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GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 10:59:58 AM

Title: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 10:59:58 AM
Itís not uncommon for people to ask me why I love Nebraska golf. What is the best picture that I could send by text that represents my affection? Btw: My friends arenít the type to enjoy drone photos or surrealistic angle shots.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Sam Morrow on September 15, 2022, 11:04:22 AM
Drive about 20 miles north of North Platte, pull over on the side of the highway, face east and take a picture. Send it to friends and they will ask what course it is and tell you how cool it looks.


You tell them it's not a course, it's just the sand hills, if that open expanse of dunes doesn't make them wanna visit then find new friends.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Tommy Williamsen on September 15, 2022, 11:48:14 AM
[color=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.87)](https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/F5D54A95-7CCD-498B-96B7-59804D8CB335.heic?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds) (https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/F5D54A95-7CCD-498B-96B7-59804D8CB335.heic?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds)[/color]
[color=rgba(0(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/A52DA234-F91D-41A4-B5C9-028DBD6FA50E.heic?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds) (https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/A52DA234-F91D-41A4-B5C9-028DBD6FA50E.heic?width=960&height=720&fit=bounds)

Lots of variety
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Kalen Braley on September 15, 2022, 11:52:23 AM
The answer is fairly simple John,

Just tell them its "land fit for golf"...and if they don't understand that, its as expected because few people are interested enough to understand what that means anyways.

P.S.  I didn't take you for an external validation kind of guy, you know why you love Nebraska and that's all you need right? ;)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Jason Thurman on September 15, 2022, 12:51:01 PM
I always think about this one (poached from Ran's SH profile, and I feel like I've seen other people take versions of the same pic):


(https://golfclubatlas.com/images/Sandhills17.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: George Freeman on September 15, 2022, 05:37:58 PM
Thurman nailed it.  End of thread.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 09:47:57 PM
I always think about this one (poached from Ran's SH profile, and I feel like I've seen other people take versions of the same pic):


(https://golfclubatlas.com/images/Sandhills17.jpg)


I could never get a 14 handicap to look at that turpitude of penalty and think fun. Thread on.   
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 15, 2022, 10:08:48 PM
Itís not uncommon for people to ask me why I love Nebraska golf. What is the best picture that I could send by text that represents my affection? Btw: My friends arenít the type to enjoy drone photos or surrealistic angle shots.
Ha. Iíve been rocking UAV cinema cameras and drinks before the drone was a thing. Also fight for Nebraska public golf including the kid who is #1 in the state in his age group at rocks it on public and non famous tracks.


Careful, donít hate the drone you donít know. Content is a real business. The drone show folks features they never knew why that should be appreciated.
Drone hate is GCA self loathing.
If your friends donít like them. Itís fine but stay in the lane.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 10:24:52 PM
When reality isnít enough turn to content.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 15, 2022, 10:32:20 PM
When reality isnít enough turn to content.
Again, if you donít have access to reality or access to great gca golf, or even good golf, the content is informative, entertaining, illustrative, and aspirational.

Youíre acting as if everyone can play a great golf course. Most canít or donít. The content gives folks access and expands the potential market.

Youíre talking from the inside of a golf snob bubble. Some of the kids I work with have no idea what a decent gca course is, and the simple entree is a picture ďthat looks cool.Ē

Drones deliver something that looks cool, better, and, different than the shitty bunkerless circle mossy greens and rocky fairways they play. 
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 10:42:55 PM
When reality isnít enough turn to content.
Again, if you donít have access to reality or access to great gca golf, or even good golf, the content is informative, entertaining, illustrative, and aspirational.


Youíre acting as if everyone can play a great golf course. Most canít or donít. The content gives folks access and expands the potential market.


If I wasnít clear in my opening post I wanted a picture for my friend. During a conversation this week my host asked me in a very genuine manner why I went to Nebraska to play golf. I could have used a picture that takes at most 3 seconds to view to illustrate my point. If he wanted a drone shot heíd fly over the damn course.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 15, 2022, 10:45:45 PM
When reality isnít enough turn to content.
Again, if you donít have access to reality or access to great gca golf, or even good golf, the content is informative, entertaining, illustrative, and aspirational.


Youíre acting as if everyone can play a great golf course. Most canít or donít. The content gives folks access and expands the potential market.


If I wasnít clear in my opening post I wanted a picture for my friend. During a conversation this week my host asked me in a very genuine manner why I went to Nebraska to play golf. I could have used a picture that takes at most 3 seconds to view on my to illustrate my point. If he wanted a drone shot heíd fly over the damn course.
All good, just calling bullshit on you taking the time to snob shit on drone shots that have expanded appreciation of gca beyond the confines of this fine room.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 15, 2022, 10:53:28 PM
I have a very long history of disliking drones. They are bad for golf and have no place in recreational life. Drones are the vape pens of cameras. 
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 16, 2022, 01:58:47 AM
I have a very long history of disliking drones. They are bad for golf and have no place in recreational life. Drones are the vape pens of cameras.


