Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Jud_T on October 27, 2014, 07:03:39 PM
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I probably won't get a chance to read it cover to cover for a couple weeks, but here's my first impressions:
1. It's a beautiful book, the pictures and paper stock are very high quality.
2. I was pleasantly surprised to find a personalized inscription.
3. I love the detailed drawings of certain holes and routings.
4. There's not that much disparity in grades to nitpick. At first glance it appears that Ran tends to be a bit generous with his numerical rankings, Masa and Darius a bit stingy with Tom somewhere in the middle. There are several courses where all 4 agree to the letter (apparently Carnoustie's definitely an 8!), and some where there's a difference of up to 3 points. (Excepting the Castle which has already been discussed).
5. The Gourmet's Choice seems more to my liking with a couple real surprises (Painswick?!!)
6. The ranking of all courses in the back is a surprise.
7. Can't wait to dig into the meat of the writing and find the next gem for my next trip.
8. Masa's got some splainin to do about the 3 he gave Lundin.
9. Ran needs to defend the 7 he gave Skibo Castle.
10. How did Tralee go from a 0-5 to a straight 5?
Just my first impressions. Let the fur fly...
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Was at the Post Office @9:15....alas, no early Christmas, yet..... :-[
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Got it today. Went through most of it and I agree, not much to argue about. It is very well done. Planning my trip to play the 'outside the rota' courses right now.
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We need to keep a careful balance so as not to dissuade others from buying the books. I'd like to see most specific commentary kept offline at least until the first run is sold out.
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John,
I agree. In case anyone needs further guidance, it's inappropriate to post entire lists or a long list of numerical rankings. Let's keep it to specific courses as a stepping off point for discussion and not veer into reprinting material wholesale.
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It's here and I can't wait to open it later tonight!
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OK since no one else will ask, or perhaps thought to ask, what did the Renaissance Course get from all four?
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Tee hee - attaboy, Ian! If you're a professional and well respected architect in your own right, who better to ask the questions no one else will! But I'm still surprised you beat Mike Young to the punch :)
Peter
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OK since no one else will ask, or perhaps thought to ask, what did the Renaissance Course get from all four?
That deserves a spoiler alert. How is this any different from giving out the ending to Gone Girl? We should be allowed to enjoy discovering what is in the book on our own time. It's a novel idea.
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Did it come US mail UPS.
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That deserves a spoiler alert. How is this any different from giving out the ending to Gone Girl? We should be allowed to enjoy discovering what is in the book on our own time. It's a novel idea.
The book is excellent but there is no need for any spoilier alerts because it is a very bland book with very little controversial opinion or unexpected outcomes.
1. British golf courses are universally great but not perfect meaning over half the courses in the book are between a 5 and a 7
2. There are few modern British/Irish courses or disfigured British/Irish courses and these are the courses that will draw zeros or amusing critiques.
3. After 10 years of reading Doak on here, you can get a fair idea about what he is going to like.
4 It is obvious from reading the book that there is no point arguing whether a course is a 6 or a 7, or a 7 or an 8. It just doesn't matter.
What matters is that you can get a quick and easy idea about what courses to plan a trip around. And the book is unbelievably good for this.
Oh, and the Renaissance Club gets a 7 from Doak (same as Kingsbarn) and 6s from the rest, although Doak labours the point that they have not seen the new holes.
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Mine will be the first on eBay. Why even read the damn things when I can come on here and see it all for free. Amazing. I'm never playing overseas anyways.
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John -- Im very sensitive to copyright infringement, and agree we should proceed with discretion.
But do you think ANYONE in this nuthouse is going to forego buying the book because of what's posted here?
As fantastic as Mucci's insights are, I want a copy for myself.
And if my mailman is reading: Your Christmas gift is decreasing if my book isn't here tomorrow.
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Mine will be the first on eBay. Why even read the damn things when I can come on here and see it all for free. Amazing. I'm never playing overseas anyways.
