Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: John Foley on September 14, 2022, 01:02:24 PM
-
#11 @ Essex County in MA?
Just a spectacular hole. Loved the boldness. A miss right is a one of two deep bunkers and a miss left that's not in a bunker trundles down the slope to a severe challenge on the next shot. Short is an option though.
I love how you notice it from the clubhouse. It's way off in the distance you can see the massive rock out croppings in front of you but you can glimpse the green site and know that's unique!!
Green is large w/ some wonderful internal contours[size=78%].[/size]
(https://i.ibb.co/R0sWVrR/ECC-2.jpg)
-
If it's not #1, it's right there.
The mound at the right-center of the green makes putting interesting, as the pin location is often just behind it.
I love the idea of "an island in the sky" like here and the one at CC Buffalo in the quarry.
-
What length constitutes mid length?
-
What length constitutes mid length?
I'd say 160-190.
The subtext I think is that most "great" par threes are short little devils, or long 3.5 pars 200+ yards long.
Same thing with par fours 375-410, or par fives 530-560.
-
It is one of the best I have played!
-
Brian Schneider redesigned the 5th hole of the 1st nine at Montclair Golf Club with 11-Essex as his model. It's a fantastic hole and deceptively difficult for a mid-range par 3. Curious if 11-Essex has the same optical illusion from the tee - at MGC it's difficult to confidently pick a line just given the hole being benched into a side hill with deep bunkering on either side.
-
Brian Schneider redesigned the 5th hole of the 1st nine at Montclair Golf Club with 11-Essex as his model. It's a fantastic hole and deceptively difficult for a mid-range par 3. Curious if 11-Essex has the same optical illusion from the tee - at MGC it's difficult to confidently pick a line just given the hole being benched into a side hill with deep bunkering on either side.
Yes Keith, difficult to trust the yardage on this hole at Essex. It is an optical illusion and all players in our group came up short!
-
What length constitutes mid length?
I'd say 160-190.
The subtext I think is that most "great" par threes are short little devils, or long 3.5 pars 200+ yards long.
Same thing with par fours 375-410, or par fives 530-560.
Thanks, I was thinking a little bit shorter so wanted to clarify.
-
One of my favorite and somewhat scary mid-length par threes is number 7 at Musgrove Mill. Sorry not to have a better picture.
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/ED06A65C-49A4-4087-818B-A739A7FB8419.jpeg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds) (https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/q186/tomwilliamsen/ED06A65C-49A4-4087-818B-A739A7FB8419.jpeg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds)
From the regular tees, it is 175 yards and back tees 190 yards. The green is two-tiered with a ten-foot fall-off back of the green. Short of the green isn't a bad play when the pion is down front. The back right pin is really scary. I was playing with my guest in the member-guest once when a couple in a canoe appeared on the river short and right of the green. I could tell my buddy was nervous. Finally he shouted, "Would you please move? You are in my landing zone!" Indeed they moved and indeed he hit it where they had been.
-
If the yardage we are talking about is 160-190 is there anything better than # 10 on Winged Foot West?
-
I'll submit #5 (Eden) at Camargo and #6 at CC Buffalo for consideration in this excellent question.
-
11 at Essex County in NJ is pretty good also.
-
Nos. 5 and 15 at Camargo are wonderful (Eden and Redan, respectively).
-
I "hate" these threads because it poses a question that even my limited travels keep me up at night.
Somerset Hills 16
Pasatiempo 5
Sleepy Hollow 3
Primland 8
PH2 17
Pac Dunes 17
Friar's Head 17
Southern Pines 7
Ira
-
I do like #11 at Essex but would not be my top mid-range one shotter even in the same county. I prefer #16 at Myopia for the runaway green and drama of not knowing where your ball landed but watching for the roll-out. One can legitimately hit the golf shop with the teeshot, which adds a bit to the mix as well. #16 is also the last of the truly precise approaches one must hit at Myopia, and thus a likely match decider.
Traveling farther afield, I'd prefer:
#7 at Cypress
#6 at Pinehurst No. 4
#4 at NGLA (Redan copy)
#8 at Mammoth Dunes
#5 at Pebble
Of them all I'd have to put #7 at Cypress as the finest mid-range in the US. It's perhaps among a very small handful of transitional threepars, where you've emerged from the forest and enter the dunes all in one glorious 175 yard stretch.
Thank you for this thread - a nice reminder of how lucky I've been to travel to these places.
-
If enough people bite, this thread could go on for years. Pretty much every great course has a great 160-190 par 3. The more challenging question is which great golf course doesn’t have one:
-
If enough people bite, this thread could go on for years. Pretty much every great course has a great 160-190 par 3. The more challenging question is which great golf course doesn’t have one:
Merion
-
From the regular men’s tees, 3 at Merion is awfully good. And 9 from the right hand tee doesn’t stink. I guess 17 doesn’t qualify.
-
From the regular men’s tees, 3 at Merion is awfully good. And 9 from the right hand tee doesn’t stink. I guess 17 doesn’t qualify.
I don't know too many people who play from 6100 and would consider 170/176 "mid length." They are all great par 3's, just meaty!
-
Merion -
West
-
If enough people bite, this thread could go on for years. Pretty much every great course has a great 160-190 par 3. The more challenging question is which great golf course doesn’t have one:
Not sure I've seen a better mid-length par 3 than the 3rd at Pine Valley. If that doesn't quite fit into "mid-length", then I would submit Pine Valley as a great golf course which doesn't have one. 5 and 14 are both long and 10 is pretty short - at least as I remember it.
-
#3 at PV is 180 from regular tees. Mid length by this definition.
-
#6 at Riviera would be my choice, the donut hole.
-
The 11th at White Bear Yacht Club
(https://golfclubatlas.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/WBYC11-1.png)
In Ran's words:
Eleventh hole, 180 yards; There are three ways a putting surface challenges: size/configuration, tilt/pitch and interior undulations. There are countless permutations within each category. This rectangular green surrounded by bunkers features elements of all three. The right third is elevated and features a puffed up knob. The hole location is invariably there on ‘The Angry Bear,’ which is the equivalent of Tough Day and as much as any hole location on the course, can prompt players to turn incandescent. The rest of the green is canted and slides from high right to lower back left. It and the seventh are among the most complicated greens on the course and its multi-faceted nature emphasizes the point that discerning the best play isn’t nearly as evident at White Bear Yacht Club as it is at most courses where greens are angled toward the player with monotonous regularity.
-
If enough people bite, this thread could go on for years. Pretty much every great course has a great 160-190 par 3. The more challenging question is which great golf course doesn’t have one:
What I want to know is what is/are the best significantly up hill Par 3s?
At St Davids in Wayne PA (Ross 1927) we have one #10 which is loved and #14 is near universally considered the worst hole the course. Neither is easy. #10 IS the hardest par for a scratch on the course and #14 is hardest par 3 (of 5) for the 18+ Handicapper.