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Richard Hetzel

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2015, 06:29:32 PM »
I have played most of those courses. Why not Waisato Winds and Stronecrest on that list? I have not played either yet. Eagle Ridge may have been hillier than Shawnee Lookout as well.
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Criss Titschinger

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2015, 10:20:12 PM »
My guess is Wasioto Winds just didn't have enough representation for nomination. There were holes nominated, but they didn't get enough votes. I, too, was surprised to see Stonecrest not as well represented for as many good things as I've heard about it. I'm hoping to hit up at least one of those two this year.

Shawnee may have more elevation as far as tee to green on each hole, but 4, 13, and 18 have way more elevation than any hole at Shawnee has.

Still can't believe Dale Hollow's 15th didn't win that hole. One of the best par 3s I've ever played. Would dare say in my personal top 5.

Matt Waidmann

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #27 on: March 25, 2015, 11:20:15 AM »
I completely forgot I played Houston Oaks in the fall this past year in an outing.  I enjoyed the layout for the most part.  Pretty typical modern course, some nice elevation change on a few holes, some gimmicky holes, but par-3's make the golf course.  The hole pictured was playing as a drive-able par-4, and made it a great risk-reward hole with the creek crossing.

Jason Thurman

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #28 on: March 25, 2015, 12:22:25 PM »
John, the best horizon-expanding public course in Kentucky is Bogie (sic) Busters at Coal Ridge, located in Georgetown. It's largely pasture golf but with several of the most creative holes in the world. I haven't been there in ten years, but I've been trying to talk Nigel into making a trip.


Richard, I think Criss hit the nail on the head regarding Wasioto and Stonecrest. When we opened up voting, there just weren't enough people who had played those courses to give their holes the votes they needed to win a spot. Most of the holes on the list are located close to population centers where plenty of people have played the courses in question on multiple occasions.


Matt, I generally think the 14th at Houston Oaks is one of the better par 4s in Kentucky from its back tee. It's about 450 or so from back there if I remember correctly, and with the diagonal creek and the hillside tight left it makes for a pretty interesting and very scenic half-par hole where laying up is a real option for a lot of players. I've never played it from a reachable tee but I can definitely see that being an interesting setup on that hole.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Adam Warren

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #29 on: March 25, 2015, 03:21:45 PM »
Jason,

I worked in Georgetown and I never played Coal Ridge.  You may be the one and only person I have ever heard use such terms in reference to that golf course.  Are you being serious?

Wasioto and Stonecrest are in two pretty "remote" areas by the basis of Louisville and Lexington.  Neither is within 1.5-2 hours of Lexington depending on how fast you drive.  Louisville is further for both.  Wasioto is a little over an hour from Knoxville, so not as "remote" as many would lead one to believe.  Stonecrest isn't terribly far from Huntington.  I actually have never been to Stonecrest.  Something I hope to fix in the next year or two.

I am from the area where Wasioto is, and worked in the golf shop there the first few summers it was open.  They have 5 very solid par 3's with plenty of strategy needed at the green areas.  The 4's and 5's are some ups and downs on the scale.  The more amazing thing is how the course was developed from the marshy/wetland/"Lake Mistake" that was once there.  It was an amazing use of some "useless" land area if you could have seen it before.  I love the course and play there at least once every year.  I wish more could get out and enjoy it.  It is such an easy drive it is a shame more have not been there.

Jason Thurman

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #30 on: March 25, 2015, 04:16:46 PM »
Adam, Coal Ridge is absolutely worth seeing in a "Human Centipede" or Shawnee Lookout sort of way. The clubhouse is genuinely lovely. It's half Norman Rockwell and half Norman Bates. The course itself is the weirdest one I've ever played. The 3rd hole is one-of-a-kind. It's a mid-length par 4 that doglegs hard around a tree-lined stream to a perfectly round green that's about 15 feet in diameter (based on Google Earth measurements, it's right around 1500 sq ft) and elevated five feet above its surroundings. The approach wouldn't be any harder if they replaced the green with my dining room table. There's also a short par 4 on the back nine that answers the question of what it would be like to play a hole with a green located at the top of a volcano. It's the most bizarre golf course I've played - just a parade of short holes that are routed as uninuitively as possible. Imagine a charming version of Duckers Lake in marginal condition with Jessica Lange's character from season 1 of American Horror Story running the place and you're on the right track.

Let me know when you decide to do Stonecrest. I haven't seen that one either, though I'd like to. I also haven't been to Wasioto but I've gotten intrigued listening to you describe it. A Wasioto/Middlesboro CC (open since 1889, the oldest continually operated course in the US) trip is one that I need to finally pull together.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Nigel Islam

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #31 on: March 25, 2015, 05:22:55 PM »
Adam,
    I think you underestimate the sheer quantity of bad holes Thurman and I have seen between his Louisville-Lexington-Cincy triangle and my Indy-Evansville-Louisville one. When you are playing a course full of geese droppings you look for any silver lining you can. I get a kick out of seeing new courses, but I think Jason actually relishes the world's truly awful architecture. I do actually think the Kentucky State park system is very good especially when you consider how affordable it is. I think the other cool thing is the courses fit the personality of their locations very well. Indiana does not have anything like it.

Adam Warren

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #32 on: March 26, 2015, 08:05:13 AM »
I can agree, there is something to be said for truly awful golf holes and being able to reflect and talk about the experiences on those holes.

