[Tommy Williamsen]

Well, I had a link to an article but cannot get it to work.
Copied the relevant part if the article from Golf Life Navigators.

"It was determined that the golf course is not the most important part of the decision process. The weather in the area, investment into the club and culture of people all ranked higher! And, those factors should...by all means, this is one of life's biggest buying decisions and the golf course is just ONE factor." (emphasis theirs)

It hasn't been true for me. It has always been the quality of the course. Fortunately, the culture of the club always has been good. I found that the better the course the nicer is the membership. The biggest difference is that the culture of golf clubs is miles better than any country club I have joined.

[Joel_Stewart]

That link doesn't work?

[Scott_Burroughs]

That link doesn't work?

Doesn't for me, either.

[Kalen Braley]

Tommy,


There could be something to this, especially when you consider places like Park City that only have 4 months, maybe 5 of decent golf weather.  I can't imagine all those privates, (7 in total I believe) are drawing people in just on the golf...

[Tommy Williamsen]

I think the article rings true for some of my friends. It doesn't ring true for joining a national golf club. But that is a different animal.

[John Kavanaugh]

I join for the course, I stay or leave because of the people.

[Tommy Williamsen]

I join for the course, I stay or leave because of the people.

Says nice things about Victoria National.

[Ian Mackenzie]

I think the answers would surprise many here.


WE - as in the denizens of GCA - would join a club BECAUSE of the golf course. Duh!
Not so with the majority of prospective new country club members. (Golf club...?...different story.)


There are considerations like: informal dining, work out facility, kids programs, food/service, tennis, pool, etc.
I would guess that 60-70% of club members have no idea who designed their course.

[Rich Goodale]

I belong to three clubs, one of which is world class but cheap, one of which is OK but a drive and a sand wedge from one of my houses and cheap, and the third of which has an OK course but is relatively expensive but has a great staff.  I am blessed.

[Scott_Burroughs]

Proximity, number of nearby clubs to choose from, and cost are big factors for many people. 

[Adrian_Stiff]

The reasons given here are likely to be the anti of what the popular reasons would be.


***Because my friends play there*** Because its near my house ***  Because it is cheapest ***


ALL COME BEFORE the architecture for most. Conditioning, water, competitive spirit, practice facilities, social calendar all top who designed it in the UK. I reckon only 1 in 20 know who designed their course if it was one of the ODG.


A few of our  GCA beloved UK courses are on the edge of disappearing because they just don;t get the volume. One has just 200 members and has its green fee down to £6.50 off peak, it can't be long before its back to sheep.


The GCA way is not the way to a profitable golf operation.

[Thomas Dai]

JK's one-liner is hilarious, and has merit.
Difficult to disagree with Adrian though when it comes to the majority of golfers although there are niches such as GCA fans, who may join for specialist reasons, or snooty folks who may join the most impressive or highest profile private club around their area for snobbish or business reasons.
Worth mentioning that very good players sometimes tend to gravitate to the more higher profile clubs with higher echelon courses and that some higher profile clubs with higher echelon courses encourage the best juniors/players from other local clubs to leave their existing club and join them instead, thus perpetuating the era of better players at some clubs.
And if you have ambitions in the game, especially at higher levels in the amateur game, being a member of a higher profile club with a higher echelon course can make a difference in opportunities and selection for county/regional/etc teams.

atb

[John Emerson]

And if you have ambitions in the game, especially at higher levels in the amateur game, being a member of a higher profile club with a higher echelon course can make a difference in opportunities and selection for county/regional/etc teams.

I don’t agree with this.  Can you more easily find someone to bank roll your professional journey at a higher end club??  Sure.  But if a kid has game it makes zero difference where he/she plays!  Zero!  I Am from louisville,KY and Justin thomas absolutely dominated at every place he played in junior and high school golf.  From dirt track municipals, to the high end private clubs.  It didnt matter where he played.

atb

[David_Tepper]

John E. -
I think Thomas D. is speaking to how things are in Britain rather than in the U.S.
DT

[Ian Andrew]

Joined one 4 years ago ... thought a regular game would be fun ... that was the aspect I liked most.
I wanted to play more and hopefully better. Used the practice facilities quite a bit in the evenings.
Joined because its a well-respected course, great land, 5 minutes from the house.

