Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: DBE on October 01, 1999, 08:00:00 PM
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I have played a few nine hole courses that are good. These would include: The Dunes, New Buffalo, MI; Asherwood, Carmel, IN; Madison GC, Madison, NJ; and White Oak Plantation (Cedar 3squared), Yulee, FL. Surely there are other notable nine hole courses in the US.The Dunes is the best copy of Pine Valley I've ever seen. There are no tee markers. The winner of the previous hole selects where play from the next hole begins. The two par threes can be played between 120 and 220 yards, the par fours between 330 and 450 yards and the two par fives between 480 and 550 yards. There are many intimidating tee shots but the second time around you know there is lots of room in the fairways. Greens are undulating, but fair. Most difficult hole for me was the first. Tight looking straight par four. Tough to me because of the "no warm up rule". It's been there ten years and is only ten minutes from Lost Dunes. If you can get on, it will be one of the neatest experiences ever. If you can find it, you could hire yourself out as a guide for Tarzan. Michigan has some wonderful courses and a perfect day would be The Dunes in the morning and Lost Dunes in the afternoon. By the way, it shouldn't take more than three hours for a two-ball to play 18 holes there and there are no carts--caddies only.
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Why only nine holes? Private or Public? Who are the people behind it and who is the designer? Thanks
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David; Having been with the USGA you would probably know if a regulation golf course used no tee markers as at The Dunes, could the course be rated and sloped and could a player turn in a score for handicap purposes sans any tee, slope or rating inclusion?
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The Dunes is very, very private. There are only 70 members. $28k initiation/$4800 annual dues. Started by a Chicagoan by the name of Mike Keiser--yep, the same guy behind Bandon Dunes.They are a Chicago District GA member club. The CDGA rated the course from the middle of the various tees where they placed their metal disks. The ratings can always be adjusted using a table (on page 26 of the USGA Handicap manual) that explains how much to add or subtract to the ratings for the nearest set of rated tees based on the yardage difference. The player would have to manually input their course and slope rating into the computer. This is a fairly common occurance for good women golfers that play the men's tees.
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Whoops, third glass of wine--Dick Nugent, also based out of Chicago, designed the course.
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I have played Madison and Asherwood. Madison is old, tight and a somewhat crowded by mature trees. The greens are small and the shot values are wonderful. The 9th is the longest par 4 on the course. The drive is played up and past the top of a steep hill. If you start your drive right of the fairway and draw it back you can fly it over the roof of the clubhouse. Less than 100 yards from the green is a wide mature tree dead in the middle of the fairway. Just about every second shot to the green has to be played over the tree.Asherwood is a facinating course designed by Steve Smyers with two different routings (forward and backwards) and alternate routings within the two routings. Perhaps my favorite hole on the course is the 6th. A less than 300 yard par 4 with a shallow, wide plateaued green. Bunkers are strewn left, right and center at various distances off the tee. What ever club you decide to play from the tee you must choose your line carefully to avoid sand.The best nine hole I've played is Royal Worlington & Newmarket in England. The "Sacred Nine" according to Bernard Darwin. On an all together undramatic looking piece of ground. The course has three par 4 - 1/2's (only one of which is a par 5), two great par 3's and wonderful members. The green complexes are severe and fast. The bunkering is excellent. It was there that I found out what the seemingly oddly placed benches are for on British Isles courses while playing a foursome match.
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Although it would never be considered one of the best 9-holers,the Highland links at Truro would have to be one of the funnest.Dating from 1892 it is one of the oldest courses on Cape Cod. It sits on a bluff 200 feet above the Atlantic up against Highland Light. The turf is firm and it is very short,but you better have your wind game working. It might lack length and the condition is very spotty, but for shear enjoyment its hard to beat the links at Truro.
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Interesting posts by Dave Staebler and Tom MacWood. I'd like to know about any small acreage concepts that work well and why and those that don't and why, particularly as an addendum to a regulation course. Things like forward and backward routings and what they need to work properly (very large greens?)and also their drawbacks. Putting courses, par 3s etc. I sometimes hear other than good things about PV's short course. Why? Has anyone ever heard of a "circumference routing" that rings a regulation course and doesn't feel like you're turning right of left all day or anything like that?
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Another interesting,albeit quirky 9-holer is Little Marion. Just down the street from Kittansett this was the great George Thomas's 1st effort (1906) and it is a bizarre one.The par 34 2700 yard course features numerous stone walls,berms,hummocks,heavy rough and ultra small greens.The 9th is a par-3 of a little over 100 yards.Its green is completely blind due to two sand traps that rise up abruptly in front of the green. When you reach the putting surface you realize that these bunkers are resting against a stone wall directly in front of the green.
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I'm surprised that the name Whitinsville hasn't come up. I haven't played it, but many say it's among the best nine holes that Ross designed.Is there anyone out there who's played it?
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David Staebler is right about Royal Worlington and Newmarket -- superb (see the write-up on this site). I'm not sure if Asherwood would qualify as a nine-holer as there are something like 12 greens on the property that can lead to variations of 27 holes. The key to such a concept is that a crowded day would have 12 rounds there -- it is therefore easy to play the holes backwards. The impressive aspect of the course is not so much the routing (which, as you can imagine, takes a fair amount of thought), but the details in making the course look right forward and backwards. Each hole "looks" like it was designed to be played in that direction, yet turn around and the hole looks fine going the other way. It took some real work with the bunkering (one of Smyers's strengths) to get this right.
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Several of my listings of the top nine-hole courses have recently added another nine and thus forfeited their position. The two best: Rolling Rock Club in Ligonier, PA [Brian Silva adding nine to Donald Ross], and Harrison Hills in Attica, IN [Tim Liddy adding to Langford and Moreau].Rolling Rock was wonderful -- some of Ross' wildest greens ever -- but they were threatening to make a rule that you had to play the new nine first, because many of the members just wanted to play the original nine.Prairie Dunes started as nine holes, too -- and they're the best nine holes on the final 18. [That's 1, 2, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 17 and 18.]Whitinsville is terrific. The first hole is a great three-shot opener, the 2nd and 7th are excellent par threes, and the finisher is one of the great holes in golf. Two par-fours across the street, 3 and 4, aren't quite up to the rest, or it might even rate better than Royal Worlington & Newmarket.
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Can 9-hole courses be considered in any top-100 ranking? If not, should they be considered?
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In my view, yes. They are difficult to rank, however, as it is somewhat troubling to rank, say, Royal Worlington and Newmarket ahead of another course that has a terrific nine and a not-so-terrific nine -- are we assuming that if the nine-holer were 18 holes that the other side would be just as good as the existing nine? If so, that can be an awfully generous assumption.In the end, though, I suppose it all comes back to that all-encompassing criterion -- did the architect do as good a job as possible on that particular piece of land? This will take into account 9, 12 and 18 hole courses.
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I have gotten to the post a little late and have little experience with really good nine holers, but I would like to give my qualified vote to Whittinsville. I critically evaluated it a year ago riding around in a cart and looked, rolled a few balls on the greens went backwards over the course as well. I think one would have to go far to beat this kind of quality in nine holes and it must make the short list.1 the par 5 has a wonderfully heaving fairway as does 9. Some of the grens are pretty sloped back to front and even though 3 and 4 do suffer from a similarity of length as they are sandwiched in an added piece of land, they require different shots due to 3 uphill to a shallow green and 4 downhill to a deeper green. 5 has a lovely blind tee shot with a nautical bell in the fairway, a touch far too absent from american golf, other than at say Old Marsh or Long Cove.Several sets of tees allow an 18 hole round of sorts, but I really enjoy a nine as I played yesterday in the chill of dusk.Here's another questionGood par 3 9 holers? I seem to remember finding one on the West side of Chicago years ago near Oakbrook Mall. Can't remember the name and can't find it on the map. 9 quality par 3's. Or did I imagine or dream it in one of my golf orgies on a day off in the middle of a week where I'd play up to 3 (sometimes regretably forgettable) courses in a day, right after I got bitten by the architecture bug.Any help?
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I'm bringing this back up in relation to Tom's post about whats next. I believe high quality 9 hole courses can be a successful business in this day and age.
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Nine-hole courses? Damn, that sounds like a great idea for a book.
Anthony
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Anthony, didn't someone beat you to that idea..., oh nevermind.... ;D
I believe the biggest obstacle for nine hole courses is the need to overcome the general belief they can't be as good as 18 hole courses.
I spent four years at a small private 9 hole club not far from The Dunes Club that was wonderful. Selling the concept to most people was a challenge. In their eyes, 9 holes meant an easy course and too much repetion as a member course.
If 9 hole courses are to be successful in the new age of the golf business, some old steroetypes will have to somehow be overcome.