I think selling or not buying the book would be a wise decision for you. It is a travel guide intended to help people plan a golf trip. If you don't intend to travel to Great Britain and Ireland (or have passport restrictions that prohibit such travel) then there is little point to owning the book.
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John -- Im very sensitive to copyright infringement, and agree we should proceed with discretion.
But do you think ANYONE in this nuthouse is going to forego buying the book because of what's posted here?
As fantastic as Mucci's insights are, I want a copy for myself.
And if my mailman is reading: Your Christmas gift is decreasing if my book isn't here tomorrow.
Yes. The proof is in the fact that not everyone bought the entire series. What I don't understand is the empowerment some people feel by being the first on social media to spoil the creative accomplishments of others. I think I will sell mine in the unopened package addressed to me. This could be interesting after all.
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I probably won't get a chance to read it cover to cover for a couple weeks, but here's my first impressions:
1. It's a beautiful book, the pictures and paper stock are very high quality.
2. I was pleasantly surprised to find a personalized inscription.
3. I love the detailed drawings of certain holes and routings.
4. There's not that much disparity in grades to nitpick. At first glance it appears that Ran tends to be a bit generous with his numerical rankings, Masa and Darius a bit stingy with Tom somewhere in the middle. There are several courses where all 4 agree to the letter (apparently Carnoustie's definitely an 8!), and some where there's a difference of up to 3 points. (Excepting the Castle which has already been discussed).
5. The Gourmet's Choice seems more to my liking with a couple real surprises (Painswick?!!)
6. The ranking of all courses in the back is a surprise.
7. Can't wait to dig into the meat of the writing and find the next gem for my next trip.
8. Masa's got some splainin to do about the 3 he gave Lundin.
9. Ran needs to defend the 7 he gave Skibo Castle.
10. How did Tralee go from a 0-5 to a straight 5?
Just my first impressions. Let the fur fly...
Jud, if you haven't played Painswick your golf architecture education is incomplete. Seriously!
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
Why? He's right.
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I received my copy of the book today as well. I have only skimmed through it, but I want to give many thanks to Tom Doak, et al., for updating this excellent resource.
Now I just need to convince my wife to take another trip across the Atlantic to actually heed the advice contained within the book!
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What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
John:
I have expressed the same thought about not wanting to see long photo threads of golf courses that I haven't seen yet.
I discovered that the answer to this problem is simple ... just don't read the relevant thread(s). I deliberately stayed away from the photo tours of Glens Falls and Teugega and Monroe [if, in fact, there was one for each of them] before going to see them, and I had a great time discovering them for myself.
You could do the same with this thread, and keep your book.
Besides, with the personal inscription, the resale value will be limited. :D
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Tom,
It's even better than I expected. The new features that you've added make it an even better resource, yet it keeps the character that we're used to from the prior book.
John K,
Open the book and spend an hour. If this doesn't get you at least craving a trip to that part of the world, then you're a lost cause. :D
I hadn't really thought about posting on the book being a spoiler for others, but having spent a bit of time with it I do understand. Unfortunately, given the amount of time distribution is bound to take (especially overseas), I don't see much way things are staying quiet. Maybe a SPOILER ALERT type thread that those who prefer to discover on their own can avoid?
And, Tom, feel free to comment on Glens Falls now that you've seen it.
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OK since no one else will ask, or perhaps thought to ask, what did the Renaissance Course get from all four?
That deserves a spoiler alert. How is this any different from giving out the ending to Gone Girl? We should be allowed to enjoy discovering what is in the book on our own time. It's a novel idea.
John, perhaps you should peruse one of the several thousand other threads here, rather than the one with the information and insight you would like to avoid.
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Tom,
I just finished watching the final episode of Boardwalk Empire, only 24 hrs from first showing. Escaping the spoilers throughout the day was exhausting. I'm just so damn weak but avoiding TV blogs comes easier than avoiding this site. If i do sell the book I will sell it unopened in whatever package it is mailed to me. I'm sure the collector who makes the purchase will understand the collectible value in keeping the book in this condition. Your inscription will remain one of mystery and for the ages, if it was inscribed at all. No one will ever know unless they choose to break the seal.
