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GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Scott Weersing on September 14, 2022, 09:41:30 AM

Title: Killed the greens
Post by: Scott Weersing on September 14, 2022, 09:41:30 AM
I was looking for a thread of when the greenskeeping staff ruined the greens at your local course.


Here is the most recent mistake


https://www.wsfa.com/2022/09/12/groundskeeping-issue-poisons-ross-bridge-golf-course/

Share your story of when someone applied the wrong thing on the greens.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: David_Tepper on September 14, 2022, 10:38:54 AM
Better link here:

https://www.wsfa.com/2022/09/12/groundskeeping-issue-poisons-ross-bridge-golf-course/ (https://www.wsfa.com/2022/09/12/groundskeeping-issue-poisons-ross-bridge-golf-course/)


Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Tom_Doak on September 14, 2022, 01:27:12 PM
I think there is a thread from a few months back relating to someone at Royal Melbourne mixing a spray tank wrong and killing the grass on several greens [or holes, I don't remember which].  And that's with one of the best superintendents in the world overseeing things.


Occasionally, bad mistakes happen.  You just have to put your head down and fix them.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Ian Mackenzie on September 14, 2022, 03:52:08 PM
My brother in law is a member at CC of Detroit and I believe that happened there about 10 years ago.
If TD is lurking here, he will know for sure.


The rumor was that the super got into a fight with a supplier who then shipped a bunch of top-dressing over that had some shit in it that killed the greens.


Heard s similar story from Knollwood here in Chicago after Keith Foster did a reno on the Colt/Allison design.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Ken Moum on September 14, 2022, 08:26:10 PM
When I worked for GCSAA a member once told me there were two kinds of superintendents...those who have killed the grass and those who will kill it.


Not entirely true, but it's a good example of superintendent humor.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Anthony_Nysse on September 15, 2022, 06:00:43 AM
I think there is a thread from a few months back relating to someone at Royal Melbourne mixing a spray tank wrong and killing the grass on several greens [or holes, I don't remember which].  And that's with one of the best superintendents in the world overseeing things.


Occasionally, bad mistakes happen.  You just have to put your head down and fix them.


Royal Melbourne greens may be ‘ripped out’ due to - DailyGolfJournal.com (https://dailygolfjournal.com/royal-melbourne-greens-may-be-ripped-out-due-to/)
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Anthony_Nysse on September 15, 2022, 06:09:26 AM
About 7 years ago, 18 golf courses in the states had severe-to-dead turfgrass on their greens from an application of Armor Tech Alt 70, which is the generic brand for Aluminum tris, more commonly know as Signature Fungicide.


If memory serves me right, this specific fungicide was made in the same mixing/loading as a herbicide that this company distributes. There was enough residual product in the mixing tanks to kill turf.


This is part of the reason I am not a big believer of generics. There is a lot more risk for the small savings in cost.


The grass is not greener at Rye Golf Club (lohud.com) (https://www.lohud.com/story/news/local/westchester/2015/06/19/dead-greens-rye-golf-club-course-westchester-ny-newyork-greens-armortechalt-armortech-fungicide/29014177/)
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: A.G._Crockett on September 15, 2022, 08:10:19 AM
There was a problem with this at Caledonia last year.  The greens are Bermuda, but they overseed with rye for the winter months. When a buddy and I got there for a two-day CGA tournament in early December, the last three or four greens on each side were patchy rye and painted dirt.  It was startling, to say the least, because Caledonia is usually so well conditioned.


I was told that they had used a growth retardant on the Bermuda to help the rye overseed come in faster, and that the second batch was improperly mixed.  It wasn’t clear at that point whether the Bermuda was dead or not, and I haven’t been back down there, so I don’t know what happened in the spring.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Keith Williams on September 15, 2022, 10:11:58 AM
Well, never want to hear about this happening really anywhere; but if there is a place where such an event would have negligible impact on the world of golf course architecture, Ross Bridge is it.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Mark Lester on September 22, 2022, 07:43:02 PM
Peter Smith, Supt. of Shinnecock told me early in my career that " you're not a real superintendent until you kill some grass that you were trying to grow"  I did it early with Acclaim and had to "spend my way out of it".
Tank mixing can be enlightening at times..........

Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Jim Franklin on September 23, 2022, 09:00:02 AM
I have a question for the supers. If your fairway grass has very short root structure, is it better to continually water the fairway or only water periodically so the roots will grow and search for water? 007 bent is the grass. Thanks for any help.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Ronald Montesano on September 24, 2022, 08:36:40 PM
I think that Ross Bridge is a treasure. It deserves to recover fully. I loved that course from 8200 yards and would love it from any distance.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Alan FitzGerald CGCS MG on September 30, 2022, 08:43:07 AM



The contamination of a product happens from time to time as Tony mentioned. I got lucky with the ALT70 as I got the word about it the day before it was scheduled to go out..... I wasn't so lucky in 01, when we sprayed Betasan that was contaminated with Round-up - that was a fun few months....


It happens on from every side. I've seen applications burn when the weather changed unexpectantly, fertilizer burn from the spreader not being turned on or something breaking, overlaps from careless operators, someone accidently spraying Roundup as the drum looked the same as the fungicide they were supposed to spray and just grabbed it, to name but a few. (And for clarity, I'm not a walking disaster! These were just ones I'd witnessed/seen at different places over the years - like the Farmers Insurance"we know a thing or two" ads!). There are so many ways it can happen, some you get away with and others you don't.


When I first became a superintendent an older one also dropped the "you're not a superintendent until you've lost some grass and recovered". Personally I think you need to be not be afraid to lose a little turf as then you can see how far you can push things, but the goal is to avoid mistakes like misapplication of a product.


To the original post, recovery would depend on exactly what was put out. Some chemicals would have a very long residual and prevent seed to grow but most of the time it can be worked around with aeration, charcoal to neutralize it, watering to flush it etc. It takes time so patience is important, otherwise, the alternative is to rip the soil out and rebuild.
Title: Re: Killed the greens
Post by: Alan FitzGerald CGCS MG on September 30, 2022, 08:51:38 AM
I have a question for the supers. If your fairway grass has very short root structure, is it better to continually water the fairway or only water periodically so the roots will grow and search for water? 007 bent is the grass. Thanks for any help.


This is too broad of a description to answer. It would depend on a lot of things, largely the soil and water quality but also the age of the turf, fertility regime, aeration practices etc.


Deep and infrequent it the ideal way to water but unfortunately it is not always the best option for the reasons listed above so doesn't automatically mean the roots will hunt for water.