Ken
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Joel:
I appreciate your bringing this back up. It's a good business model for a small-town property -- BUT most American developers are not thinking small.
We did do a renovation of the nine-hole course at Aetna Springs in California, mentioned briefly here last summer. It opens for play next spring. We have no pretensions that it's going to be ranked or anything, and that made it a fun project to do. There's some edgy stuff that we wouldn't build on a "big" project (tiny greens, trees in play) but there are only 14 small bunkers on the whole thing.
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I'm looking forward to playing Aetna Springs as Merrill who was the head assistant at Olympic is now the head pro.
The point is they are family freindly and most important they don't take all day to play. In a great situation you could hit balls and play nine holes and be out and home within 2 or 3 hours.
If the hard core want to play 18 holes, then you could play the nines twice, hopefully from different tees.
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Joel,
A 9 hole course offers advantages for less acreage, but why couldn't someone go to a regulation course, hit balls for an hour, play 9 holes and head home if time is a constraint? Wouldn't that be the same as you're suggesting?
Not unlike the 2nd hole at The Dunes Club or the 9th at Kingsley Club, par 3's with two different teeing grounds set 90 degrees apart from each other to the green, our 9 hole course had different teeing grounds providing different angles into fairways, then had two pins in each green. The course would play quite different from the "front 9" to the "back 9." Despite hitting different irons to greens and to different locations, some just felt bored they were playing the same hole again.
Ken
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Dunes Club as in either Golf or Golfweek's top 100. The other great faeture is the ~30 x 30 "clubhouse" with honor system sandwich/beverage kitchennette and three tables and a 6x14 lockker cubby. The logo is cool as well. a club bent ino a D arc that they have fashioned their push/pull door hardware like as well.
Maybe not an architectural gem but a way cool nine holer is the egutty/hickory rediscovered Oak Hall down by the green briar
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Any discussions of excellent 9-hole clubs would have to include Phoenixville, right? I think TDoak has it ranked in his top 10 nine-holers in his Confidential Guide. I've played there a few times and if your irons aren't precise, you're not breaking 40. :)
http://www.phoenixvillecc.com/
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Maybe not an architectural gem but a way cool nine holer is the egutty/hickory rediscovered Oak Hall down by the green briar
That's Oakhurst. Bob Cupp worked with the current owner to uncover the original 9 hole course that was layed out in 1884.
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Interesting that the history of Phoenixville doesn't mention Hugh Wilson as the designer.
http://www.phoenixvillecc.com/history.html
Does anyone know the source of this attribution?
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I did research on Phoenixville for my book and there is no documentation of Wilson working there.
Anthony
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Joel:
I appreciate your bringing this back up. It's a good business model for a small-town property -- BUT most American developers are not thinking small.
We did do a renovation of the nine-hole course at Aetna Springs in California, mentioned briefly here last summer. It opens for play next spring. We have no pretensions that it's going to be ranked or anything, and that made it a fun project to do. There's some edgy stuff that we wouldn't build on a "big" project (tiny greens, trees in play) but there are only 14 small bunkers on the whole thing.
Tom:
I guess it's a commentary on my tastes and sensibility, but I'm as interested to see Aetna Springs as any of your most recent work. Sounds like a very interesting project.
With any luck, I'll be embarking on a similar project here in Canada in the near future... a nine-hole course on an interesting site, in a neat locale, that is under the radar and won't be ranked or anything when I'm done.
Nonetheless, I'm quite excited about the prospects.
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Interesting that the history of Phoenixville doesn't mention Hugh Wilson as the designer.
http://www.phoenixvillecc.com/history.html
Does anyone know the source of this attribution?
But another part of their web page certainly mentions Doak's comments about Wilson:
http://www.phoenixvillecc.com/golf-guide.html
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Then I guess we need to ask Tom Doak for the source of his information.
Does anyone know how to reach the guy?
;)
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The Dunes Club is truly one of the neatest golf retreats you will ever play. If you can find it -which is no easy thing- it is well worth the search-a real treat. I would guess the slope to be in the 140 range definitely a test. A few loose swings and you can post some big numbers. Probably the most spartan clubhouse but very nice- all they need for a burger and some drinks. I remember our caddy leaving the 8th green to go fire up the barby! The course has some great elevation changes that utilize some of the dunestops. Thought the 1st was a hell of an opener-no range, just a net to hit into to loosen up. Great place to play if one is able to. A bit of advice - a large SUV is a tight squeeze thru the entrance point in the fence.
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Mike C:
Bill Kittleman is the one who told me that Hugh Wilson built the original nine at Phoenixville, back when he was doing renovation work there. He said the only four courses H.W. worked on were Merion West and East, Cobbs Creek and Phoenixville. I've never seen any written record of it, though.
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Mike C:
Bill Kittleman is the one who told me that Hugh Wilson built the original nine at Phoenixville, back when he was doing renovation work there. He said the only four courses H.W. worked on were Merion West and East, Cobbs Creek and Phoenixville. I've never seen any written record of it, though.
Tom,
That's interesting. We've dug up some info recently that indicates Hugh Wilson also did some work significant revision work on the older (South) course at Philmont, and we also now know about his routing of Seaview, although Donald Ross did most of the bunkering later, assisted by pro Wilfred Reid and William Connellan, right around the same time that Wilson spent six months on the design of Cobbs Creek.
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From the aerials I've seen on PSU's Penn Pilot, Phoenixville is pretty well preserved since 1938 and today.
Tom Doak,
What sort of work was Bill Kittleman doing at Phoenixville? This course fascinates me - so much so that it's the setting for my golf novel.
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I have not played many 9 hole golf courses but the one that I have played about a dozen times is Moorestown Field Club in NJ. I have played before Kelly Blake Morans' work and also with the changes that he has made and I really enjoy the golf course, especially after the changes with the addition of fairway bunkers and chipping areas. I feel it is a must play.
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Merchantville in New Jersey is another one that simply fascinates me. From what I can tell, playing there would be like stepping through a time machine.
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I have not played many 9 hole golf courses but the one that I have played about a dozen times is Moorestown Field Club in NJ. I have played before Kelly Blake Morans' work and also with the changes that he has made and I really enjoy the golf course, especially after the changes with the addition of fairway bunkers and chipping areas. I feel it is a must play.
Kevin,
Moorestown Field Club was designed by Samuel Allen, the man who also invented the Flexible Flyer sled.
I also believe he designed the original nine holes at Pocono Manor.
I didn't know that Kelly did work there. It's been on my short-list to play for a long time now.
I have no idea who designed Merchantville, but I'm sure it's another that I'd love to get to.
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I live near Carmel but hadn't heard of Asherwood. So in looking it up, I found this interesting article about "home" courses.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0HFI/is_10_51/ai_65486572
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This might not fit into the "best" category, but for pure historical fascination served up with a sizeable dollop of charm there is not much that beats the St. Martins course at Phildelphia Cricket Club.
This is a remaining nine holes of what was the 18 hole Cricket Club course that hosted the 1907 and 1910 US Opens. The design history is fascinating, as well, with the first nine designed by greenkeeper Sanders Handford in 1895, and another nine added in 1898 by Willie Tucker and Samuel Heebner. Just the other day I came across an article that indicated that Donald Ross made improvements there around 1915.
In any case, there is no irrigation, so it's definitely a living time capsule.
In a similar vein is the 9-hole Scotch Hills Golf CLub in Scotch Hills, NJ. This short (2247 yards, par 33) course is what remains of what was originally Westfield Golf Club, before being purchased and run for many years as Shady Rest Country Club, the only African-American owned golf club in the country. John Shippen was the pro there for a long time and the club was the primo spot for black entertainers and athletes for many decades, before being taken over by the county and run as a public course since the 60s. Some of the most wild greens I've ever seen.
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The Short course at Shady Oaks c. 2,000 yards has some excellent greensites , lovely land and tiny greens. I believe RTJ sr was the architect of this Fort Worth 9 holer.
I believe Langford's gem at Culver and Maxwell's 9 holer Coffeyville, KS. are both worthy of study
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When I read Anthony's book last Christmas, I was struck by the fact that he was able to mention only one nine holer of note built in America in the modern era—The Dunes Club. When you think of the hundreds and hundreds of courses built in the U.S. during that period, it really is incredible. I thought Tony must've missed a bunch. I decided to focus on Canada, did a little internet research and emailed a few people including golf associations to see if I could get recommendations on worthy Canadian nine holers. It didn't take me long to conclude that Tony had not been slip-shod in his homework on U.S. courses. (Sorry I ever doubted you!) In all of Canada, I have yet to come up with a list of even a dozen worthy nine holers, modern or not. Mabel Lakes in B.C. was suggested as the best in B.C. Photos on its website show a beautiful lake, mountains and forest but the site's emphasis on the clubhouse, cart paths, water fountains, rock walls, etc., rather than the course itself is a bit scary. Saskatchewan has Katepwa Beach and Riverbreaks. Ontario has Uplands (originally an 18 holer designed by Stanley Thompson) and there's a course in the Muskoka region called Diamond in the Ruff which looks worthwhile. In P.E.I. there is a course called Eagle's View.