Of course if people can keep from revealing all the interesting contents of the book I just may feel the need to read it myself.
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I have cracked it open, love the look of it. As understated a title page as any book in the past 75 years, I'd say. And how gracious of Tom to inscribe all those copies!
John, you will want to crack it open. It's one thing to sniff the wine, another to drink it!
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We need to keep a careful balance so as not to dissuade others from buying the books. I'd like to see most specific commentary kept offline at least until the first run is sold out.
Instead of dissuading, it may persuade others to buy the book. Just like previews/reviews do with all sorts of media, from movies to TV shows to books to plays to computer games.
And unlike the finale to a TV show, there is not one ending to the new CG. There are, what, 250 courses, each with four ratings? That's 1000 ratings in all to pore over.
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The other point is that those who really value this resource understand that the heart of the book is in the written reviews. That's where you'll find whether a course suits your personal interests and game, not in whether Turnberry is a 7 or an 8 (p.s. Its a 7 damn it! :)). Those who want to focus solely on the numbers would do better to stick with the instant gratification golf rags. This is a book to be savored over and over for years to come.
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Hopeful that my book is waiting for me when I get home today...
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
Don't go to a Discussion Group about golf course architecture and you won't have this problem. I love you John, but seriously, don't open a thread ABOUT THE BOOK if you don't want to ruin your experience.
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Modern etiquette towards spoilers is a grey area. Doak seems to not have a problem so that should rule the day.
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I was happy to see the !, ?, and !? were explained in this book. I remember going through the original Confidential Guide trying to find it and thinking I was an idiot because I could not find the definitions. I figured the ! meant a great hole and ? was not, but it was nice to find out what the ?! notation finally meant.
I am happy with an autographed copy too. Thanks again.
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
Hey about simply not reading the thread !!! is that too complicated a concept to not spoil your reading?
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Oh, and the Renaissance Club gets a 7 from Doak (same as Kingsbarn) and 6s from the rest, although Doak labours the point that they have not seen the new holes.
Thanks David
I should order the book(s) at some point ... now that I'm home for a spell
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Tom,
I just finished watching the final episode of Boardwalk Empire, only 24 hrs from first showing. Escaping the spoilers throughout the day was exhausting. I'm just so damn weak but avoiding TV blogs comes easier than avoiding this site. If i do sell the book I will sell it unopened in whatever package it is mailed to me. I'm sure the collector who makes the purchase will understand the collectible value in keeping the book in this condition. Your inscription will remain one of mystery and for the ages, if it was inscribed at all. No one will ever know unless they choose to break the seal.
Of course if people can keep from revealing all the interesting contents of the book I just may feel the need to read it myself.
Do you hate book reviews on Amazon too?
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Still patiently waiting for my copy - perhaps stuck at the border coming into Canada. Looking forward to diving in when it arrives...
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Still patiently waiting for my copy - perhaps stuck at the border coming into Canada. Looking forward to diving in when it arrives...
Matt:
If it requires a customs form, your order will be shipped tomorrow. We tried to get as many of the simplest orders as we could process out first. Now we are falling back on the international books and the credit card rejections. A few international books have shipped, but I'm working on the rest today.
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I would think buying Barney's copy just to read the inscription would be worth at least $100.
I haven't gotten my copy yet, but the inscription in my father's was worth price for the set!
Thank you Tom!
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Give it a rest Kavanaugh...please.
Ciao
What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
Hey about simply not reading the thread !!! is that too complicated a concept to not spoil your reading?
But if he did that, what would he have to complain about? Who are we kidding, he would find plenty to complain about, just for the hell of it. He's like The Joker--"some people just like to see the world burn."
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Got it, opended it and am enjoying it.
My plan to see Askernish next Summer is reinforced.
So far no "Michelin" 3 ! holes. The very best hole(s) in the world may be elsewhere. Or maybe there will be no best hole.
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Very interesting reading.
