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Sean_A

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #25 on: March 22, 2015, 05:30:32 AM »
I find myself, if not necessarily always agreeing with Mr T, at least sympathising with the philosophy of change at Turnberry.
While it's a wonderful, glorious, history-filled place to play golf, there are undoubtedly a number of holes which are at best, ho hum.
The Hotel is incredible, if a little 'tired'. I'll bet he'll sort that out easily. The course is 80% there. Just my opinion of course.
I'm also really interested/excited to see what might be made of the Kintyre. There's an opportunity I would have loved!
Just no waterfalls, please...
F.



I don't think the design really compliments the property very well...Turnberry is almost good by default.  I welcome tinkering...lets just hope Trump and Co learned a few things at Aberdeen...or this could be Aberdeen style design Vol II.

Ciao

Exactly my thoughts - Turnberry is very good, but there is plenty of room for improvement.
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David Davis

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2015, 03:40:58 PM »
Just returned from Turnberry yesterday. I doubt there is any chance that little pitch and putt was designed by Hawtree. In fact, I'd bet anything it wasn't since Martin Ebert has been doing their renovations for years.

They were working on it and the bunkers when we were there. I wanted to see the routing before it goes under the knife. It was a very very windy day and the holes on the way out were really tough. Especially the 240 yd par 3. With the wind it might be one of the toughest par 3's I've ever played.

I feel like the routing is quite strong and the course has an excellent set of green complexes not to mention visual wow impact of the lighthouse and see. That's a strong draw for golf tourism. I will be really curious to see what's done to change and improve the course as well.

It's a shame that the course/clubhouse etc lacks the atmosphere of the wonderful neighboring courses in Prestwick and Troon.
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Niall C

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #27 on: March 25, 2015, 01:51:46 PM »
David

Re the pitch and putt - what makes you think it's not Hawtree's work ?

Martin Ebert has indeed been working at Turnberry pre Trump and has been retained to work on the main course but I've heard on good authority that Hawtree designed the P&P with Sol as contractor, as per Aberdeen.

Niall

David Davis

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #28 on: March 26, 2015, 05:01:37 AM »
David

Re the pitch and putt - what makes you think it's not Hawtree's work ?

Martin Ebert has indeed been working at Turnberry pre Trump and has been retained to work on the main course but I've heard on good authority that Hawtree designed the P&P with Sol as contractor, as per Aberdeen.

Niall

Niall,

I'll look into it and report back. It would seem strange to me but it's certainly possible.

David
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David Davis

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #29 on: March 26, 2015, 10:58:49 AM »
Niall,

As promised I looked into this today and can assure you that Hawtree had nothing to do with this design. It too was done by Ebert & Mackenzie.

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Brian_Ewen

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #30 on: March 27, 2015, 03:33:25 AM »

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #31 on: March 27, 2015, 05:27:25 AM »
Well, I have to say that this looks like a very positive addition.

1 - 0 to Mr.Trump

David Davis

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #32 on: March 27, 2015, 05:38:31 AM »
Well, I have to say that this looks like a very positive addition.

1 - 0 to Mr.Trump

+1

Last week Friday they were just adding the finishing touches and we didn't get to take the first divots. Darn...it looked like a lot of fun. I have a very strong hunch the rest of the changes are going to be awesome ;-)
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Brian_Ewen

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #33 on: March 27, 2015, 11:06:27 AM »
The latest addition at Turnberry.


Jon Wiggett

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #34 on: March 27, 2015, 02:42:30 PM »
The latest addition at Turnberry.



Is that the Donald himself featured in the fountain? ;D

But being serious, I believe he will improve the course with the changes and even though I find it a shame to lose 9, 10 & 11 in their present form I cannot condemn the changes if it does improve the course.

Jon

Brian_Ewen

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #35 on: March 28, 2015, 05:57:52 AM »
It needs "re-grassing" ?


TRUMP TURNBERRY MULTI-MILLION TRANSFORMATION ON COURSE

NEWS RELEASE


Details behind the multi-million pound plans to renovate Trump Turnberry have been revealed for the first time as the project to  upgrade substantially the world’s first ever golf resort takes shape .