Why so few nine holers? Developers don't give them a thought so most nine holers, like Katepwa Beach and the 1999 Engh designed, Medicine Hole, in North Dakota, are brought to life by a community of players (a "club") rather than an individual property developer or resort development. It is no easy task for a club to put together the vision, faith, capital and talent to get something like this done. But it can be done and has been done in a few places where it has also proven to be a viable model from an operations standpoint.
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Greg,
Most nine-hole commissions we have received have been to expand rural golf courses from 9 to 18 holes. There certainly exists a belief that anything short of 18 holes is not a complete course, and deemed inferior by many golfers. If you are reliant on golfers traveling any distance to play a golf course, 18 holes is an asset for enticing play, and thus, not many 9 holers are built. A 9 hole course has a much greater chance of surviving if it is one of many activities to do in an area (hunting, fishing, hiking, boating etc.)
An exception to the expansions we have completed to date is Spruce Creek in northwestern Ontario which opened in the summer of 2007. A very nice site, with decent undulations and featuring numerous rock outcroppings that gave it a strong identity. We completed a 'Biarritz' green at the conclusion of a short par-5 which was even more fun to play in reality than I had ever imagined. Ultimately, I do not think the goal of the clients were to push through 30,000 rounds a summer over their golf course, but rather a nice, quiet retreat for themselves and the locals, while offering an additional option to tourists visiting their fishing lodge.
TK
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Perhaps this is really directed at our archies out there: how hard would it be to design a 9 hole course on say 1/2 the typical land needed for an 18 holer AND make it such that after playing it one day in a certain routing, the next day it could be a 'new' nine holes by playing from/to different tees/greens?
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Greg:
I'm glad you checked up on me and found the same results. And let me just say this, and I mean it from the pit of my stomach, which is bigger than my heart, To the Nines makes a wonderful gift for that special person in your life.
I did lots of checking too because I had a difficult time believing there were so few good nine-hole courses built in the modern era. There just weren't. What many people consider to be very good or great nines are, in reality, crap. For the record, I'm not as in love with The Dunes as most people.
The most amazing statistic I came across is that Jack Nicklaus had never even been approached about building a nine. At the time his firm had worked on 220-plus courses worldwide.
My guess is that in certain parts of the country - New England, for instance - nines will become popular for two reasons, 1) The good land has all but been used up. That land which hasn't is being used for housing; B) With the amount of time it takes to play, people can not afford to have 6 or 7 hours - depending on drive time - taken up by golf.
I think I well-designed nine-hole course with plenty of strategy that brings enjoyment to the average golfer can do well utilizing the two-tee system, of which I am not a fan but realize its appeal.
Brad Faxon has said he'd rather see 9 really good holes built than an 18-hole layout with 9 really good holes and 9 mediocre or crappy holes. The reality is, however, no architect would ever say, "I'd rather you cut my fee and me build a very good nine rather than an mediocre 18."
Anthony
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Anthony
Who could ever afford to pay Nicklaus to design "half " a golf course?
Another very sporting nine holer i just remembered is St Olaf's , the Ladies course, at Cruden Bay. It has some world class holes and i would recommend that anyone going that far to play get in an emergency nine the day you play CB.
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Kyle & Mike--
Merchantville is a cool course that is quite difficult but is not overly tight. Actually, it's an 11 hole course where the 3rd and 4th holes have separate tees & greens. I can only imagine playing the monster 2nd hole with hickories and a guttie ball, it had to seem like a monster at 590 yards. Most of the holes on the clubhouse side of the road are excellent stuff even by modern standards. I particularly like the long par 3 6th and the driveable 7th holes. Interesting green sites and mounding and you can tell the bunkers have never been rebuilt with their high lips from sand being splashed out.
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Anthony and Tyler,
Good to hear about your recent nine holer, Tyler. I agree with you, there is definitely a belief that nine hole golf courses are an inferior substitute to eighteen hole golf. As Anthony observes, much of that belief is founded in experience—so many nine hole courses really do suck. They certainly wouldn’t have anything remotely interesting like your Biarritz green.
It’s almost as though there’s an underlying assumption that if you halve the number of holes, everything else must be accordingly diluted. So we get featureless, drab little (literally, LITTLE) layouts that don’t for a moment even pretend to be anything but a diminished version of the real thing. The opposite assumption could prevail, where the goal of building the best nine holes possible might actually be thought of as an advantage, reducing the odds of weak, filler holes arising. But the examples of this attitude, like Maxwell’s original Prairie Dunes and Kaiser’s realized vision for The Dunes, are so few and far between, the motivation to create really good nine holers has never really taken root.
Tom Doak started a thread a few months back about best alternative courses, for a situation where it sounded like some really good holes could be found and developed for his potential client, just not eighteen. I was surprised how many responses suggested creating a high quality “executive” or par 3 experience. Given a beautiful piece of ground lacking room for eighteen holes, to me, it’s a real shame any time nine impressive holes of Prairie Dunes or Dunes Club quality would lose out to eighteen downsized holes, but I bet that’s happened many dozens of times in the modern era. The problem is not so much with designers, for as Doak wrote in “Anatomy of a Golf Course, “Few developers with modest aspirations hire a golf architect with imagination and give him the license to design something worthwhile.”
I think Tyler is right, that nine holers are a good fit when golf is just one of many activities, for instance in cottage country where people are hunting, fishing, boating, hiking, etc., and not prepared to devote virtually the whole day to golf. With modern lifestyles, this may have similar application in urban settings, too.
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As I recall our discussion with Mr. O'Neal at Ballyneal, his initial thought when contacting his brother about retaining an architect in Holyoke was to have a 9-hole course built to entertain clients on site at his hunt club.
With respect to the Dunes, it was my understanding that Mr. Keiser bought the property to prevent it from being developed, and a nine hole course turned out to be the "best" use -- it may or may not be the "best" nine hole course in the land, but if there's a harder one out there I'd like to see it. That place has kicked my butt every time I've been there.
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Mark:
I think Gleneagles in San Francisco is more difficult than The Dunes.
Tony
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Gleneagles is one tough track. But a great course to play.
Of late I hae been playing a lot of 9 hole courses as my wife is just starting out. Has anyone played the Peter Hay course in PB?
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One of the great regrets I have was wasting invaluable time at Pebble playing Peter Hay!Should have played Pacific Grove Muny as I have heard good things.
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The Short course at Shady Oaks c. 2,000 yards has some excellent greensites , lovely land and tiny greens. I believe RTJ sr was the architect of this Fort Worth 9 holer.
I believe Langford's gem at Culver and Maxwell's 9 holer Coffeyville, KS. are both worthy of study
Since you know Shady Oaks I can ask if you have ever played Star Hollow in Tolar? I believe it was at one time a Leonard family retreat.
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Whitinsville Golf Club in Whitinsville, MA is the best 9 holer I have played in the New England area. As far as I know it is an unaltered Ross design with rolling terrain, excellent green complexes and a great set of 3-pars.
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There is an excellent 9 holer in Ionia, Michigan called (now) Shadow Ridge. It used to be Ionia CC. It is nearly original Ross.
I don't know how long it will be with us, as it has changed hands once again and it is located in an economically suppress area.
I wish I could afford it as a hobby.
Joe
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What precentage of an Arcitects fee's are charged fo a 9-holer?
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There is a 9 hole course designed by Stanley Thompson that sits inside Fundy National Park in New Brunswick, Canada bordering on the Bay of Fundy. Elevated tees, numerous streams crossing fairways and having to wait till the white-tailed deer get out of your way are characteristic of this Par 35 course. Green fees that start at the unheard price of $15 for 9 are unbelievable in this day and age. It is a great experience whether you a great golfer or just enjoy a great walk.
http://www.golfnb.com/flyer/53
http://www.fundyparkchalets.com/golf.htm
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Don:
Thanks for posting about Fundy National Park. If I could ever find a publisher for "To the Nines - Canada," it will make the book.
Anthony
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Pine Oaks Golf Club in Easton Ma. is a quirky 9-holer that I really enjoy. It’s a par 34, Cornish/Robinson design that was built in the mid-1960’s and it features several sharp dog legs, a mean par 3, an uphill par 5 and the flat out biggest golf course pro-shop in the Northeast. The course was originally built as the back nine to the bordering Easton Country Club, a Sam Mitchell design, and the marriage fell apart during construction. A new nine for Pine Oaks was routed during the late 1960’s but wetlands and money doomed the addition.