The gourmets choice was particularly interesting and certainly food for thought next time I venture home.
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Still patiently waiting for my copy - perhaps stuck at the border coming into Canada. Looking forward to diving in when it arrives...
Matt:
If it requires a customs form, your order will be shipped tomorrow. We tried to get as many of the simplest orders as we could process out first. Now we are falling back on the international books and the credit card rejections. A few international books have shipped, but I'm working on the rest today.
Excellent - thank you for the response Tom!
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Mine will be the first on eBay. Why even read the damn things when I can come on here and see it all for free. Amazing. I'm never playing overseas anyways.
I trust you don't own any books, because after all there are things called libraries! ;D
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Mine will be the first on eBay. Why even read the damn things when I can come on here and see it all for free. Amazing. I'm never playing overseas anyways.
I trust you don't own any books, because after all there are things called libraries! ;D
I quit buying books after the day I was walking past an ex-librarians house during her estate auction. The bid was at $200 for a lifetime of books from floor to ceiling in many rooms. For the sum of $250 I procured the entire collection. One of the biggest mistakes in my life as they now haunt me to be read, can not be burned and required thousands of dollars in bookcases to be stored. My second biggest mistake was my world class bourbon collection whose saving grace was that it could be drank. I'm done collecting.
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Still patiently waiting for my copy - perhaps stuck at the border coming into Canada. Looking forward to diving in when it arrives...
Matt,
My copy arrived this morning, so expect yours soon.
TK
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Got mine a few days ago. Opened up a new bottle of Bushmills and started my fireplace .
Enjoyed it so much. Well presented , the ratings are always controversial but fun. Enjoyed the comments of the " Four Wise Men " .
Worth every penny and the wait.
Well done and much appreciated!!!
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Reading it and loving it.
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Got mine today, and let me add my compliments to all the rest here - a lovely and engaging book.
I never saw the original CG, and so something struck me that I didn't expect, i.e. how even the sometimes very short descriptions of a course paint a picture in my head and guide me towards those courses I think I'd like to play first/most (setting aside the perennials, the 9s and 10s). So, for example:
Little Aston - a graceful design that is neither over-bunkered nor severe
Huntercombe - It reminds me more of Garden City than an other course we've seen
Woking - It is a course that calls for the soul of an architect to master its difficulties
Gullane - the golf is always worthwhile
Delamere Forest - Fowler's minimalistic, low-key architecture is in keeping with the club's ambience.
After quickly jumping around through all of GB&I, I'm currently enjoying the stroll through England very much. Thanks TD and Ran et al for a fine book.
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What is so wrong with wanting to read a book before it's contents are splayed out on the internet? I know it sounds old fashion and perhaps even honorable, but really, isn't that what we claim golf to be about? A sense of self discovery, a sense of finding our own way, patience, hard work and challenge? Whatever you guys want, it's all good to me as I am sure I can secure a tidy profit on eBay.
John:
I have expressed the same thought about not wanting to see long photo threads of golf courses that I haven't seen yet.
I discovered that the answer to this problem is simple ... just don't read the relevant thread(s). I deliberately stayed away from the photo tours of Glens Falls and Teugega and Monroe [if, in fact, there was one for each of them] before going to see them, and I had a great time discovering them for myself.
You could do the same with this thread, and keep your book.
Besides, with the personal inscription, the resale value will be limited. :D
I would suggest that the personal inscription to John would dramatically increase the value not decrease it...
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Mine will be the first on eBay. Why even read the damn things when I can come on here and see it all for free. Amazing. I'm never playing overseas anyways.
I trust you don't own any books, because after all there are things called libraries! ;D
I quit buying books after the day I was walking past an ex-librarians house during her estate auction. The bid was at $200 for a lifetime of books from floor to ceiling in many rooms. For the sum of $250 I procured the entire collection. One of the biggest mistakes in my life as they now haunt me to be read, can not be burned and required thousands of dollars in bookcases to be stored. My second biggest mistake was my world class bourbon collection whose saving grace was that it could be drank. I'm done collecting.