Lol. Youíre entitled to youíre opinion. Facts are they have expanded gcaís visual storytelling opportunities.  Like anything, not all output is equal but as a storytelling tool they are invaluable.


As a pro storyteller who has to work with all manner of visual film, audio, and musical production media, both analog and digital, the drone has expanded pop culture awareness of the value of golfís architectural features. That is positive for golf and golf architecture.


They also add perspective and scale. As a professional, I embrace tools that improve the creative process, we embrace it. You almost sound as if you miss the VHS tape and Sony Trinitron.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Jeff Schley on September 16, 2022, 09:41:49 AM

As a pro storyteller who has to work with all manner of visual film, audio, and musical production media, both analog and digital, the drone has expanded pop culture awareness of the value of golfís architectural features. That is positive for golf and golf architecture.

Agree with Vaughn, drones have taken the visuals of golf to a new level and welcomed. In the old days you had to rent a helicopter with a cameraman doing a low flyover. Or view from the blimp, or high cherry pickers at the Open. Drones provide great views not otherwise provided. Most courses have a drone video of each hole now on their website for a reason. Online golf sites post these when profiling a course. I can't imagine why anyone would be against this advancement.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 10:05:05 AM
The market is quickly proving that courses which ban drone videos are where we most desire to play.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 16, 2022, 10:34:22 AM
The market is quickly proving that courses which ban drone videos are where we most desire to play.

That's elitist bullshit blather. Sure courses can ban drones. 
This one has made significant investment in golf architecture for public consumption and welcomes exposure.
Courses can choose to ban drones based on their desire for privacy, and that is not an issue.
You typing the phrase "The market is quickly proving that courses which ban drone videos are where we most desire to play." tells me you and I have fundamental philosophical differences with regard to more people gaining access to great golf architecture.

And let's be clear, I have been blessed to be able to play "Top 0-10ís" golf courses but will always actively fight for folks ability to access the best architecture available.
Landmand has made significant investments in golf architecture for public consumption and welcomes exposure.
Typing the phrase "The market is quickly proving that courses which ban drone videos are where we most desire to play" is exactly the crap the gives champions of great GCA golf a bad name and was used as a smoke screen to keep various classes and ethnicities from accessing great golf. That school is closed.

BTW, seems to be a really nice piece on this Sand Hills place showing Fried Egg Drone footage. 
Gosh I think that qualifies as a place "we might desire to play" in a thread about golf in Nebraska. 
You're pissing up a tree.  Don't use "we". I donít want to be sprayed by your mist.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 11:02:35 AM
Why so angry? I just wanted a picture to show a friend.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: V_Halyard on September 16, 2022, 11:04:20 AM
Why so angry? I just wanted a picture to show a friend.
Typing things like "The market is quickly proving that courses which ban drone videos are where we most desire to play" is a trigger.
You've never been directed to park in an employee parking lot when you arrive at a private club to join your host as a guest and have to explain it to the guard to the point where they ask you to "Please wait here" while they call the host and general manager for verification that you are actually a guest coming to play golf.

You need to realign your lens. That will trigger the arrival of "LA Vaughn". 
You don't want him in here.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Noah Jurik on September 16, 2022, 11:08:04 AM
#5, Dismal River Red


It feels like you're the only person on the planet while you're visiting Dismal.





(PS- as a photographer, I think people can tend to use equipment such as drones as a crutch when other ideas are sparse, but they've been a true asset to me in capturing the depth of golf landscapes)




(https://i.imgur.com/5959llO.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 11:20:41 AM
Noah,


That is perfect. The fact that I was a member there gives my story quality content.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Eric Smith on September 16, 2022, 01:08:34 PM
Kav,


Is this what you had in mind?


(https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/rr7/rednorman/Dismal%20River%20weekend%2010%201%202011/.highres/2b1fc7f3.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 01:21:00 PM
Those dudes climbing that hill are hilarious.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Ira Fishman on September 16, 2022, 01:42:02 PM
I have been enjoying the various threads about Nebraska. It strikes me if there is one place in the US where a tour operator similar to those in the UK&I could make a go of it is in the Sand Hills. One call and tee times, transportation, and lodging arranged.


Wisconsin/Michigan might be the other place. A boat ride across Lake Michigan included.