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Joe:
Thanks for posting the note about the former Ionia CC. My old associate Tom Mead was the superintendent there for a couple of years at the start of his career, and he often talked about the place. Sounds like a road trip for next spring -- and another good reason to come see The Mines.
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Matthew:
Your question is a good one.
I think the prevailing wisdom among architects would be that a nine-hole course should cost 50-65% as much as eighteen. It's half as many holes, but you still have to figure out a routing, you still have to go to a pre-bid meeting, and you're probably going to make more than half as many site visits. This is in line with the conventional wisdom about maintenance costs for nine holes being 60-65% as much as 18 holes, because you still need a superintendent and a mechanic and a lot of equipment (which just won't wear out as fast).
However, having built the nine-hole course in California just last year, I am wondering if we aren't all wrong about our assumptions. There is just so much less expectation of a nine-hole course that it doesn't have to be built at a big scale like modern 18's. We built smaller greens and narrower fairways and fewer bunkers, so the cost of construction was nowhere near half of what it will cost to build the new 18 holes nearby (if we ever get approval to do that one). And by the same logic, I don't think it will cost nearly as much to maintain -- certainly not once it shares some equipment and a mechanic and superintendent with its big brother, but I'll try to get the numbers for the short term for comparison, as I suspect they're MUCH lower than 18 holes would be.
To go back to your original question, I didn't charge nearly half my fee for that nine holes, because it was a throw-in on the larger deal ... but having done it, I think I will charge quite a bit less than half our fee for anyone else who wants to build nine. The only problem is then I'll have to cross my fingers they don't ask me to come back and build a second nine alongside it the next year!
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Tom,
Interesting comments about building 9 holers. I'm curious as to why your fee would be far less than half what it would be for 18. It sounds like you have plenty of your plate to keep you busy and as you said you still have to do the routing and would likely have more than half of the site visits for 18. Is this a desire to propagate/enocurage 9 holers to be built more often, or did you lose some kind of bet with Anthony P? ;)
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Sam Morrow:
Merry Christmas. Unfortunately, I have not played Star Hollow in Tolar. Next time I speak with a good golf buddy who often travels in Texas I will ask him.
Mark
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Sam Morrow:
Starr Hollow is a working ranch with a 9 hole course about 45 miles west of Fort Worth. Marvin Leonard built it around 1969; Joe Finger out of Houston was the architect (I think). It's short with two sets of tees and the 9th green is shaped like the State of Texas. Built around a stocked man-made fishing tank, it attracts some PGA touring professionals every year when they come into town for the Colonial. The course architecture is pretty basic, but the setting is lovely, with lots of wildlife and rolling hills. The greens are a common bermuda grass that is very grainy and slick/slow depending on whether you are putting with/against the grain. The pros don't really tear it up because it's hard to make any putts. Nothing has changed much since it was built. The clubhouse has family photos of Ben Hogan, Bing Crosby, etc. It's a lot of fun to play--you might see cowboys playing in boots with fishing poles and belly putters in their bags.
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Sam Morrow:
Starr Hollow is a working ranch with a 9 hole course about 45 miles west of Fort Worth. Marvin Leonard built it around 1969; Joe Finger out of Houston was the architect (I think). It's short with two sets of tees and the 9th green is shaped like the State of Texas. Built around a stocked man-made fishing tank, it attracts some PGA touring professionals every year when they come into town for the Colonial. The course architecture is pretty basic, but the setting is lovely, with lots of wildlife and rolling hills. The greens are a common bermuda grass that is very grainy and slick/slow depending on whether you are putting with/against the grain. The pros don't really tear it up because it's hard to make any putts. Nothing has changed much since it was built. The clubhouse has family photos of Ben Hogan, Bing Crosby, etc. It's a lot of fun to play--you might see cowboys playing in boots with fishing poles and belly putters in their bags.
I have not been out there but heard wonderful things about it, I also have heard they make a great cheeseburger.
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Nova Scotia with a population of just under 1 million people boasts almost 90 golf courses with about 38 of those being of the nine hole variety. There are many new executive style 9 holers often tied in with some of the newer 18 hole resort courses such as the Graham Cooke designed Fox Harbour:
http://www.foxharbr.ns.ca/golf/ but often these are par 3 courses. Two older 9 hole layouts top the list of Nova Scotian 9 hole courses in my opinion. The first is White Point Golf Club, a layout designed by the great Donald Ross. Built in 1932,four of its nine holes border the Atlantic Ocean with one hole being so close you tend to turn around and beg the pounding surf to be quiet so you can concentrate on your putt. http://www.whitepoint.com/golf.html
http://www.canadaselect.com/photoViewer.cfm?ID=2930&PID=1
Meanwhile, the Bluenose Golf Club offers 9 holes of par 35 golf with outstanding views of the World Heritage town of Lunenburg also on the South Shore of Nova Scotia. This course opened in 1933.
http://www.bluenosegolfclub.com/
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Don,
Thanks for the reference to White Point. It seems to fit the mold Tyler was talking about—a place where golf is one of many activities such as tennis and fishing. Golf is not the sole attraction but rather adds to the attraction and is probably one of the main reasons the resort gets so many repeat visitors year after year.
The fee structure for golf at White Point is worth noting. It is common to see nine hole rates more than half the 18 hole rate, and White Point is no exception. In 2007, their green fee in the shoulder seasons was $30 for nine holes and $35 for 18 holes. During peak season it was $35 for nine holes and $48 for 18 holes. Despite the much better deal for playing 18 holes, my guess is that the majority of play is the nine hole round variety.
As a general rule of thumb, my experience has been that nine hole rates will be about two-thirds the 18 hole rate. In essence, those who play 18 play their second nine for half price and their total 18 hole cost will equal the cost of other comparable 18 holers in the area. Those playing nine holes pay a bit of a premium but don't seem to mind doing so at all.
Tom Doak noted earlier in this thread that some of the assumptions regarding costs of nine hole course construction being well above the costs for constructing 18 holes (on a per hole basis) might need to be reconsidered. I agree. The same applies to operations. On the revenue side, golfers seem very willing to accept paying more in green fees on a per hole basis when playing nine holes which helps balance out things somewhat on the operations side. Generating 20,000 rounds on a nine hole course can be like getting over 25,000 rounds on an 18 hole course.
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David,
You should look into Kanawha Club. I finished it two years ago and it is loads of fun. Private (50 members) 9-hole par three. Holes range from 105 to 240. Great piece of property.
Lester
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Kalen:
I would build a nine-hole course for less than half our normal fee because I think the client for a nine-hole course would be less concerned with promoting my name. If that was the case, I would only have to make a couple of site visits and leave more of the details to my associates.
In some respects, having twice as many holes gives you four times as many things to think about in the design process ... it's hard to keep it simple and there is much more expectation of "effort" from the client. On a nine-holer I could communicate most of my design ideas to one of my associates in a single 3- or 4-day visit.
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Not worthy of any "best" list, GCA'ers should nonetheless play Travis' Great Dunes course on Jekyl Island. Below is the second shot to the 500 yards Alps/Mae West 5th.
(http://www.golfholes.com/ga/_GrandD/hole05b.jpg)
Here's the hole's green from front right with the sixth tee beyond.
(http://www.golfholes.com/ga/_GrandD/grand-dunes.jpg)
Mike
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Tom,
Do you recall your "alternative course thread" from a while back? I'm curious. What happened? Were any recommendations or decisions made for/by that prospective client?
For the life of me, I don't see how any one could prefer playing 18 successive par 3 holes or 18 "executive" holes (which to me, means diminished holes) instead of nine holes with a gamut every bit as strong and interesting and varied as the front or back nine of their favourite 18 hole golf course. But it does seem to be the default position for developers lacking the room for a full 18 hole course.
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Nicklaus has 'built' (whatever that may mean) at Crans sur Sierre in Switzerland. I know that the original thread was about 9-hole courses in the USA, so this doesn't count, but somebody had the money to pay him to put his name to it. There is some hope of adding another nine some day, but a look at the aerial suggests that the land is already housing....
We are lucky in this part of England to have a number of really enjoyable 9-hole members' club courses (plus a 10-hole and even a 13-holer). The only trouble is that they charge an 18-hole green fee to visitors. That's not true, however, of the pay and plays or public courses, where you can pay for 9 or 18 holes.
There are those who claim Royal Worlington and Newmarket to be the best 9-holer in the world. I am not qualified to join in that argument, but I'd rather play 9 or 18 holes there than 18 on a great many other courses.