As for Coal Ridge, their owner/operator used to come play Cherry Blossom quite often when I was there and talk about how great his little course was.  I'm not sure what the angle was, but I know he didnt talk any of us into ever coming over there or offer up a free round for anyone.  Always interesting to see little single owner golf courses like that or Cedar-Fil in Bardstown stay open.  I guess they do so little to the course, which makes for such low overhead that it works.

Jason, I will be going to Wasioto for sure on Memorial Day weekend.  Their invitational is that weekend, so I will be playing in both days of that event and probably a practice round on Friday.  Usually $125 for 3 rounds (pay for cart on Friday- or walk) and you can win some Callaway stuff.  It's a good little tournament that will get 75-100 guys (flighted). Takes place during the "Kentucky Mountain Laurel Festival" which is fine if you or the significant other like festivals.  The town is pretty proud of the festival.

The word on conditions at Middlesboro CC changes almost daily, so its a crapshoot on what you will get.  Decent little nine holer nonetheless with the draw of the "oldest continuously operated..." to tag on your list.  I'm certainly willing to make the trip on a free weekend for each of these, plus maybe a run at Woodlake in Tazewell, TN.

Donovan Childers

Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #33 on: March 26, 2015, 01:22:32 PM »
How many people  actually placed votes 11 or 12? I guess this was something to sort of keep the site going, but really it's dead. There are really just 7 or 8 guys who post there anymore. I would say that some holes didn't win, just because nobody had played those courses, or it was so long that they just couldn't remember the hole well.  I believe that Adam and myself might have been the only two who have played Wasioto Winds, and I haven't played it for at least 2 years.

Persimmon Ridge was also included but none of those holes won either due to only a few people who have played it. The whole thing was ok to kill some time during the winter, but I give it more credit if there were actually a decent sample size of voters.

Adam Warren

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #34 on: March 27, 2015, 10:31:36 AM »
Well Persimmon should have been fresh in a lot of guys minds b/c there was an outing there this past summer that a lot of guys played in.  I just don't think outside of the greens, there is much to talk about with the routing at Persimmon.

You are correct though, I'm not sure who else has played Wasioto on the board in even the last five years.  There are a couple guys that have been there, but it has been YEARS.  The same can be said for me with popular courses on the board such as Dale Hollow, Eagle Ridge, Hidden Cove, etc. The latest I played any of those courses (among many others) has been 2008/2009. 

Jason Thurman

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #35 on: March 27, 2015, 11:15:28 AM »
I'm with Adam on Persimmon Ridge. I don't understand the hype surrounding that course at all. There are a handful of good holes - 5, 7, 8, and 13 are probably the most interesting - but I don't think any of them should have won over the holes that did.

Donovan, you're obviously a strong player with a preference for difficult holes and courses. I have a soft spot for tough tests as well - I joined Wolf Run after all. Persimmon was intended to be a very difficult course, and it pulls that off well. I just don't see many holes that are especially great or memorable out there. The routing is decent aside from some long transitions due to the housing and whatever the hell they were trying to do at hole 3. But there's a general lack of strategy and interest in the holes and a ton of turf-hampering vegetation surrounding almost all the corridors. On top of that, the shaping tee-to-green is sloppy and the shaping of the greens themselves is possibly the worst I've ever seen. Those may just be golf dorkitecture complaints, but the average player definitely notices when conditions are affected by vegetation even if he doesn't understand the cause, and shaping is one of the biggest difference makers in how a course is perceived by most players. It's what makes lauded courses look like they're in a different class from the rest. The uninspired bunkering and circus greens really hold Persimmon back for me, and obviously for others as well. As Adam mentioned, we had about a dozen guys out there in August.

The tough thing in any exercise like this is getting representation for courses that haven't had much play. Even if we'd had a few thousand voters, there still would have been a major bias toward the courses located in population centers that lots of people have seen and play regularly. It was obviously possible for a course like Devou Park that only one or two guys had played to win a hole, but it took plenty of photos, a glowing review, and weak competition to do it.
"There will always be haters. That’s just the way it is. Hating dudes marry hating women and have hating ass kids." - Evan Turner

Some of y'all have never been called out in bold green font and it really shows.

Chris Mavros

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #36 on: March 28, 2015, 10:23:17 AM »
I played Heritage Hill back in September and really enjoyed the course.  It was my first time (I think) playing on blue grass and liked how the ball sat up a bit on the blades.  There were some fun holes and at a tremendous value. 

Nigel Islam

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #37 on: March 28, 2015, 08:45:19 PM »
I played Heritage Hill back in September and really enjoyed the course.  It was my first time (I think) playing on blue grass and liked how the ball sat up a bit on the blades.  There were some fun holes and at a tremendous value. 

I agree Chris it was a pleasant suprise. Certainly the antithesis of a GCA darling but I really liked 6, 7, 11 (when I found it!), 14, and 17. I think it might be the best public in Louisville.

Chris Pearson

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2015, 01:55:12 PM »
Excellent list! I would have preferred to see #2 at Nevel Meade over the par 3 at Heritage Hill, but either way, I've got a lot of must-plays the next time I'm back home during the warm-weather season.

Adam Warren

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Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #39 on: March 30, 2015, 07:39:55 AM »
I played Heritage Hill back in September and really enjoyed the course.  It was my first time (I think) playing on blue grass and liked how the ball sat up a bit on the blades.  There were some fun holes and at a tremendous value. 

Are you talking about the rough?  I am fairly certain HH has Zoysia in the fairways, which would certainly explain the ball sitting up.

Donovan Childers

Re: Kentucky Public Golf Eclectic 18
« Reply #40 on: March 30, 2015, 12:16:02 PM »
Heritage does have Zoysia Fairways

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