean from a few holes.  The first hole is directly to the right (up the sand dune) of the 18th hole on Bandon Dunes.  The view from the black tee on the first hole is amazing which shouldn't be missed.  The view from the tee on the 14th is also pretty nice.

[Joel_Stewart]

How does the transition from dunes to meadow to trees and back again work?  

The transition is seemless almost perfect until after the 13th.  Then you have a long steep uphill walk that the management is still discussing.  I believe they are going to have to shuttle people to the 14th tee which is a drivable steep downhill par 4, 320 from the black and 303 from the blue tee.  Its a very unusual hole with a "P" shaped green and two deep bunkers on the front right.

The closing 6 holes are back and forth trees, forest, sand dunes and a little awkward.  I need to ask Bill Coore about this strategy?  The 18th is in the dunes with a semi blind uphill tee shot followed by an uphill second shot to the green.  Its 428 from the black and 400 from the blue but plays shorter.  I hit 9 iron both days for my second shot.

[ed_getka]

Joel,
  Thanks for the feedback. As for the par 5's even though they are straight, do they play straight, or is there bunkering that forces you to move around on your way to the green?
   I'm not expecting Sand Hills, but given your first impression where would you put it on the Doak scale?
    That pool is either heated or you are not in the Bay Area today.

[Joel_Stewart]

As for the par 5's even though they are straight, do they play straight, or is there bunkering that forces you to move around on your way to the green?
   I'm not expecting Sand Hills, but given your first impression where would you put it on the Doak scale?
   

Ed:
The par 5's have lots of dunes or bunkers and make you think slightly.  Given the width of the fairways though, you can miss it badly and still recover easily.  There are also generous chipping areas around most of the greens.

Tom is going up in a few weeks so I'll be interested in his thoughts.  Don't get me wrong, its a very-very good golf course and I would give it a 7 or maybe an 8.  Trying to compare it to Friars Head, Sand Hills or Pacific & Bandon Dunes is tough because those 4 are world class courses so its a little unfair.  

[Steve_Roths]

Joel,

You mentioned the quality of the par 3's on the course.  I played the Preview 7 holes last year and was impressed by the three that I saw.  #'s 2,5, & 17  Are there any more par 3's on the course and how do they play?

[Joel_Stewart]

Are there any more par 3's on the course and how do they play?

The 12th hole is the other par 3.  It plays 250 from the back tee and 215 from the front.   It is flat with trees and large native flower plants going up the left side and numerous bunkers.  The green is huge, maybe one of the largest greens on the course.  There is nothing in the front which allows you to run the ball onto the green.  There is also a large mound on the right of the green allowing you a helping bounce should you try to fly it.  Wonderful fun hole.  

[Matt_Ward]

Joel:

You initially said, "My expectations were very high, and in hindsight almost unrealistic.  If you are expecting another Friars Head or Sand Hills (which I was) then you may be disappointed."

Can you tell me why you would place any course -- particularly one you have not played -- in such a very high esteem thru self-created pre-spin? Might it be possible you were setting yourself up for a lesser overall assessment?

Joel -- if you had 20 rounds at the facility how would YOU divide them up for play?

Thanks ...

P.S. One last question -- how much of the layout is more a testament to what is created for the "eye" as opposed to the intrinsic qualities of high caliber shotmaking?

[Joel_Stewart]

Can you tell me why you would place any course -- particularly one you have not played -- in such a very high esteem thru self-created pre-spin? Might it be possible you were setting yourself up for a lesser overall assessment?

Joel -- if you had 20 rounds at the facility how would YOU divide them up for play?

Three reasons would be my best off the cuff answer.
1.  I've been to Bandon two previous times and know the property and possibilty for a great golf course on that site.  Furthermore, you have a great owner that will spare no expense.
2. C&C reputation including what I feel are 2 of the best courses in the country, Friars Head and Sand Hills.
3. Photos that have leaked out seemed out of this world, including Dan Kings, Sandy Tatums review in Golf Digest and on the Bandon web site.

I would have expected great things if it was Gil Hanse, Tom Doak or C&C.  I go to many golf courses expecting great things.  Don't get me wrong, its a great place and a very-very good golf course.  

If I had to divide them up for 10 rounds, I would play Pacific Dunes 4 times and Bandon Dunes/Bandon Trails 3 times.  One of the other guests in our group said he would play Bandon Trails for medal play, Bandon Dunes for match play and Pacific Dunes for fun.

[Craig Van Egmond]

Joel,

     I actually think it was very refreshing for someone to post their honest opinion  about a highly hyped and highly anticipated golf course that doesn't come off as butt kissing.  Expectations play an important part in these  things and what makes a golf course great is open to opinion. In fact I think the word great gets thrown around way too much.  

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