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Greg:
Nothing has happened on that project of yet. For now the client seems bummed out that they can't build 18 "championship" holes on the property (which is 175 acres, but by estimate about half is too steep to use), and can't let go of the idea, so they are looking into more land.
I would love to build a really good nine holes on that site.
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Trying to find the most appropriate post to tag this comment too, so apologies to Ran for raising this vintage link from 2007...
Anyway, this is just to flag to GCA members the (very) considerable merits of the 'other' splendid 9-hole course in East Anglia, Flempton GC, which is an enticing 15 minutes' drive from The Sacred Nine itself. Seriously vaux un detour, a well-travelled six-handicap quartet from my home club in Cambridge (Gog Magog) played at Flempton in a recent Open Day and all came away distinctly impressed, not least as the whole experience (including lunch) cost less than $40 at current exchange rates. This just adds to my increasing sense that Suffolk has as good a clutch of Arble-friendly inland courses as any county in England, by which I mean fun, interesting, reasonably priced and full of doable challenge. Aldeburgh/Woodbridge/Purdis Heath/Thorpeness/Flempton/Royal Worlington, plus Thetford just into Norfold, would make the basis of a really nice trip, for those who like dry, heathy, fast-running and above all rural inland golf with properly rustic clubhouses to match.
http://www.flemptongolfclub.co.uk/
PS Thinking of Suffolk, the old seaside nine at Felixstowe Ferry, as per Bernard Darwin, was along with long-lost Bembridge a candidate for 'best seaside 9-holer in England'. I don't personally think that the expanded 18 at Felixstowe Ferry works terribly well, but I know others who disagree.
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Richard,
I had been planning on bringing up Flempton. This summer I played in a match against a Suffolk resident and hearing him say how much he enjoyed his local 9-hole club I asked if he were a member at Royal Worlington. He is a member at Flempton and was certain it was a superior course to RW, having played both countless times and having the option to join either. Has the Darwin/Cambridge connection influenced opinions to the extent that Flempton has been overlooked?
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I haven't looked through the above posts to see if it's already been mentioned but having now played it I'd like to nominate Mulranny
Atb
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Short answer, yes. Darwin and (too often forgotten nowadays, but just as influential in a different way) Henry Longhurst, for whom the best course in the UK consisted of 14 holes of The Old Course and four from Worlington (or Mildenhall, as he and Ran would describe it), were very instrumental in the reputational status of The Sacred Nine, but so also were former Blues like Patric Dickinson (see a recent thread), Leonard Crawley and Donald Steel.
This is in way to denigrate The Sacred Nine, which is still in a class of its own, but simply to emphasise the overlooked but very considerable merits of its neighbour Flempton.
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Thanks for digging this thread up Richard. You saved me some leg work. In the past two months I have read Anthony's book, played Highland Links, and made a return visit to Whitinsville (this week). Plan to make a return visit to The Dunes Club and a first-time jaunt to Culver next month. I have 9-holers on the brain.
On my way back to my hotel, I passed an interesting looking spot - Lexington Golf Club in Lexington, MA. Anthony, or any of the Boston guys, do you know anything about the place? The club website doesn't have GCA info that I could find.
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Boy, I really like both Phoenixville CC and West Chester CC in southeastern PA. Each is very old school on cool land without much pretension.
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Mike,
We will have to do Ann Arbor Golf and outing next time ur in town.
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Another 9 holer "discovered£ on the recent BUDA trip, which is well worth mentioning, is Cruit Island. Good golf, world class views.
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Another 9 holer "discovered£ on the recent BUDA trip, which is well worth mentioning, is Cruit Island. Good golf, world class views.
From two years ago:
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58468.msg1372420.html#msg1372420
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I found this nice Highland Links photo tour thread from a few years back by Ron M:
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,59999.0.html
Because I am sure that John wants to see them, here are my photos from my August visit on a perfect Cape Cod morning.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks-entrancesign-e1473529175167.jpeg)
#1 - Par 4 - 250 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks1-tee-e1473529263630.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks1-shortleft-e1473529309181.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks1-greenback-e1473529357469.jpeg)
#2 - Par 5 - 460 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks2-tee-e1473529416460.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks2-fairwaiybunker-e1473529472528.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks2-shortright-e1473529612535.jpeg)
#3 - Par 3 - 160 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks3-teezoom-e1473529681819.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks2-greenback-e1473529720780.jpeg)
#4 - Par 4 - 379 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks4-teezoom-e1473529789468.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks4-greenback-e1473529850469.jpeg)
#5 - Par 4 - 380 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks5-approachleft-e1473529914400.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks5-greenbehind-e1473529957907.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks5-greenback-e1473529995571.jpeg)
#6 - Par 5 - 464 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks6-tee-e1473530096763.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks6-nativecoast-e1473530134273.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks6-greenleft-e1473530184397.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks6-greenbehind-e1473530231721.jpeg)
#7 - Par 3 - 171 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks7-tee-e1473530331196.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks7-shortright-e1473530364156.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks7-greenback-e1473530400868.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks-golfersonlysign-e1473530438985.jpeg)
#8 - Par 4 - 353 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks8-teezoom-e1473530520706.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks8-shortright-e1473530560653.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks8-greenleft-e1473530592692.jpeg)
#9 - Par 3 - 136 yards
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks9-tee-e1473530660406.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks9-short-e1473531248741.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks9-shortright-e1473531278272.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks9-greenright-e1473531308299.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/highlandlinks9-greenleft-e1473531368483.jpeg)
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I don't have the patience to repost them all, but I have photos of The Dunes Club from May of this year here:
https://geekedongolf.com/2016/04/29/as-good-as-it-gets-lost-dunes-the-dunes-club/ (https://geekedongolf.com/2016/04/29/as-good-as-it-gets-lost-dunes-the-dunes-club/)
And Whitinsville from a morning in June here:
https://geekedongolf.com/2016/06/23/buddies-back-in-boston-annual-trip-recap/ (https://geekedongolf.com/2016/06/23/buddies-back-in-boston-annual-trip-recap/)
I have some more photos of Whitinsville from this week's visit that I will try and post shortly.
What I think appeals to me so much about these courses is two-fold:
1. If I am on the run and don't have much time, it is great to be able to fit in a quick round without feeling like I have left it unfinished.
2. On golf trips that include multiple courses, it is really nice to be able to experience a 9-holer multiple times while keeping a typical schedule. I like that feeling of knowing the course a bit better after the replay.
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Came across two more previous threads on the subject of 9-holers:
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61557.0.html
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,43301.0.html
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Cape Ann is a really fun 9 hole course in Essex, MA. You can't beat the views from the 4th and the 7th hole. It would be a fun course to live down the street from. Cheap, shaggy, and right down the street from lobster rolls and Harpoon IPA at Woodman's.
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Because I am enjoying playing these 9-holers so much, and reading the threads about them, I combed through and compiled a list to which I added a few out of my own research/wanderings. Post any additions/corrections and I will update this list. If you have photos, or links to photo tours, please throw them up here. If you have experiences with the courses on the list, please do share. The shorties are worth discussing and celebrating too.
