[Tom Buggy]

With respect to Jim Kennedy's reference to the "Poughkeepsie club" above, the name of the club was Whitehouse Knolls.  The  course was developed by E.N. Howell, was designed by Willie Dunn, and was part of an ambitious housing development.  The course opened in June, 1897 (just six weeks after Dunn began laying out the course).  It was in existence until 1901 when the development failed and the property was foreclosed upon.  (This information is from Poughkeepsie Daily Eagle newspaper articles.)

[Sven Nilsen]

Bumping this back to the first page to bring attention to Tom Buggy's last post on page 3, which has been updated.

Sven

[BCrosby]

Sven -

Great stuff. If confirmed, we'll need to rewrite a big chunk of the history of early American golf.

I continue to be amazed at how much we still have to learn.

Bob

[Sven Nilsen]

Sven -

Great stuff. If confirmed, we'll need to rewrite a big chunk of the history of early American golf.

I continue to be amazed at how much we still have to learn.

Bob

Bob:

All accolades on this one should go to Tom Buggy, who has been pursuing the history of The Edgewood Club.

Sven

[Chris Cupit]

FWIW here is a link to Savannah Golf Club's home page.  http://www.thesavannahgolfclub.com/History.aspx

"On record the Savannah Golf Club is the oldest golf club in America and is believed to be the first American city where golf was played.  Our proud heritage dates back to our beginnings in 1794."

[Sven Nilsen]

Tom Buggy added an update to his last post on the Edgewood Club of Tivoli.  I've copied the update below:

Research Update - 11/21/14: I now have a copy of the material from the club's safety deposit box.  It consists of handwritten notes by a club Governor and Green Committee member who was a nephew of one of the Livingston family founders who was alive at the time the notes were prepared.  The notes document the club's property through 1925, the year of the club's incorporation.  A summary at the end of the notes documents that there were two golf holes in the club's 1884 founding year, and that the course consisted of seven holes in 1909 when member-owned land was provided for use by the club.  (It is possible that a few holes were added between 1884 and 1909.)  It is known from other sources that the course was expanded to nine holes in 1916; it has remained in use as a 9-hole course ever since.  I believe these notes provide credible evidence that The Edgewood Club of Tivoli is the oldest U.S. course with continuous golf at the same location.  I intend to provide this information to the USGA.  The response will be interesting.

[Tim_Cronin]

That's quite the find. Makes for 131 years of golf, however limited at first, in the same spot, presuming no gaps in availability.

[John Burnes]

Interesting note on Savanaah Golf Club.  I'd like to know the name of the historian who claims it to be the oldest in the country and see the full materials  that support that claim.

[Tom Buggy]

With respect to the Savannah Golf Club, the club website says the the club and the course as we know it today was incorporated in 1898, apparently at a different location than the original.  Thus, it is not the oldest club with continuous golf at the same location.

[Tom Buggy]

The board of directors of The Edgewood Club of Tivoli have authorized me to pursue notification of the club's status as the oldest existing U.S. club with continuous golf at the same location.  I have sent related material to the USGA and am awaiting a response.  I have also prepared an article about the club which is reproduced below.  It is currently written from a local perspective but I believe it provides information about the club that will be of interest.

Is the Oldest Golf Club in the U.S. in Dutchess County?

Dutchess County is home to some historic golf courses and clubs.  The Dutcher Golf Course in Pawling (1890) is the oldest municipal course in the U.S.  The Dinsmore Golf Course in Staatsburg was originally the private Staatsburg Golf Club, which was formed in 1893; the golf course opened in 1894 and is among the oldest courses in the country.  But, is it possible that the oldest golf club in America is also here?

Well, that depends on the criteria used to define “oldest” and there’s much debate about those criteria.  For example, some clubs were founded earlier than any club in Dutchess County but did not have golf until several years later – do they qualify?  Other clubs, including two in South Carolina which were founded in the late 1700’s, are now at different locations and one of them has a different name – do they qualify?  Still other early clubs, including the Oakhurst Links in West Virginia which some claim is the oldest, have not had golf continuously – do they qualify?  Finally, if a club no longer exists, does it qualify?

If the answer to all of these questions is “No” then the oldest existing golf club in the U.S. with continuous golf at its original location is, in fact, in Dutchess County.  It is The Edgewood Club of Tivoli.

The Edgewood Club was founded in 1884, primarily for the purposes of tennis and social activity.  The founders were wealthy and aristocratic river families, notably the Livingston’s, Hall’s and Hunt’s.  A rudimentary golf course was started in 1884 with two holes.  With incremental additions there were seven holes by 1909.    In 1916 when two members gave use of adjoining land to the club, the course was expanded to nine holes.  The course and the original tiny clubhouse have remained in continuous use to the present day.