An extensive 18 month refurbishment programme is now underway and the resort will re-launch on June 1, 2016 when the redesigned Open Championship golf course, The Ailsa, will be available for play for the first time.

In May, Trump Turnberry hotel will re-open its doors following an extensive upgrade to world leading standards, which includes the lavish refurbishment of all hotel bedrooms.

The detailed and sensitive project requires a partial closure commencing September 27, 2015 until mid to late May 2016 when improvements to the hotel and Ailsa course are carried out.

During this time, the new clubhouse, The Villas and golf academy will be open for business with tee times available to members and guests on the Kintyre, a challenging course which hosted the qualifying rounds for the Open Championship at Royal Troon in 2004.

Detailing the changes, Donald J. Trump, Chairman and President of The Trump Organization, commented;

“In close consultation, we will be refining the great Ailsa Championship course including lengthening, re-grassing and making certain changes, many of which have been sought by the R and A for over 25 years.

"This work will be carefully and studiously crafted and when completed, will bring this already amazing masterpiece to a level that even it has never attained.

“At the conclusion of our hotel rebuilding, we will have exquisite new suites, magnificent ballrooms, restaurants and meeting facilities plus a sprawling and luxurious spa. When completed, Trump Turnberry will be the finest resort of its kind anywhere in the world.”

Improvements Included in the exciting plans being revealed for the first time are the following improvements:

The upgrading of conference and banqueting facilities with the creation of The Caledonia Ballroom, The Old Tom Morris Suite and The Ailsa Craig Suite, as well as three new meeting rooms and a luxurious business centre.

The creation of a new world class 18 hole pitch and putt in front of the hotel, designed by the internationally renowned golf architect Martin Ebert.

The creation of a new Lobby bar featuring over 250 whiskies within the Grand Tea Lounge.

The launch of the refurbished clubhouse, proshop with largely extended retail facility, The Duel in the Sun restaurant and a purpose built east facing viewing balcony in April 2015.

The creation of a luxurious two bedroomed suite and the Halfway House for the Ailsa course will be located within the iconic Turnberry Lighthouse.

The repositioning of 1906 restaurant to its original location from when the hotel opened.

The creation of a new Crystal Ballroom named in recognition of the six original crystal chandeliers which are a historic feature of the room.

Development of the new destination spa, The Trump Spa by Ivanka Trump.

The creation of a masterpiece, The Donald J Trump Ballroom, situated at the north elevation of the hotel facilitating 500 guests with panoramic sea views.

Extensive renovation of the self-catering Villas at Trump Turnberry and the creation of a new family centre will take place with work commencing in the winter of 2016 completing spring 2017.

Meanwhile, works to complete the £5m refurbishment of the clubhouse continue as a priority in preparation for hosting the RICOH Women’s British Open which takes place at Trump Turnberry 30 July – 2 August 2015.  The new clubhouse will open its doors in late April 2015, also in time for the summer golf season.

jeffwarne

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #36 on: March 28, 2015, 07:59:51 AM »
Wasn't really my cup of tea before, now I'm sure it's not-  I guess many will like it (I'll probably enjoy watching the Open there still-maybe more)- Big world out there- It's just not the reason I go to GB&I-but that's just me.
I would be curious on all the math of how the expense is justified on a profitability basis.(Maybe it's all part of the continued "brand building" ::) ::) ::)

Sounds like a wonderful reason to plan a trip to Askernish (hopefully there are no plans for a "luxurious and sprawling" spa there)
« Last Edit: March 28, 2015, 08:24:35 AM by jeffwarne »
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Jon Wiggett

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #37 on: March 28, 2015, 12:22:10 PM »
Jeff,

to be fair, given the choice of a weeks golf at either of them I would go for Askernish too.

Jud_T

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2015, 06:31:33 PM »
Jeff,

to be fair, given the choice of a weeks golf at either of them I would go for Askernish too.