United States
Ben Hollerbach's 9-Holer US Google Map: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=19Qlbv96qOP9ZyvtQA7cwJnEIiCU
Courses specifically mentioned in the other threads I've scoured:
Aetna Springs - Pope Valley, CA
Black Oak - Auburn, CA
Gleneagles - San Francisco, CA
Northwood - Monte Rio, CA
Petaluma G&CC - Petaluma, CA
Sunnylands - Racnho Mirage, CA
William Land Park - Sacramento, CA
Birchwood CC - Westport, CT
Fenwick GC - Fenwick, CT
Hotchkiss School GC - Lakeville, CT
Lake Waramaug CC - New Preston, CT
Pine Orchard Y&CC - Branford, CT
Hideaway Beach - Marco Island, FL
Palm Beach Par 3 - Palm Beach, FL
Winter Park CC - Winter Park, FL
Ansley GC - Atlanta, GA
Candler Park - Atlanta, GA
Great Dunes Course - Jekyll Island, GA
Kukuiolono GC - Kalaheo, HI
Stone Creek GC - Williamsburg, IA
Billy Caldwell GC - Chicago, IL
Lake Zurich GC - Lake Zurich, IL
Pottawatomie - St Charles, IL
Robert Black GC - Chicago, IL
South Shore GC - Chicago, IL
Sydney R Marovitz GC - Chicago, IL
Vernon Hills GC - Vernon Hills, IL
Woodstock CC - Woodstock, IL
Culver Academy GC - Culver, IN
Maxinkuckee GC - Culver, IN
Falcon Valley GC - Lenexa, KS
Amherst GC - Amherst, MA
Cape Ann - Essex, MA
Chappaquiddick Links - Martha's Vineyard, MA
Chequesset Y&CC - Wellfleet, MA
Forest Park CC - Adams, MA
Greenock CC - Lee, MA
Highland Links - Truro, MA
Lexington GC - Lexington, MA
Marion GC - Marion, MA
Reservation CC - Mattapoisett, MA
Whitinsville GC - Whitinsville, MA
Gibson Island Club - Baltimore, MD
Abenakee GC - Biddeford Pool, ME
Grindstone Neck GC - Winter Harbor, ME
North Haven GC - North Haven, ME
Wawenock GC - Damariscotta, ME
Wilson Lake CC - Wilton, ME
Charlevoix GC - Charlevoix, MI
Elk Rapids GC - Elk Rapids, MI
Keweenaw Mountain Lodge GC - Copper Harbor, MI
Les Cheneaux - Cedarville, MI
Northport Point Club - Northport, MI
Quarry Ridge - Ottawa Lake, MI
Signal Point Club - Niles, MI
Stonycroft Hills Club - Bloomfield Hills, MI
The Dunes Club - New Buffalo, MI
Wawashkamo GC - Mackinac Island, MI
Double Eagle GC - Eagle Bend, MN
Ruth Park Municipal - St. Louis, MO
Highlands Golf & Tennis Center - St. Louis, MO
Headwaters GC - Cashiers, NC
Legends Butte GC - Crawford, NE
Pelican Beach GC - Hyannis, NE
Thedford GC - Thedford, NE
Hooper GC - Walpole, NH
Lawrenceville School GC - Lawrenceville, NJ
Merchantville GC - Merchantville, NJ
Mt Tabor GC - Mt Tabor, NJ
Scotch Plains CC - Scotch Plains, NJ
Skyway GC - Jersey City, NJ
Doral Arrowwood GC - Purchase, NY
Hay Harbor Club - Fishers Island, NY
Millbrook G&TC - Hillbrook, NY
Mosholu GC - Bronx, NY
Pocantico Hills GC - Tarrytown, NY
Quogue Field Club - Quogue, NY
Quaker Hill CC - Pawling, NY
Rip Van Winkle - Palenville, NY
Sadaquada - Whitestown, NY
LC Boles GC - Wooster, OH
Wyoming GC - Cincinnati, OH
Cedar Bend Golf Links - Gold Beach, OR
Country View - Ontario, OR
Crestview GC - Walport, OR
Olalla Valley GC - Toledo, OR
Immegrun GC - Loretto, PA
Phoenixville CC - Phoenixville, PA
St Martin’s at PCC - Philadelphia, PA
St Mary’s CC - St Mary’s, PA
West Chester G&CC - Philadelphia, PA
Weekapaug - Westerly, RI
Sweetens Cove - S. Pittsburg, TN
University of the South Course - Sewanee, TN
Conroe CC - Houston, TX
McLean CC - McLean, TX
Starr Hollow GC - Tolar, TX
Dixie Red Hills - St. George, UT
Links Course at Sand Hollow - St. George, UT
Kanahwa Club - Manakin-Sabot, VA
Lambert Point - Norfolk, VA
Schoolhouse Nine - Sperryville, VA
Sky Ridge - Sequim, WA
Country Club Estates GC - Fontana-On-Geneva Lake, WI
Eagle Springs Resort - Eagle, WI
Plum Lake GC - Sayner, WI
Shoop Park - Racine, WI
Oakhurst Links - White Sulphur Springs, WV
International
Thomas Dai's GB&I 9-holer compilation thread: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,56120
Courses specifically mentioned in the other threads I've scoured:
Abernethy GC - Nethy Bridge, Scotland
Auchterderran GC - Fife, Scotland
Brayan GC - Scotland
Burnham & Berrow Channel - Somerset, England
Cruit Island - Donegal, Ireland
Flempton GC - Suffolk, England
Frankston - Melbourne, Australia
Hale - Cheshire, England
Kilmore Course at Carne - Ireland
Knutsford GC - Tatton Park, England
Isle of Harris GC - UK
Mulranny GC - Mayo, Ireland
Musselburgh Links - Scotland
Reigate Heath GC - Surrey, England
Royal Workington & Newmarket - Suffolk, England
Rye Jubilee - Rye, England
St. David’s City - Wales
St Olaf at Cruden Bay - Scotland
Tarbat GC - Portmahomack, UK
Traigh - Scotland
Uplands G&SC - Toronto, Canada
Valliere Course - Morfontaine, France
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Annapolis GC closed up. Can't think of any public 9-holers in MD besides East Potomac courses.
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Jason:
Certainly Country Club Estates belongs in the Wisconsin list; an original and largely untouched Bendelow, I think it's one of the better 9-holers in the state:
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,39987.msg1413629.html#msg1413629
A 9-holer that's far off the beaten tracks, with a great history, is Plum Lake GC, deep in the North Woods, more than a century old, built with horses and featuring one of the coolest clubhouses in the state, its first head pro was.......Pete Jans:
http://www.plumlakegolf.com/history.shtml
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Whilst I haven't playedthe long list of 9 holers to say which is the best, having now seen and played Cruit Isalnd, I would feel comfortable saying there can't be better 9 hole course. Scenic beyond ability to describe. Clever hole designs, and the head greenkeeper is a Golf Club Atlas lurker. 8) ;D (Brian McMonagle)
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Jason:
One more for your list: Maxinkuckee GC, Culver, IN. A separate nine holes from the Military Academy course, a few miles south of town on Lake Maxinkuckee, also built by William Langford. Alice Dye's family had a summer place there, and Pete and sons used to visit sometimes, too.
Some of the best 9-hole courses I listed in the original Confidential Guide are no longer nine holes: Rolling Rock and Harrison Hills were the two best of those.
Also, if Lexington looked interesting, why did you pass it by?
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Thanks for the additions Phil, and for the nugget about PJ. Always happy to learn more about that character.
I think I might have to take a jaunt to hit the Eagle Springs / CCE combo. That's some good ol' timey fun.
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Also, if Lexington looked interesting, why did you pass it by?
Given that I was in Boston for work, and had already snuck out to play Whitinsville and George Wright at that point, it struck me as a touch irresponsible/piggy to try and hop out onto Lexington as well (in addition to it being private).
I would be lying if I said that the thought didn't cross my mind though...
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Jason Way,
I am most of my way through playing all of the golf courses in Oregon, twenty left. One 9 hole course highly thought of, Elkhorn Valley, was expanded to 18 and lost its coolness. I have referenced before a few good nine hole courses -worth your time and effort if you are in the vicinity.
a. Cedar Bend Golf Links (John Zoller) is near Gold Beach on the southern Oregon coast. Small streams in the valley, with a cedar covered hillside. Both the hillside and the streams play a big factor on its best holes, 1,6,7 with perched greens atop shaved slopes. Balls are recoverable.The 4th is a par 3 with tees shots vectored south and west. The greens are big enough that each has two flags, for the out and in 9s. on built to
b. Country View(Scott McKinney), near the Idaho border at Ontario is a family built course over unproductive farmland. They had no experience in golf, read a book about how to construct a golf course, said we can do that and set sail. Outside of a tight, iffy tee shot from the back tees it is a very good basic course with true, fast greens. Good design, strategy,
the 5th and 6th are the best as they run capishly along and across the edge of the elevated property, thus the view.
c. Crestview GC, aka Crestview Hills, is in Waldport on the central Oregon Coast. It was revitalized by Dan Hixson (Wine Valley) a few years ago. There are some drainage issue on 1&2, probably related to the housing east of the course. The heart of the course is 4,5,6. Four is a probably downhill par 3 hole fronted by a lake. It looks vicious, especially with a wind, but last year, three players in succession aced it. The 5th is a reachable par 4, slight dogleg left with jungle left,
6 is a semiblind uphill par 3 with a spined green. Nine is a uphill par 3 which plays less than its yardage because, well,
it is shorter than the listed yardage. That leaves you long, which is the wrong place to be.
d. Olalla Valley GC (Matthew Gruber) is near Toledo on the central Oregon coast. After driving along a winding narrow road you come to the course, which continues winding. The opening hole is okay, a mid length 4, which only becomes dangerous if you become away of the road and OB left, and the sinuous Olalla Creek on the right. They both beckon as sirens and unless you are straight that day, welcome equitable stroke control. I think a gentle fade is best, as I found out on the 4th shot from the tee. The second looks like it should play the same, but the hole opens up to the draw. The 5th is a par five dogleg right that demands a draw so the hard left to right slope doesn't end up in the darn creek. 6 and 7 go up the hill, and up the hill. Local knowledge or a trusty cart sent out on scouting mission are vital. Drop shot 8, The straight finisher would be easy except for the crossing stream (ball not recoverable) in the landing area. The sum result, if you are an 8, playing against an 8 from Olalla Valley, simplify things by just emptying your wallet on the first tee, but still play because its 6000 yds. are very worth it.