Didn't work out. It was never a course I enjoyed playing.
9 holes w/ out of bounds, too many trees, etc. ... a grind every time
That eventually became the decision to leave.

[Pete_Pittock]

Reciprocal privileges.   I first travelled overseas in 1975. I belonged to the mens' club at a local muni about 20-60 minutes from home. As the trip progressed I knew this would be a life-long habit. Experiencing  one tourer play Muirfield as we played Gullane
made clear a private membership would be helpful. (it helped the tourer that his letter of introduction was signed by both Hogan and Nelson). When I got home I choice a relatively tight course about 10 minutes from home.

[Duncan Cheslett]

I join for the course, I stay or leave because of the people.

Exactly this.

[Dave McCollum]

The course is rather down the priority list for most golfers.  It's the people as in where their buddies play.  It's an interesting question I've payed attention to for long time.  Particularly interesting for us as we are in deep canyon, a dramatic landscape with two courses on opposite sides of a river.  One a private equity club and ours, a daily fee with a season pass that most call a membership.  Our golfer culture is casual and self identifies with a sort of blue collar ethic.  Although the golf is more affordable on our side of river, in reality, there isn't a dramatic difference in demographics.  What I find especially interesting is club loyalty.  People love their golf clubs because they love their friends and the culture they embrace.  Our club may have blue collar ethic, but our golfers believe this is superior to the more upscale presentation of our neighbor.  The same is true of another canyon club about 10 miles away.  It's one of most loyal memberships I've ever seen.  The members love their golf club.  In my view their course is built on borderline extreme terrain and has one good hole and 17 deeply flawed holes--and that one good hole has a tree more or less in the middle of the green. Makes no difference to the members.  They love their club.  They love their quirky course.           

[John Emerson]

John E. -
I think Thomas D. is speaking to how things are in Britain rather than in the U.S.
DT

I don’t see why it would be any different.  If a kid has game he/she can play anywhere.  The course is irrelevant.  Then again, I have not played in GB. 

[Lou_Duran]

For me, it is the course.  It does not have to be a Top 100, but one which challenges and entertains me most of the time, a course that I don't have to think twice about driving a half an hour to play a casual round even by myself.

I've been a member of several clubs in my life, only one which had a truly poor course.  I had a considerable amount of success there, a good group of guys to play with, and a very supportive pro shop staff.  I lasted three years and a lot of that had to do with my wife's group of tennis friends.

I never had a problem acclimating to a club, or at least finding mates and games.  The best bit of advice on this matter came from Chris Johnston when he was the managing partner at Dismal River.  He invited me to join and after careful consideration, I declined.  To his credit, he did not try to talk me out of it, instead noting that finding the right place where one "belonged" was what mattered.

Ironically, the first club I joined had the best course- OSU Scarlet.  And though I was a poor, self-supporting student, I haven't had a superior "club experience" in terms of friendships, competition, and feeling that I belonged since.

One of my biggest regrets is that I have never been a member of a club with a truly outstanding course (Scarlet would be if it could be properly maintained and had more of a member orientation).  Economics played but a very small part of that.  I just failed to prioritize properly.  As they say, hindsight is 20-20.   

[Duncan Cheslett]

The culture of a club is something that you can only really understand once you are part of it.


I joined my first club purely because of the quality of the course. It was clearly head and shoulders above all the many neighbouring courses on the south side of Manchester where I live. I paid a green fee, played a round by myself, liked what I saw, and joined on the spot. I knew no-one at the club, but then again I didn't know anyone who played golf at all, having just taken up the game myself.


