Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Mike_Young on June 05, 2013, 10:26:04 PM
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IMHO temptation is one of the ultimate test humans have to confront. And for that reason it is one of the subtle tools an architect has in laying out a strategy for a golf course. Difficulty does not equate to temptation nearly as much as the disguise of "lack of difficulty".
Name me some of the best known "tempting " holes you know. I'll start by saying IMHO 13 at ANGC is my top pick. Hit me with one. ;)
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10 at Riviera
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9 at Kinloch!
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#6 at Deal
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From geoffshackelford.com re: Augusta National:
Jackie Burke put it best when he said, "It’s the most tempting golf course in the world."
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#6 at Deal
.....is just a stupido play to go right at it! The resulting lies are brutal at best.
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Trying to drive #12 at Rustic is a fool's errand. With #3 not far behind. Great R/R holes there, including #7 in the past, pre-flood.
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#3 at Cruden Bay. You know with a good shot an eagle 2 is very possible but with a less than good shot 7 is possible.
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An unusual choice, but how about the wonderful/evil/awkward par-3 2nd at Dornoch.
Lay-up short and straight, pitch-n-putt, easy-ish par in 3. Go for the narrow green or worse the pin itself, land on any of the steep banks and a big bounce later your ball's in one of the deep hollows or worse in the gorse. Not many up-n-downs from there.......and a bigger number goes on the scorecard.
Nice thread.
All the best
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#1 @ Cherry Hills must have been very tempting to Arnold Palmer in 1960.
he tried to drive the green in all four rounds, finding the water the first three times.
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Only played it once but ill say 4th at woodlands. Safe play for me was probably 4 iron, chip on, however I couldn't resist driver and had a 7.
I will be tempted to use driver on the tee just about every time on this hole!
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6th at Deal is a great call. I'm trying to think of a better short par 4 and am struggling. Far more fun than the 10th at Riviera as far as I'm concerned. It is very tempting, in fact I try driving it virtually every time!
How has that worked out for you?
Number of successes (birdie or eagle ;D) vs number of disasters......
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Brian Silva helped turn 5 at Southampton into a great tempting hole. It measures 285 off the tee, par 4. There is a bunker about 30 yards short of the green that has a huge face on it. The bunker starts at about 235 off the tee, and sits exactly where most long hitting amateurs will land their ball ie. 235 to 250. If you carry it, you are on the green, if you don't the hole is almost over with a 30 yard uphill bunker shot ahead of you with a large face.
A shot of 5 iron and wedge is a lot more practical, but less tempting.
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18th at the Old Course...?!
That said, and I'm no slouch myself, but I'm amazed that TW drove that green a few years ago. And Jack Nicklaus sans jumper too.
It is not what you would ordinarily call a drivable par 4 but all the same fits the eye perfectly on the tee for giving it a whack.
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#17 at Double Eagle. I've had a short eagle putt, and I've also made a double bogey.
#3 at Castle Stuart. Hole-high left, while better than hole-high right, is not exactly easy. Just getting it on the green from down there is difficult.
#6 at Pacific Dunes. My tee shot had the distance, but went in the left green-side bunker. Made a one-putt five.
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5 at Boston Golf Club.
Mark
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6th at Deal is a great call. I'm trying to think of a better short par 4 and am struggling. Far more fun than the 10th at Riviera as far as I'm concerned. It is very tempting, in fact I try driving it virtually every time!
How has that worked out for you?
Number of successes (birdie or eagle ;D) vs number of disasters......
I have not yet played Deal, so can't comment specifically on that hole. However, I think this highlights what makes for a truly great "tempting" golf hole. Very often we know that the percentages are not on our side, but there is such visual appeal that clicks something in (some of) our brains, telling us we simply must have a go at it. I think the really brilliant tempting holes are those that cause many to attempt the low percentage shot in hopes of an eagle/birdie, and often end up in bogey+ ... and yet, next time around, we don't necessarily "learn our lesson" and we go for it again!
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Perhaps not the most tempting hole in the world, but the 17th at Gleneagles (at least in its 1980's configuration, it may have changed) stood out for me.
It was my first ASGCA meeting, first trip to Scotland, and first meeting of the legendary Percy Clifford, many times champion in Mexico. He called it the most tempting hole in Scotland, even though it was a pretty straightforward medium length dogleg with the bunkers on the inside of the DL, and outside of the green. But, to have that run up opening (absolutely required in those days) you had to be right next to the bunker.
It was nice to get that kind of insight from a true golf champion.
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7 at Sand Hills. After four rounds, the correct play was still unclear to me.
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Scary to me when Young and I think too much alike, but as soon as I saw the thread title, I thought...13 at Augusta.
