Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: DMoriarty on May 06, 2012, 07:12:44 PM
-
Not sure if this has been discussed or posted . . . In April 1923 The Spring Valley Water Company devoted an Issue of their Magazine "San Francisco Water" (Volume II, Number 2) to golf around Lake Merced. The articles discuss a number of courses including Olympic, SFGC, California Country Club, the Lake Merced Municipal Course, and Lake Merced Golf and Country Club, and contain a number of photos and course maps.
While it is a bit long to post here, it is available on Google Books, and anyone interested in the development of golf in the Bay Area may want to take a look. Here are the course diagrams and an interesting list of courses for SF and LA.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/Lake-Merced-Muni-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/Olympic-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/CalClub-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SFGC-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/Lake-Merced-GCC-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/192304-CA-courses-.jpg)
Enjoy.
-
DMoriarty -
GREAT find and thanks for posting!
The first course map shown is the current Harding Park. I haven't counted all the holes, but it looks like the Harding-18 and the Fleming-9 were both there back then. Clearly some changes have been made over the years, although the back-9 routing looks pretty much as it does now. Maybe there will be a movement to "restore" those two courses as well. ;)
P.S. Any chance you can post the routing for the Presidio GC? I would really like to see it.
DT
-
Unfortunately there is no routing for Presidio. I believe I included all the routings in the article.
When I get a chance I will try to post the rest of the article, as linking it doesn't seem to work well.
Here is a overview map of golf in the area
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SF-Map-192304.jpg)
-
This great post prompted me to checkout google earth. In doing so it seems that aerial views are now available back to 1938 for much of SF.
-
Wow! Tremendous stuff David. First time I'm seeing this myself.
Thanks for posting and sharing.
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
I was going to take the high road and not make an age joke but you made it easy.
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
I was going to take the high road and not make an age joke but you made it easy.
In some cultures the elders are venerated, not mocked.
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
I was going to take the high road and not make an age joke but you made it easy.
In some cultures the elders are venerated, not mocked.
Some cultures still live in caves and sacrifice virgins.
-
DMoriarty -
GREAT find and thanks for posting!
The first course map shown is the current Harding Park. I haven't counted all the holes, but it looks like the Harding-18 and the Fleming-9 were both there back then. Clearly some changes have been made over the years, although the back-9 routing looks pretty much as it does now. Maybe there will be a movement to "restore" those two courses as well. ;)
P.S. Any chance you can post the routing for the Presidio GC? I would really like to see it.
DT
Harding was only an 18 hole course and a 6 hole course. It would be later that the Fleming 9 would take shape.
These courses represented as having been or still apart of the Spring Valley Water Company properties. Presidio is not connected with SVWC. SVWC produced a newsletter and this was from one of the issues.
Tully
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
If you caddied at the one mentioned here you would certainly be Bill the Elder! This course folded shortly after WWII.
This course is located just past San Rafael High School and before Peacock Gap, it was a nine holer. Robert Hunter had the course record of 67 for a period of time.
It would be later that another group of golfers built their course in Novato using the same name.
Tully
-
The old Ingleside course of both SFGC and Cal Club would go onto becoming a pay as you play course and is the one course in the 1937-8 aerials that I get asked the most about. It had close to 12 holes that played over railroad tracks and some of the tracks were well below grade. Makes a lot of sense that SFGC would move to their current site.
Tully
-
Was #11 at Harding previously a short par 4? It looks like a longer hole than present in the routing above. Perhaps 10 was lengthened and 11 was shortened? I can't see the area of current #11 working as a par 4, though.
-
Was #11 at Harding previously a short par 4? It looks like a longer hole than present in the routing above. Perhaps 10 was lengthened and 11 was shortened? I can't see the area of current #11 working as a par 4, though.
Sure looks like it. Looks as though 14 was previously a par 3. In the 1938 aerial on google earth that is already changed however, with positive effects I'd imagine.
-
It is interesting that the OC Lake Course was described, even then (in 1923!), as a "sheltered course, beautiful with eucalyptus, pine and cypress." One could argue that the current Lake Course is very true to its original conception. ;)
-
I'm curious about Marin Golf and Country Club in San Rafael. The one I am familiar with opened north of San Rafael with the same name in 1956. I'm pretty sure of that, I caddied on opening day for George Splane, the pro then!
If you caddied at the one mentioned here you would certainly be Bill the Elder! This course folded shortly after WWII.
This course is located just past San Rafael High School and before Peacock Gap, it was a nine holer. Robert Hunter had the course record of 67 for a period of time.
It would be later that another group of golfers built their course in Novato using the same name.
Tully
That's what I figured, the one where I caddied and played a bit was farther north of San Rafael, opposite Hamilton AFB. It's in a pretty setting, with the back nine in the hills.
-
Someone asked about the Presidio course and Chris Buie was kind enough to forward me the following photos . . .