Do you take outside visitors to help you enjoy both of those collections? Sit and read a book or two while helping you drink the bourbon collection?
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Tom
Chuffed you got to Leckford and gave it the thumbs up (Whittington and Harborne too) , but what a pity you couldn't find Meyrick Park! Painswick getting its due too: I wonder how you would have viewed it in 1982?
Ran must be cringing at the typo in the England intro :D
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Still patiently waiting for my copy - perhaps stuck at the border coming into Canada. Looking forward to diving in when it arrives...
Matt,
My copy arrived this morning, so expect yours soon.
TK
Hmmm - still waiting here but trying to stay patient!
I'm a bit worried that on the purchase confirmation email, it indicated "US" as the shipping destination instead of Canada but the order receipt email had everything correct. Needless to say, if this ended up in the US pile by accident, the book will likely be sitting at the border without customs paperwork. I sent an email to Brian just to make sure...
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I have only glanced once at the original Confidential Guide, but never read it. I didn't have much of a basis for opinion going into receiving the current Confidential Guide in the mail. But I was certainly excited to receive it.
Here are my comments:
1. Maybe the summaries have been softened from the original, but I don't really see them as all that controversial, just honest (I'm about half way thru reading it). But I was surprised (based on what I've read here), as I was expecting much harsher criticisms.
2. This book has to be a dream for some of the lesser known courses. Seeing a Doak 5 or 6 with 2 or 3 very unique holes and awesome views will now jump up on my priority list for subsequent trips.
3. It's definitely not a picture book. You may need to set aside your ADD or desire for Golf porn and just focus a little harder on the reading. But the reading is very fun and hard to put down.
4. I really like the golf hole diagrams. The one of #4 at TOC really brought me back to a great memory of the hole, more so than pictures would have done
5. I would have liked to have seen a simple routing (lines only would have sufficed) for the Gourmet Choice section. I have seen many of the courses, but for the ones I haven't, comparing the summaries with the routing would have given the summaries much more context.
6. It's a sin I have not spent any time playing in England yet.
7. Love the maps with locations of the courses
Great work to all involved. I can't wait to read the entire set. Now I just need to figure out how and when to get to all these special places.
I am excited to take this first volume along with True Links by George Peper and plan some fantastic future trips.
Shane
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I've been reading it now for a few days and nights and I have to say that I am really enjoying it. I love this book!!
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Still haven't got the courage up to unpack mine.
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My signed copy arrived in pristine condition yesterday. Thank you to Tom and everybody involved with making this happen. ;)
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I have only glanced once at the original Confidential Guide, but never read it. I didn't have much of a basis for opinion going into receiving the current Confidential Guide in the mail. But I was certainly excited to receive it.
Here are my comments:
1. Maybe the summaries have been softened from the original, but I don't really see them as all that controversial, just honest (I'm about half way thru reading it). But I was surprised (based on what I've read here), as I was expecting much harsher criticisms.
2. This book has to be a dream for some of the lesser known courses. Seeing a Doak 5 or 6 with 2 or 3 very unique holes and awesome views will now jump up on my priority list for subsequent trips.
3. It's definitely not a picture book. You may need to set aside your ADD or desire for Golf porn and just focus a little harder on the reading. But the reading is very fun and hard to put down.
4. I really like the golf hole diagrams. The one of #4 at TOC really brought me back to a great memory of the hole, more so than pictures would have done
5. I would have liked to have seen a simple routing (lines only would have sufficed) for the Gourmet Choice section. I have seen many of the courses, but for the ones I haven't, comparing the summaries with the routing would have given the summaries much more context.
6. It's a sin I have not spent any time playing in England yet.
7. Love the maps with locations of the courses
Great work to all involved. I can't wait to read the entire set. Now I just need to figure out how and when to get to all these special places.
I am excited to take this first volume along with True Links by George Peper and plan some fantastic future trips.
Shane
I'm with you on #5. It's what hooked me on the World Atlas of Golf many years ago. And those had an illustrated, 3-D look.