Not to mention that you'd have 1100 quid and a membership for the rest of the year left over....
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Jonathan Mallard

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2015, 07:36:13 PM »


Detailing the changes, Donald J. Trump, Chairman and President of The Trump Organization, commented;

“In close consultation, we will be refining the great Ailsa Championship course including lengthening, re-grassing and making certain changes, many of which have been sought by the R and A for over 25 years.



Using a little trick called math, I take 2015, subtract 25, and get 1990.

So, then, why play here in 1994 and 2009 if said changes weren't accomplished?

They've certainly avoided Portrush and others for a while.

Michael Graham

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #40 on: April 21, 2015, 09:10:43 AM »
A short(ish) video detailing the proposed changes to the course. I hope Andrew Cotter received a healthy cheque for his voice over.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPRQjC5pY2g

Eric Smith

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #41 on: April 21, 2015, 09:32:53 AM »
A short(ish) video detailing the proposed changes to the course. I hope Andrew Cotter received a healthy cheque for his voice over.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPRQjC5pY2g

Fantastic!

Ally Mcintosh

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #42 on: April 21, 2015, 09:43:46 AM »
Nice flythrough..... Just watched it with the volume down...

I counted at a minimum eight new green sites (1,4,5,6,9,10,11,14). Exciting times.

Brad Tufts

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #43 on: April 21, 2015, 11:58:01 AM »
Its interesting for sure.

The current course is not original so there isn't a huge argument for preservation of much other than the "tradition" of Turnberry golf.

I think the changes are brilliant, and will make for a thrilling course, and more unique as a Open Champ host.

We have been over this many times on GCA, and part of me doesn't like Trump coming in and imposing his (through M/E) will and making all these changes...but I have to get over it and admit he has a pretty decent golf track record that is honestly ever-improving.

The next W Coast Scotland visit will most certainly have to include Turnberry!
So I jump ship in Hong Kong....

James Boon

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2015, 02:21:08 PM »
Evening chaps,

The M&E brochure for the proposals can be viewed on their website...

http://www.mackenzieandebert.co.uk/Downloads/Proposals%20for%20the%20Ailsa%20Course%20at%20Trump%20Turnberry%20Booklet%202015%20LR.pdf

Cheers,

James
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Benjamin Litman

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #45 on: April 21, 2015, 02:23:42 PM »
What is the timeline for implementation of these proposals?

I note that Turnberry is hosting the Women's British Open this summer.
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Adam Lawrence

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #46 on: April 21, 2015, 02:59:28 PM »
Starting after the Women's Open this summere. Completion, not sure.
Adam Lawrence

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Alan Ritchie

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #47 on: April 21, 2015, 07:02:44 PM »
very impressive looking changes indeed, will be interesting to see how it goes. I was thoroughly impressed on my visits there in the past and would expect to be even more so on the new course. the only surprising thing I think is no changes to 2 and 3 which I felt were some of the weaker holes on the course.

Jon Wiggett

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #48 on: April 22, 2015, 02:21:08 AM »
I will be interested to see how these changes work out. I believe it will be an improvement to the course with the possible exception of the alterations to facilitate the new tee on 18. I do wonder however if they have thought enough about sea spray issues that maybe caused by moving some of the greens that close to the water.

Jon

Matthew Rose

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Re: Trump's plans for Turnberry
« Reply #49 on: April 22, 2015, 03:06:59 AM »
After having a good look at it, I think I like the changes to the ocean holes. Maybe the idea of a par-three ocean shot isn't entirely original, but it is one you really don't see on the rota, which given the proximity to the sea of most of these courses might seem a little odd.

However, some of the changes to the rest of the course seem a little unnecessary and perhaps "change for the sake of change". Does #18 really need to be straightened? Even if that makes it a slightly better hole in someone's mind, is it worth messing with everything around it just to make that happen? I don't know for sure; I'm not intimately familiar with those holes.

One of the things the early versions had of the course that I found interesting was the presence of a par three played over the Wee Burn, which was later lost.
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