Ira


PS I agree with JK about drones although appreciate that there are exceptions. Nothing like being able to contemplate a great photo.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Gary Kurth on September 16, 2022, 01:48:47 PM

Ha. Iíve been rocking UAV cinema cameras and drinks before the drone was a thing. Also fight for Nebraska public golf including the kid who is #1 in the state in his age group at rocks it on public and non famous tracks.



It was great to chat with Tye at the Omaha CC putting green.  Real nice kid with a great swing.  He shot 1-under at Landmand from the whites last week.  Post round, he said his first time at Omaha CC didn't quite go as well.  Scary good.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: George Pazin on September 16, 2022, 01:56:45 PM
Those dudes climbing that hill are hilarious.


I've made a similar climb on my local muni many times, maybe a hundred. The game is about the walk, as said in GITK. I hated that book, but love that sentiment.


Why Nebraska? The land looks compelling. That's the most interesting thing to me, as a well-above-14 handicapper. I don't get to play often enough to get that down, but it certainly looks interesting.


The people who post on here are spoiled. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's worth considering. Most golfers simply don't have the ways or means to play that much.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 02:07:03 PM
Those dudes climbing that hill are hilarious.


I've made a similar climb on my local muni many times, maybe a hundred. The game is about the walk, as said in GITK. I hated that book, but love that sentiment.


Why Nebraska? The land looks compelling. That's the most interesting thing to me, as a well-above-14 handicapper. I don't get to play often enough to get that down, but it certainly looks interesting.


The people who post on here are spoiled. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's worth considering. Most golfers simply don't have the ways or means to play that much.


George,


Me and you have spent the last 20 years discussing access. How does maximum exposure help anyone, outside the storytellers, get a tee time at a private club?



Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Kalen Braley on September 16, 2022, 03:55:44 PM
Barney,

If pictures and drone shots are no good, (which I will go on record in 100% agreeance with what Vaughn said), sounds like you need to schedule a BuddyUpTM trip with your guys and head to Landmand.  I've already got my trip in the planning stages to get out that way next fall...
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Jason Thurman on September 16, 2022, 04:09:34 PM
John has already been to Landmand. His thoughts were quoted, poorly, all weekend.


I do shiver to think how ridiculous we must've looked on Monday afternoon. I sure hope Vaughn didn't have the drone running when we left 16 green.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 16, 2022, 05:05:55 PM
John has already been to Landmand. His thoughts were quoted, poorly, all weekend.


I do shiver to think how ridiculous we must've looked on Monday afternoon. I sure hope Vaughn didn't have the drone running when we left 16 green.


Jason,


Thanks. I bet more happiness would have been had had my advice been heeded. Specifically, donít drive or walk past your ball to evaluate your options. Embrace the unfairness of innocence. Yea, I found the right rough on my layup on 1. Nobody cares.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Terry Lavin on September 16, 2022, 08:29:08 PM
Drive about 20 miles north of North Platte, pull over on the side of the highway, face east and take a picture. Send it to friends and they will ask what course it is and tell you how cool it looks.


You tell them it's not a course, it's just the sand hills, if that open expanse of dunes doesn't make them wanna visit then find new friends.


I second this emotion.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Pete_Pittock on September 17, 2022, 06:41:49 PM
There is no conflict with college football on Saturdays. :D


(When Frank Leahy moved on from coaching at Notre Dame he moved to Oregon. When asked why he said that there was no college football there. The Leahy's were next door neighbors when I was doing K-12.)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Sean_A on September 18, 2022, 04:44:06 AM
Those dudes climbing that hill are hilarious.


I've made a similar climb on my local muni many times, maybe a hundred. The game is about the walk, as said in GITK. I hated that book, but love that sentiment.


Why Nebraska? The land looks compelling. That's the most interesting thing to me, as a well-above-14 handicapper. I don't get to play often enough to get that down, but it certainly looks interesting.


The people who post on here are spoiled. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's worth considering. Most golfers simply don't have the ways or means to play that much.


George,


Me and you have spent the last 20 years discussing access. How does maximum exposure help anyone, outside the storytellers, get a tee time at a private club?

As a guy who dislikes golf course photos, drone shots must really get up yer nose. I am not sure why it all matters to you so much, but I do notice you are mellowing with age .

Ciao
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Matthew Rose on September 18, 2022, 05:40:22 AM
There is no conflict with college football on Saturdays. :D

Yeah, that one hurts.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Mike Hendren on September 18, 2022, 11:42:03 AM
There is no conflict with college football on Saturdays. :D

Yeah, that one hurts.


So I take it the answer is not that the local economy needs a boost to fund Scott Frostís buyout.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Mike Hendren on September 18, 2022, 11:50:51 AM
She needs wide open spaces.
- The Dixie Chicks

I love the vastness of the state.