Yes, you do need to get to England, really more links courses than Scotland I think.
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"Still haven't got the courage up to unpack mine."
John K. -
Be sure to let us know when you do. All 1,499 of us are on pins & needles waiting to find out. ;)
DT
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Still haven't got the courage up to unpack mine.
As Dan Rather used to say [briefly, until they gave him crap for it]: Courage!
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I read a bit of mine over the weekend, but will have to postpone a complete reading for several years until I start planning my next golf trip to GB/I.
In the meantime, congratulations to everyone involved for producing such a beautiful book!
Nobody around here needs to be told how good Tom or Ran is at writing about golf courses, but I would like to share that my wife (who needed to see what all the fuss was about) quickly praised Tom's clear and meaningful writing.
The book (which is much larger than I expected) is beautifully laid out, thanks to Tom's wife, Jennifer.
The decision to use photographs of less-recognizable holes and courses was a great one.
I'd also like to particularly commend Angela Moser for her diagrams. Hope she becomes the next Gil Hanse!
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When I got my original copy, I read it from cover to cover in one night. And then used it as reference from time to time as the need arose. This time I just thumbed through it and expect to read at a much more leisurely pace. I'm busy with golf during the best times to travel to GB&I, so I don't know when or if I'll ever get back. I know a few guys that would like to visit Ireland and I'd love to be their guide, but between the retired guys getting body parts replaced and the guys still working, it's hard to put together.
I'll be much more interested in warm destinations in North America. Someplace I can go when we're playing on frozen tundra or dodging snow banks, if not completely shut down. Hope it doesn't take a year for that volume to come out. Also hope I'm not one of those guys getting their knees and hips replaced and just have to read it by the fire. There are much worse possibilities, as well.
Good job on the book by Tom and his crew. On a quick scan it seems a bit mellower and less edgy, and more of a celebration of good golf. Or maybe that's just my take as a full fledged geezer and that I'm just flapping my jaw to see if I get a gold star when I get to 500 posts.
I'm happy more folks will get the chance to read this wonderful book. Anyone know how many were printed this time around?
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I just got it. Fantastic, just as I expected. I'm going to take my time reading every little bit of it.
When is volume 2 coming out?
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Shane Wright:
Actually, your post reminds me of the original Confidential Guide. It wasn't a picture book. It was all about the writing. Specifically, I think Tom taught us that presenting a description of each hole wasn't really the best way to write about a golf course. Instead, Tom demonstrated the art of succinctly summing up what was noteworthy about each golf course. Tough thing to do. Tom did it so well.
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Very envious of those who've received there's. Looking forward to getting and reading mine from cover-to-cover plus seeing 'my' photo in print!
atb
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Never saw the original but I don't think anyone will be disappointed, other than if their favourites don't get the score they think it merits, which is part of the fun.
Really hits the nail on the head for most, is harsh on some, generous on others and non existent on one or two that leaves you questioning what the point in inclusion was ( Ferndown 3 secretary wanted to charge to walk the course in 1983 and no ones been back since).
Best review was of Hankley Common, hope they read it.
Only criticism is gratuitously dropping renaissance club into too many lists at the back of the book and too many courses marked too closely together as "about the average of those listed in the book".
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Only criticism is gratuitously dropping renaissance club into too many lists at the back of the book and too many courses marked too closely together as "about the average of those listed in the book".
I think The Renaissance Club is the best conditioned course in Scotland, and that it has several really outstanding holes. So sue me.
As for the latter comment, well, a lot of courses are 5's and not many are 9's and 10's. Sure, some 5's are more fun than others, but that's largely up to the individual, and we don't try to draw distinctions that aren't there.
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Still haven't got the courage up to unpack mine.
As Dan Rather used to say [briefly, until they gave him crap for it]: Courage!
.......or, "What's the frequency, Kenneth?"
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Tom,
As Dan Rather used to say [briefly, until they gave him crap for it]: Courage!
Or as my old man used to say whenever life presented difficulties ....."Corragio"
Cheers Colin