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Jason,
I grew up playing 9-hole courses in West Texas, I will try find my old pictures and post them. They are not significant architecturally, but most of them have just enough quirkiness to make them interesting, at least for me. There is even one course in the panhandle of Texas that still has sand greens, McLean Country Club in McLean, TX.
Up in your neck of the woods I have played Vernon Hills Golf Course, I believe done by Dick Nugent and the Youth Links at Cantigny is a cool concept.
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Cedarbrook in Cheltenham, PA is NLE, Jason.
Thanks for compiling the list!
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New poster here, joined the board at the urging of Mr. John Mayhugh after a match we played earlier in the summer.
I'm a member at Wyoming GC in Cincinnati, OH. It's a gem of a 9 holer - a 1906 (I think?) Bendelow routed on a compact property that was previously a dairy farm. It's built on a bit of a hillside, yet remains very walkable. It tips out at 6200 yards with 3 each of par 3's, 4's, and 5's. There are several interesting greens complexes and the greens feature a lot of subtle breaks that regularly throw off members and guests alike. My only gripe with the course is a common one for older clubs: trees have grown over time to encroach on some lines of play. A memorial stump program would be a great initiative here.
The club has a strong walking culture, and it's very common to see walkers/pushcarters outnumber cart riders by a multiple of 2 or more, even on the busiest weekend mornings. It has a small membership and flies well below the radar, even on the Cincinnati golf scene. In terms of design value, test of golf, aesthetics, conditioning, etc., I would stack it up favorably against any course in the Cincinnati area (save Camargo).
I will try to take some photos of some of the more interesting elements of the course and post them to the board.
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Glad to see Mass. with 9 courses so far. You can add Amherst GC in the University town in the western part of the state. It dates from the late 1800's and is distinguished by some of the longest fairway grass on the planet; I suspect it an attempt to keep drives in check on a shortish layout.
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Whilst I haven't playedthe long list of 9 holers to say which is the best, having now seen and played Cruit Isalnd, I would feel comfortable saying there can't be better 9 hole course. Scenic beyond ability to describe. Clever hole designs, and the head greenkeeper is a Golf Club Atlas lurker. 8) ;D (Brian McMonagle)
RJD,
Glad to hear you enjoyed Cruit/"Critch". Terrific location and not just very scenic but very fine golf as well. Nice lurker news.
A few others should also have visited recently. I hope they enjoyed it too.
A thread with photos - http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58468.msg1373046.html#msg1373046
Atb
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You can also add Pine Orchard Yacht & Country Club in Branford, CT to the list (even though it has 10 greens). I like it simply because yacht-cum-golf clubs are such a rarity (might be an interesting thread topic). It also has a host of quirk that makes it really fun and charming to play, e.g., the 5th hole which has blind tee shot to a bowl fairway followed by a mini alps-like approach to a blind green that also sits in a tiny dell.
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I've mentioned it on some GCA.com thread before and had interaction with others who have played it, but R&A Chappaquiddick Links, formerly Island Ballwatchers' Society (better name!), is a hoot of a 9-holer on the island that I used to play with my brother who was a Martha's Vineyard carpenter. It is beyond F&F, has some wonderful tiny green sites and some incredibly fun holes. It was the first "small" course that I truly fell for and helped to change my views on conditioning, length, and how a "round of golf" should be defined. You used to go in the shed, put $10 in the box, and play away. Seriously OL' SCHOOL! :)
https://www.google.com/maps/place/N+Neck+Rd,+Edgartown,+MA+02539/@41.3904873,-70.4786571,683m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x89e52c8b72ba53c9:0xe301efcc37dd8af2!8m2!3d41.392753!4d-70.4744008
https://vineyardgazette.com/news/2012/08/30/no-fore-forever-chappy-golf-course-goes-market
https://www.facebook.com/royalandancientchappaquiddicklinks
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Sweeten's Cove in TN was a really good 9 hole course. Excellent use of a valley (or hollar) with many different tee opportunities to keep repeating rounds fresh and fun.
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Sweeten's Cove in TN was a really good 9 hole course. Excellent use of a valley (or hollar) with many different tee opportunities to keep repeating rounds fresh and fun.
Bill,
Sweeten's has numerous threads dedicated to it and is definitely one of the best 9-hole course anywhere. I would be shocked if it wasn't already mentioned here but if not, certainly a good call. Sewanee as well.
Cheers
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When I first saw the Dunes Club in 2003, I knew virtually nothing about GCA. However, the vibe and spirit of the place immediately resonated -- particularly the 'create your own 18' aspect. Shortly thereafter, I was fortunate to be admitted for membership by Mr. Keiser and, having studied up a bit on nine hole courses including reading Mr. Pioppi's To the Nines, I've really grown to appreciate the 'genre.' I think for families or parents with young children, nine hole courses can be wonderful. And in resort or summer vacation areas (such as the a Dunes) they can better accommodate busy schedules. Aetna Springs and Culver (with Jason W. and Peter K.) are on my near-term checklist, but, regrettably, Mildenhall, Whitinsville, and Sweetens Cove appear likely to elude me. Moreover, from just this thread alone I have learned of many heretofore-unknown-to-me nine holers that I'd now love to play. Thanks to all who've contributed their thoughts!
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Certainly not among the "Best" nine hole courses, but an enjoyable and historically significant one is what is today known as "Scotch Plains (NJ) Country Club.
It was designed in 1901 by John Forman of Musselburgh, and served as the Westfield Golf Club until the early 1920s when club members opted to move because African Americans were moving into that neighborhood in a closely contested membership vote. The club/course was purchased by a group of African-American real estate entrepreneurs and became the first such owned country club in the United States, known as "Shady Rest".
The club was a mecca for African Americans for a number of decades and over time the club dissolved and it was purchased by the township, and has served as a municipal course since.
It's not a long course, but it has some of the wildest greens I've ever seen.
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Thanks for additions fellas. The list has been updated. Keep em coming and I will keep building it out.
I'm also going to go digging on here for links to photo tours of these 9-holers. I know that there have been some good ones.
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Not having had a great deal of experience with 9 holers, here are two more courses that are good...don't know about best. That said, I would highly recommend The Channel. Its good and cheap.
Rye Jubilee
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,53083.msg1219320.html#msg1219320
Burnham & Berrow Channel
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,62038.msg1473736.html#msg1473736
Ciao
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A whole bunch of fine places mentioned so far.
These thread might provide some additional one's - http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61557.0.html
&
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,56120.msg1302181.html#msg1302181
Comments on other currents got me thinking of a possible tour of 9-hole courses in the west and north of Ireland.
How about Connemara Links, the 9-holer at Connemara GC, Mulranny, Achilll, Doohoma (look it up!), Kilmore at Carne, Scurmore at Enniscrone, Bomore at County Sligo, Gweedore, Cruit Island, Coastguard at Rosapenna, Otway, Buncrana, Bann at Castlerock. I believe there may be a couple near Portrush., not sure of their names though. Any I've missed?
Atb
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Castlegregory on the Dingle peninsula is excellent
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,61544.msg1461347.html#msg1461347
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I think that Frank Pennink's original 9 holes for the Rye Jubilee Course of 1977 have now been remodelled into twelve holes, over two loops of nine? Which could of course put it into contention with Shiskine (Blackwaterfoot) in the even more rarified 'Best Twelve Hole Course' category.
Incidentally, for those who have seen the excellent BBC adaptation of Parade's End with Benedict Cumberbatch, the Rye golf scenes were largely filmed on the Jubilee Course.
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Just as an exercise to see if it provides any insight, I went back across the 1,040 courses I've played to date and came across the following;
94 were 9 holes courses, or just over 9%
Of those, 12 were adjunct or overflow courses of a larger 18 or more hole(s) course.
Of those, 17 were of par 30 or less, indicating primarily par three courses.
In total based on my most recent audit 12 courses are NLE.
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The Great Dunes course at Jekyll Island, GA is a Walter Travis 9-holer. $10 to walk and carry. Some fantastic holes including the magnificent par-5 fifth, with a classic Mae West approach to a green set in the saddle of two big dunes. That green and the next hole, a beautiful one-shotter provide view of the Atlantic to boot.
The course needs a little TLC and a serious greens reclamation project, but it is worth five times the $10!
I've got photos somewhere that I'll try to dig up.
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Jason,
Sometime in the last year or 2 I started working on mapping all of the nine hole courses in the states I could find. After nearly 500 courses and only a quarter of the country complete I slowed up a bit. If you, or anyone, wants to add some more courses to the map, please be my guest.