Just bringing if the full circle Barney as I recall you once referred to Natalie as ďthe fat Dixie Chick.Ē
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Josh Bills on September 19, 2022, 12:59:06 PM
Here are a few from my visit in 2014. Loved it all.


(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52369438141_3ca619b855_o.jpg)


(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52368498632_84e5ed14dc_o.jpg)


(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52368495807_e3a03c86ba_o.jpg)


(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52368488147_833993e96c_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Ken Moum on September 19, 2022, 05:38:11 PM
My best answer is based on my reaction to the sand hills back in the 1980s when I drove through several times on my way to Arizona from Pierre, SD.


Every time I thought, "This looks like a golf course."


It did, and it does.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Terry Lavin on September 19, 2022, 05:54:59 PM
Itís interesting that Hutchinson Kansas was discovered many decades earlier, when the Carey family decided to build a golf course on the land above their played-out salt mine. Without Prairie Dunes, would Sand Hills and Dismal River still have come to be?


Probably so, but isnít it interesting that PD may have invented the Midwestern sand/land model, only to wait decades for Dick Youngscap to fly over Mullen NE and decide to give it a go?


Iím all fired up bc Iím headed to PD for a few days. One of the greatest road trips in American golf.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 19, 2022, 06:13:24 PM
PD is a miracle.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Steve Lang on September 19, 2022, 06:14:10 PM
 8)  https://heartofhuskerland.blogspot.com/2021/09/breakthrough-after-decades-of-n-is-for.html (https://heartofhuskerland.blogspot.com/2021/09/breakthrough-after-decades-of-n-is-for.html)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: John Kavanaugh on September 19, 2022, 06:24:28 PM
Josh,Thank you for those pictures. I have forwarded them to my friend. I was hoping that you were going to post a painting you had created from the region. I would be thrilled if you shared a few. Or even better, post that painting you did of me at TOC. Be nice to get it entered into the anals of GCA.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Terry Lavin on September 19, 2022, 08:19:26 PM
PD is a miracle.


The result of a volcanic event that started in Mexico, or so Iíve heard. I just love the course and the welcoming nature of the local members.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Edward Glidewell on September 23, 2022, 04:31:18 PM
.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Dan Herrmann on September 25, 2022, 09:31:27 AM
Why Nebraska?


The people.


I visited Sand Hills in 2011.   July 4, 2001, to be exact.   Drove out from Pennsylvania.


The staff there and at Dismal River was beyond wonderful.   At SH, they urged us to go to the Mullen fireworks show (we didn't do it, and it's still a regret).   I enjoyed my time at Ben's porch talking with Coach that we didn't do a 2nd round.    And the entire crew at Dismal was friendly, kind, and knew how to laugh with us.


No sense of entitlement.   No sense of snootiness.   Just friendly people, the type of which you too rarely find in golf adventures.
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Steve Lang on September 25, 2022, 03:58:33 PM
 8)  Besides Wild Horse played with Adam and the Fifth Major experienced at Dismal's Red & White , it could also be the Ogallala Aquifer or maybe just the fried chicken at the North Platte Airport.


So who grew more corn this year? Nebraska or Iowa??
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Buck Wolter on September 26, 2022, 03:57:51 PM
8)  Besides Wild Horse played with Adam and the Fifth Major experienced at Dismal's Red & White , it could also be the Ogallala Aquifer or maybe just the fried chicken at the North Platte Airport.


So who grew more corn this year? Nebraska or Iowa??


Nebraska isn't even second --probably too many acres of production turned into golf courses
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Jim_Kennedy on September 30, 2022, 04:41:23 PM
(https://www.golfcoursearchitecture.net/Portals/0/EasyDNNNews/14314/638368p647EDNthumbimg-Graybull-1_web.jpg)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: Sven Nilsen on September 30, 2022, 08:07:43 PM
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/cc435/snilsen7/7DEDA6E7-9490-4BE7-B565-88CD6A6C8CA1_1_201_a.jpeg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds) (https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/cc435/snilsen7/7DEDA6E7-9490-4BE7-B565-88CD6A6C8CA1_1_201_a.jpeg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
Title: Re: Why Nebraska?
Post by: George Pazin on October 03, 2022, 04:48:48 PM
I always think about this one (poached from Ran's SH profile, and I feel like I've seen other people take versions of the same pic):


(https://golfclubatlas.com/images/Sandhills17.jpg)


Of all of the photos I've seen of Nebraska golf, this is one of the least compelling to me. Swap out native grasses for cactus and it's too much like the Arizona golf I haven't enjoyed, other than it's golf, which is admittedly better than most things.


I'll take a Dick Daley photo of Wild Horse any and every day of the week.