I was given a handicap of 18 (as was any beginner with four functioning limbs) and I embraced my new hobby with gusto. I started participating in roll-ups and met some lovely guys and and some stand-offish guys. One day after a few months I had one of those magic rounds that occur occasionally and scored something like 43 Stableford points. I felt over the moon with myself and anticipated picking up my first ever winnings at competitive sport to the plaudits of my new friends.


"You fu*** cheating c**t!!!" was what welcomed me as I entered the clubhouse bar. Apparently, I was that lowest of the low - a Bandit!


If this had been meant in jest, I could have laughed along. It was quite clear however, that there was real venom behind the insults. I should really have taken heed then.


Over subsequent years, I witnessed the same loutish, laddish behaviour many times from a large element. I tended to steer clear, and seek out the company of of those that I considered more sophisticated and civilised.


Needless to say, the Ladies' section is pretty well non-existent. My wife joined another local club with an extremely dull course but a very sociable clubhouse.


When I later became involved in marketing the club to much-needed new members, I tried to attract young professionals from the very affluent areas only ten minutes drive away. It quickly became clear however, that this was going to be a losing battle. The overriding football-centric macho blue-collar culture within the club was never going to be attractive to my target market, no matter what the quality of the golf course.


My change of clubs this year has clarified many things in my mind.  Most pleasingly, my seventeen year old son has become interested in golf and plays with me at Cavendish regularly. He hated the old place and refused to come with me. It wasn't the course - it was the people.


It is very sad for me. I have some good friends at my former club who are very loyal to the place. I don't know how one goes about changing a club culture, but until something happens, I fear for their future.

[Tom Birkert]

For me it was about the people. My friends were members and I wanted to be able to join them regularly. That it happened to be the club / courses it was was an added bonus as it could not have been any better, but had they been at the Berkshire, St George's Hill, Worplesdon etc the decision would have been the same.


As I get older - and hopefully have the time / money to take on a couple of memberships in addition - there will be different criteria. I'd like a place in the US where I can go to a few times a year. This will require lodging, a absolutely fantastic golf course and reasonably accessible from the UK (so likely East Coast).

[jeffwarne]

John E. -
I think Thomas D. is speaking to how things are in Britain rather than in the U.S.
DT

I don’t see why it would be any different.  If a kid has game he/she can play anywhere.  The course is irrelevant.  Then again, I have not played in GB.

While very true for Justin Thomas, it may not be so true for the borderline junior or amateur.
Certain courses provide better competition access and better preparation.
Of courses it matters less for someone o their way to world #1, but it could be the difference in motivation, exposure and contacts for another.
Certain courses have a culture or producing more good/great players. Who wouldn't want to expose their aspiring junior to that if it was reasonable to do so.

[Adam Lawrence]

John E. -
I think Thomas D. is speaking to how things are in Britain rather than in the U.S.
DT

I don’t see why it would be any different.  If a kid has game he/she can play anywhere.  The course is irrelevant.  Then again, I have not played in GB.

While very true for Justin Thomas, it may not be so true for the borderline junior or amateur.
Certain courses provide better competition access and better preparation.
Of courses it matters less for someone o their way to world #1, but it could be the difference in motivation, exposure and contacts for another.
Certain courses have a culture or producing more good/great players. Who wouldn't want to expose their aspiring junior to that if it was reasonable to do so.

In the British context: it is reasonable to assume that the better the club you are at, the better the coaching you will get and the better your exposure to competition will be. You Americans access these things largely through school and college golf; we do not have such things.

[Peter Flory]

I'm not sure if I would join another club, but the temptation to do so for me is mainly to escape the crowds.  My favorite part of having a club was the ability to just jump out any time, especially with my kids in the late afternoon on the weekends, when they were virtually empty.  Taking guests is probably the next most attractive thing, but that relates back to the openness of the course as well for me.  It is nice taking guests to a place where you can plan it on short notice, you're not rushed when you get there, and where the course is better than what you could otherwise get on the public scene.

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