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/presidioVintage.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/presidioground.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/presidioAerial.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/presidio.jpg)
He also forward think link to a 1924 Golf Illustrated article on California Golf . . .
http://www.la84foundation.org/SportsLibrary/GolfIllustrated/1924/gi204p.pdf
Thanks Chris!
-
The Presidio looks amazing without the trees.
-
Wonderful aerial of the Presidio. I can see the apartment building I lived in for about six months during the 1970 Tunney US Senate campaign!
-
Nice find guys. this is great stuff.
-
Is that last Presidio picture the first tee? If it is, the current driving range would be to the right, and the hole would dogleg to the right.
-
One thing that strikes me about that SFGC map (which according to Phillip Young was created by AWT in 1920) is the similarity to the original Willie Lock routing as it appeared in the San Francisco Chronicle in January 1918. There are a few differences in the front nine, but the back nine appears largely the same. In fact, isn't much of the Lock routing is intact today?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SFGC-19180120-SFCh.jpg)
As an aside, I hope we can keep this discussion focused on mid-1920's California golf course architecture and avoid devolving into any discussion of the sexual exploits of the privileged and pompous.
-
"Is that last Presidio picture the first tee? If it is, the current driving range would be to the right, and the hole would dogleg to the right."
Kevin -
My guess is the last Presidio picture is from behind the tee on what is now the par-5 2nd hole. What is now the 1st hole used to play as a dogleg left thru the area that is now the driving range. That is how that hole played as late as when the Western Open was held at the Presidio in 1958.
Dirt that came out of the construction of the tunnel connecting Presidio Blvd. to the GG Bridge was dumped on what are now holes #1 & #3, changing those holes substantially. Dirt that came from the construction of the Geary/Masonic underpass was dumped on the course and was used to change current holes #7 & #9 from two par-4's to a par-3 & a par-5.
DT
-
My guess is the last Presidio picture is from behind the tee on what is now the par-5 2nd hole. What is now the 1st hole used to play as a dogleg left thru the area that is now the driving range. That is how that hole played as late as when the Western Open was held at the Presidio in 1958.
OK, now I can visualize #2. Thanks.
-
Kevin,
I don't know if you recall, but quite some ago we were discussing whether or not the sketch below by AWT in his February 1920 article in Golf Illustrated was meant to be the 16th hole at SFGC. Looking at the plan above and comparing it to the sketch in the article, they seem to be very similar holes, but not exact. In the article AWT did mention that the hole actually being built "differed in minor details" from the sketch in the article.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SFGC-192002-GI-AWT-16th.jpg)
-
Here are a few of the photos from the above referenced San Francisco Water magazine. (As the article is 17 pages long, I don't think I'll try to post it all. It can be found by searching google books for "San Francisco Water" golf 1923.)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SFGC-192304-1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/Olympic-Lakeside-14th-192304.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/Olympic-Lakeside-3rd-192304.jpg)
-
Kevin,
I don't know if you recall, but quite some ago we were discussing whether or not the sketch below by AWT in his February 1920 article in Golf Illustrated was meant to be the 16th hole at SFGC. Looking at the plan above and comparing it to the sketch in the article, they seem to be very similar holes, but not exact. In the article AWT did mention that the hole actually being built "differed in minor details" from the sketch in the article.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/dmoriarty/Golf%20Courses/SFGC-192002-GI-AWT-16th.jpg)
Yes, I remember that discussion. It seemed to me that the differences, at least looking at the hole in 1938, weren't minor. But I don't know what changes were made up to that point.
-
Kevin, I agree with you regarding a comparison of the 1938 aerial to the sketch, but there are more similarities between the 1920 routing and the magazine sketch. Still not a great match, but definitely better than any of the other holes out there. What strikes me is that the 16th hole (marked 7th) on the routing looks to allow for the three options AWT drawn on the sketch and described in the article. In other words, the drawings match better than the arial, which raises the question as to whether the idea was ever actually incorporated into the course. Were all of AWT's suggested changes actually implemented? It could be that the change was made and then the short left option was cut out sometime before 1938. I don't know.
-
"The Presidio looks amazing without the trees."
Andy Stamm -
A copy of that aerial photo of the Presidio, which I believe was taken in 1932, hangs in the public Presidio clubhouse right next to an aerial photo that was taken in 1995. The change from a wide open playing field with no trees whatsoever to the tree-choked course it is today is astonishing.
DT
-
"The Presidio looks amazing without the trees."
Andy Stamm -
A copy of that aerial photo of the Presidio, which I believe was taken in 1932, hangs in the public Presidio clubhouse right next to an aerial photo that was taken in 1995. The change from a wide open playing field with no trees whatsoever to the tree-choked course it is today is astonishing.
DT
Now that you mention it, I think I ran into that photo one day in the shop. I really like the course and while I realize that it won't be denuded, it could really be improved by removing not that many trees. I don't know how you're going to grow good grass on 4 with no sunlight and a par three (13) blinded by a tree in the valley? It's really a shame.
Anyway, I really enjoyed the photos, and thanks for the info.