[Mark Pavy]

It's not only the direction of holes. The design and positioning of bunkers should be considered. Not a good look when courses have to water bunkers to keep the sand from blowing away.

[paul cowley]

...if a bunker needs water to keep the sand from blowing away...I'd fill it in and start the job over...differently.

[Patrick_Mucci]

Paul Cowley, Tom Doak and other architects,
 
What happens when the soil profile prevents you from creating deep fairway bunkers on a very windy site ?
 
Do you then build a fronting berm on an otherwise shallow bunker in an attempt to keep the sand within the bunker ?
 
On greenside bunkers, do you elevate the green to counter the winds ?

[archie_struthers]

 




Doug S, to answer your question about playing into the prevailing wind. I'm all for golf in its purest form but as a designer you need to consider the players that will be your customers at the end of the day . Nothing worse than a staccato of difficult holes one after another . If you know the wind blows hard from the North on a regular basis it just doesn't make sense to build your longest holes directly into the blow.  Hogan loved to practice into the wind , but might not have enjoyed a steady diet of playing into same . So, given you  are building a course for many to enjoy, I'll stand by my "obvious" statements validity.



 I don't think "dumbing down" is the deal but there are ways other than sheer length to make holes challenging to play.


False fronts , bunkering , angles , excellent green design are "certainly" preferable to sheer length for the vast majority of players. A great course for me challenges all levels of golfers in different ways.

[Thomas Dai]

Maybe a different perspective when it comes to "Out" and "In" links courses.

Although I haven't counted them up, it's always seemed to me that "Out" and "In" courses generally seem to go "Out" with the prevailing wind and come back "In"-to it. As I say, I haven't done the maths on this, it's just gut feel......someone else is very welcome to do the maths though!


Maybe it's got to do with yee olde routings being as if you're going for an evening stroll along the beach when perhaps you'd be more likely to walk with the wind at the start and then turn back into it?


atb



 ""

[Sean_A]

Yes


I agree with Doak, using cross winds in the design can cause havoc.  Courses need to have added width to accomodate the wind pattern and this unfortunately is rarely the case.  Look at course such as Birkdale, Portrush, Burnham, Western Gailes(!) and Littlestone.  All rely heavily on cross winds (at least Birkdale is cocooned in dunes!) and none can be called wide...so on a summer day with wind at 15ish or higher life becomes a bit harsh.  If space allows its better to predominately go into and down wind with some crossing wind holes chucked in to keep golfers honest. 


I just played Western Gailes and I have never seen a more demanding test of driving due to cross winds....every hole but one was wind off the right or left...and most fairways are angled! 


Ciao

[paul cowley]

Paul Cowley, Tom Doak and other architects,
 
What happens when the soil profile prevents you from creating deep fairway bunkers on a very windy site ?
 
Do you then build a fronting berm on an otherwise shallow bunker in an attempt to keep the sand within the bunker ?
 
On greenside bunkers, do you elevate the green to counter the winds ?

Pat - generally if you are building into the wind you try to cove or drop your bunker below an existing or created elevation to avoid a blowout condition (if you don't want one) and then sand face can be as high as you want. When you are designing downwind you generally try to keep some kind of vegetative or artificial face to avoid a blowout condition..or keep your bunkers aerodynamically low. Cross or diagonal winds combine elements of both methods depending on the site and what the designer is trying to achieve.


Don't fight it if you don't want it...use the winds effect to your benefit. It's a great design tool that can help you figure out the design and the look...even before you start.

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