I am a big fan of #16 at Colorado Golf Club. Split fairway, but unlike man "pick your poison" holes, there is a direct temptation to go to the alternate right side fairway, which is a straight down the line of charm, 30 yards shorter option. If you succeed in placing the drive on the right side, you are tempted to take a long to mid-iron right to the target. Play safe, and you open up all kinds of difficulties. Get greedy, and you're in the creek to the right, staring bogey or double in the eye. Hit a good shot, you're looking at an eagle putt. Now that's golf, to me.
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One nobody thinks of because people don't play the course. Stoneham's 13th. Visually, there is zero enticement because the tee shot is blind. Once folks see 273 yards on the card their necks crane for a look. Just a great hole.
http://www.stonehamgolfclub.org.uk/course/holes/hole_13
If its the visual sort of temptation one wants there is none better than Kington's 18th.
Ciao
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Holes that always tempt me
4 and 15 at Kinloch
6 at Ballyhack
14 at Country Club of Florida
15 at Seminole
4 at Providence
12 and 16 at Old White
1 at Secession
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Cypress Point #16
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Disguising the "lack of difficulty" is so much more interesting that a golf course that plays easier than it looks.
The Old Course and Wolf Point are the best examples I've seen.
The 16th at Cypress Point is one of the best and coolest holes in the world, it doesn't hide the danger like the 15th at Wolf Point - although the danger is only a fraction of Cypress'.
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Disguising the "lack of difficulty" is so much more interesting that a golf course that plays easier than it looks.
The Old Course and Wolf Point are the best examples I've seen.
The 16th at Cypress Point is one of the best and coolest holes in the world, it doesn't hide the danger like the 15th at Wolf Point - although the danger is only a fraction of Cypress'.
Watch the shadows for a clue!
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14 at Loch Lomond
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If its the visual sort of temptation one wants there is none better than Kington's 18th.
A great hole but surely driver is the only option? I can't think of another way of playing the hole.
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When I saw the thread title I immediately thought of Tobacco Road. There are a lot of tempting holes on the course, but two that exemplify temptation holes are 5 and 11.
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6 @ Ballyhack
I say this after watching hundreds of players try to tackle the hole. There is temptation on the tee shot but also on the approach that follows a "smart" first strike.
Trouble left of the hole has been thinned by the goats over the past year. Now, wayward shots are findable AND often playable. I notice that players who took on too much on from the tee (and ended up left) often try to bite too much from the recovery shot as well. The green is the trickiest to read on the course, but they don't usually find it anyway.
My favorite thing about the hole is that shorter tee boxes actually bribe players into hitting MORE club. Good players rarely hit driver from the back tee but often do from one or two boxes up. This is backwards from most holes on most courses, where more length means a longer club selection.
There are a couple of effective (and more predictable) ways to play the hole but I'm not giving them away; I've seen too many matches turn 180 degrees between the fifth green and the seventh tee. Add to this that the hole introduces a stretch of relatively "gettable" holes (6-11, and sometimes 12), and it can make a huge difference in outcome.
WW
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I know we've been over the short par 4s at Dormie Club (3, 14, 15) before. Some think there is only one correct way to play them, some disagree. The fact that there is so much argument about them makes them temptation holes.
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It's rarely discussed, but I'd nominate #9 at Congressional, assuming you're playing from the right set of tees. A good drive on this par 5 leaves a chance to go for the green in two, and with no water and only a deep (20-30 feet?) gully in front, people assume that a less-than-great 2nd shot will still leave them in ok position to hit the green in 3. Not so: the lies in the gully are almost always very awkward and more often than not people make 6 or worse from down there.
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#10 at Merion East.
Buffalove goes out to:
#5 and #10 at Donnie Ross' CCBuffalo
#14 at Scott Witter's Arrowhead
#2 and #15 at Russ Tryon's Byrncliff
#16 at robbie jones' Crag Burn
#18 at wally travis' Orchard Park CC.
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#9 at Cypress. Its almost too distracting, but stitting 300 away, elevated tee makes everyone wonder
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#13 at Kingsley. Attempting to drive the green often leaves one with an awkward chip or pitch. Laying up to give yourself a full wedge or 9-iron from the proper angle will yield more birdies and less X's IMO. The fact that the hazard is primarily short grass makes it all that much more tempting.
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#10 at Merion East.
How tempting is this hole normally? It looks like you would have to bend your tee shot so much it probably isn't the optimal play. Do you see anyone going for the green next weekend?
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If its the visual sort of temptation one wants there is none better than Kington's 18th.
A great hole but surely driver is the only option? I can't think of another way of playing the hole.
Noc sir! I have hit all my woods on this hole. Its all about trying to figure out what happens after the ball lands and of course that means controlling ball flight.
Ciao
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1,2 NGLA
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11 at Rivermont (drive-able par 4)
16 Cypress Point (at least it seems like it might be somewhat tempting)
8 Dismal River Nicklaus (drive the green or play out left)
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Agree with Riviera #10 and Rustic Canyon #12. Also how about Merion #13...short par 3....thinking birdie or at least par with a wedge in your hands, but can easily make bogie or worse if you're too greedy.