Nine Holes Courses of America (https://drive.google.com/open?id=19Qlbv96qOP9ZyvtQA7cwJnEIiCU&usp=sharing)
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Auchterderran.
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2 nine holers in St. Louis that I like. Ruth Park Municipal (R Foulis 1931) and Highlands in Forest Park formerly Triple A Club (R Foulis 1902? and Hale Irwin 2006~)
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Thanks for the continued contributions fellas. The list in Reply#84 has been updated, with links to additional sources from Thomas Dai and Ben Hollerbach added.
I got out to Eagle Springs yesterday. A few photos to come shortly...
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Balboa Park 9 (municipal), San Diego CA. It’s beside Balboa Park 18.
Frosty Valley Golf Links, Upper St. Clair PA
Mt. Lebanon (municipal), Mt. Lebanon PA.
From the latter's website:
Mt. Lebanon's proud tradition of golf dates back to July 4, 1907, when a group of 30 men founded the Castle Shannon Golf Club on a 100-acre farm and persisted with the sport despite having to dodge moving targets, such as cows and horses.
There were no tees or greens; still 30 golfers soon had joined, each paying $5 dues per year and bringing along scythes and lawn mowers to keep the course in playable condition. By 1918, there were 100 members, some rudimentary tees and greens and even a groundskeeper. That original club eventually disbanded, was reorganized, and in the '20s, '30s and '40s was one of the most popular 9-hole courses in the Pittsburgh area.
Among the club's elite members were the financiers Andrew W., and Richard King Mellon, who reportedly rode the trolley to the end of the Castle Shannon line and were transported by horse-drawn carriage to the golf course. Mt. Lebanon purchased the private course in 1947 and reconfigured several holes located in the adjacent Castle Shannon Borough so that the entire course now lies within the boundaries of Mt. Lebanon.
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Thanks to Rees Milikin for turning me on to this Eagle Springs Golf Resort. For those of you who are headed up from Chicago to Whistling Straights, Sand Valley, Lawsonia, or the US Open at Erin Hills, I can't recommend this place enough for a quick stop. Driving in to the property is like going back in time, and the course itself is filled with pre-1900 quirk.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings-clubhouse-e1476238210902.jpeg)
The first has a crazy uphill blind drive followed by an approach into a cool green that wraps around a large mound in front.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings1-shortright-e1476238180399.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings1-greenback-e1476238193960.jpeg)
The second is Eagles Spring's volcano hole par-3. There is an alternate #2 for those who are not physically able to make the climb (which is a legit concern).
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings2-tee-e1476238141943.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings2-greenback-e1476238168941.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings2-greenright-e1476238155337.jpeg)
The ho hum third is followed by another really cool hole. The 4th is a par-4 that plays uphill over a ridge and then down and left to a green that is fronted by a large hump. Left of the green is a deep fall-off.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings4-shortleft-e1476238119908.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings4-shortright-e1476238107736.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings4-greenback-e1476238130882.jpeg)
The fifth is a par-4 that heads back downhill to a green set just over a creek at the low point of the property, with the third green immediately behind.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings5-short-e1476238094612.jpeg)
The sixth turns and heads right back up the hill. The fairway is a cool-looking "v" shape, and the green is fronted by quirky bunkers and backed by a horseshoe bunker and mounds.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings6-approach-e1476238079656.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings6-greenback-e1476238016328.jpeg)
The seventh is a pretty little downhill par-3 with a wild green. I love the look of the dual staircases behind the green.
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings7-teezoom-e1476237990399.jpeg)
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/10/eaglesprings7-greenabove-e1476238005686.jpeg)
The 8th is a simple par-5 with a blind drive between two oaks, and a green set down in a low bowl. The ninth is a cape-style par-4 dogleg left to a small green tucked way back in a corner of the property directly above the clubhouse. None of my pictures of those holes made the final cut, but they were fun to play.
In 1893, when this course was built, golf was brand new in the U.S. I like to imagine visitors to the resort being sent out for their first experience with this strange game. Must have been mind-blowing at so many levels.
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Splendid Jason. Shows what's out there if you're prepared to look hard enough or someone like Rees mentions it to you. That's some volcano hole and both the 1st and 4th look pretty interesting as well.
Atb
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Has anyone mentioned Cape Ann Golf Course in Essex, MA yet? Some pretty mundane holes, but there are at least two world class holes in the nine.
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Jason,
Sometime in the last year or 2 I started working on mapping all of the nine hole courses in the states I could find. After nearly 500 courses and only a quarter of the country complete I slowed up a bit. If you, or anyone, wants to add some more courses to the map, please be my guest.
Nine Holes Courses of America (https://drive.google.com/open?id=19Qlbv96qOP9ZyvtQA7cwJnEIiCU&usp=sharing)
Ben,
To your list, I'd add GEAA in Pittsfield, MA and Greenock CC in Lee, MA.
Also, Studebaker GC in South Bend, IN and Plym Park GC in Niles, MI
Ken
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Thanks all for continuing to kick in your favorite 9-holers.
I had the pleasure of playing Sweetens Cove this week for the first time, with Rob Collins. Many of you have been already, and know how special it is. Several interesting threads already exist on the course:
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60249 (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,60249)
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58527 (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58527)
http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58154 (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,58154)
Rob was kind enough to do an interview for my blog, along with an extensive course tour. Check it out here:
https://geekedongolf.com/2016/11/12/rob-collins-the-sweetens-cove-story/ (https://geekedongolf.com/2016/11/12/rob-collins-the-sweetens-cove-story/)
I took some photos. Below are some of my favorites.
Par-5 1st
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove1-mitrebunkerback-x-e1479073367473.jpeg)
Par-4 2nd
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove2-greenback-x-e1479073460237.jpeg)
Par-5 3rd
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove3-approach-x-e1479073516314.jpeg)
Par-3 4th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove4-alpsbunker-x-e1479073564522.jpeg)
Par-4 5th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove5-devilsasshole-x-e1479073617987.jpeg)
Par-4 6th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove6-greenbehind-x-e1479073694978.jpeg)
Par-4 7th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove7-greenback-x-e1479073749489.jpeg)
Par-4 8th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove8-shortright-x-e1479073793807.jpeg)
Par-3 9th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2016/11/sweetenscove9-greenabove-x-e1479073834672.jpeg)
My current fascination with 9 hole courses got me focused on Sweetens Cove. I went because of the glowing reviews I've heard from GCAers and others, and to meet Rob. I walked away not just thinking that Sweetens is one of the best 9-holers on the planet. For me, along with others like The Dunes Club and Whitinsville, Sweetens Cove is one of my all-time favorites courses, period.
If you haven't been yet, go.
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Had the distinct pleasure of playing Quogue Field Club earlier this season. If you haven't already read Benjamin Litman's outstanding IMO here, I highly recommend it:
http://golfclubatlas.com/in-my-opinion/litman-benjamin-s-timeless-golf-at-quogue-field-club/ (http://golfclubatlas.com/in-my-opinion/litman-benjamin-s-timeless-golf-at-quogue-field-club/)
I had built up Quogue considerably in my mind over the past few years, and I must say that it did not disappoint. What a wonderful way to experience the game!
Peter Imber, a QFC member and Green Chairman, graciously did an interview for my blog, to which Jon Cavalier contributed photos for a course tour.
https://geekedongolf.com/2017/10/07/field-of-dreams-peter-imber-quogue-field-club/ (https://geekedongolf.com/2017/10/07/field-of-dreams-peter-imber-quogue-field-club/)
A few bonus photos of my own:
The par-4 3rd
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2017/10/quoguefieldclub3-greenleft-e1507499062906.jpeg)
The par-3 4th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2017/10/quoguefieldclub4-green-e1507499083675.jpeg)
The par-4 8th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2017/10/quoguefieldclub8-greenright-e1507499095742.jpeg)
The par-4/5 9th
(https://geekedongolf.files.wordpress.com/2017/10/quoguefieldclub9-greenbehind-e1507499113816.jpeg)
When the question arises, what does golf need? My new answer is, more Quogues. Enjoy.
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NY Times article on Sweetens Cove ("The Little Golf Course That Could"):
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/15/sports/golf/sweetens-cove-golf-club-rob-collins.html?_r=0
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Needham Golf Club,Needham MA...Wayne Stiles. I grew up in the town and this where we played our High School Golf.
Probably not the best, but pretty good, if memory serves.
Tuesday, played Sweeten's Cove.I have a better opinion of it now.[size=78%] You must bring a good approach putt, chipping & pitching game or the course will eat you. It has some severe drainage problems.[/size]