The Edgewood golf course reflects the rudimentary construction of early courses.  It is a mere 3010 yards in length with a Par of 34.  Little has changed over the years, except for a relocation of the ninth green because the original green was dangerously close to the clubhouse, the reconfiguration and lengthening of some holes, and the addition of some back tees.

The Edgewood Club is private, very private.  It is nestled in dense woods just south of the Livingston’s Clermont estate, with no sign at its dirt road entrance.  In addition to the golf course and clubhouse, four of the five original tennis courts remain at their original locations below the clubhouse porch, albeit with new surfaces and the addition of fencing.  So too remain remnants of the original entrance road from which carriage horses entered the club grounds, as well as porch furniture from 1884 and many of the club’s traditions – notably the Saturday Afternoon Teas that began 130 years ago.  A visit to The Edgewood Club of Tivoli is a visit to a bygone era, and to a club that can claim to be the oldest continuously existing golf club in America.

You might ask why the club has gone unnoticed in the discussion of the oldest U.S. golf clubs.  The reason is the club’s private nature.  It began as a family club with a membership that consisted exclusively of Livingston family members and their friends, a membership that had neither need nor desire for notoriety.  From its aristocratic beginnings, the club’s membership has evolved into a broad base of local and summer residents.  However, the atmosphere and decorum of the club remain much as they were 130 years ago.

Some Interesting Sidelights

• The club’s founding meeting was held at the Oakhurst home of Mrs. Valentine Hall in
   Tivoli.  She was a grandmother of Eleanor Roosevelt.

• Colonel Johnston L. de Peyster was a major factor in the club’s early development.  He
   acquired the club’s original property, built the first tennis court with cement, was one
   of the builders of the clubhouse, and served as the club’s second president.  During the
   Civil War as Lieutenant de Peyster he raised the Union flag at the capitol building at
   the battle of Richmond.  Later he was the mayor of Tivoli for several years.

• The club’s first president, General H.L. Burnette, was the judge advocate who compiled
   the evidence against the conspirators after President Lincoln’s assassination.

• In its early years the club had tennis players of national prominence.  Valentine Hall won the
   U.S. Open Doubles Championship in 1888 and 1890.  He was runner-up three other times, one
   of them with his brother Edward.  Valentine also published the 1889 book Lawn Tennis in
   America.

• The present-day club has no employees.  Maintenance of the tennis courts and golf course is
   outsourced.  All social events are arranged and managed by club members.

• Curiously, the St. Andrew’s Golf Club in Hastings-on-Hudson NY has been widely acclaimed
   as the oldest U.S. golf club.  This club was formed by the romantic “Apple Tree Gang” in 1888
   with a 3-hole course in a Yonkers NY pasture.  However, in addition to The Edgewood Club of
   Tivoli, three other existing clubs had golf courses which predate St. Andrew’s: Dorset Field
   Club in Vermont (1886), Foxburg Country Club in Pennsylvania (1887) and Quoque Field
   Club in New York (1887).

Tom Buggy, December 2014

[Sven Nilsen]

Add another early Southern course to the list.  This one, which I am dubbing "Cloverdale Golf Course," dates back to 1894 (article from the April 1909 edition of Golf Magazine).

[V. Kmetz]

Hi,

Just to take an accurate historical tack in something I'm writing, I wonder if there are answers to these questions

1. Is St. Andrews (yonkers) still due its title as the first organized golf club (for which golf was the organizing activity)?
2. Where is the earliest record of golf being played in america?
3. Based on what this thread has been establishing and discussing... where is St. andrews ranked chronologically...third, fourth, ?

cheers

vk

[Tom Buggy]

To reply to your first question, you introduce an interesting criterion with respect to the oldest club - that is, "organized for golf."  My research suggests that the oldest presently existing club which has remained in continuous operation and meets that criterion is the Dorset Field Club in Vermont, which was established for and with golf in 1886 (two years before St. Andrew's).  As described in another post in this thread, The Edgewood Club of Tivoli in New York was founded in 1884 with two golf holes.  However, this club was founded primarily for tennis and social activity.  Golf was secondary; thus, this club does not meet your criterion.

[Tom Buggy]

I have finally received a response of some substance from the USGA (2+ months after sending the safety deposit box material which documents that the club had two golf holes in its 1884 founding year).  The response is disappointing, at least with respect to the timing of a USGA decision on accepting the club's claim that it is the oldest continually existing golf club in the U.S.

The response says that the submitted research material will be added to the "drop files" of the USGA Library and will be available to researchers.  However, it also says "I would like to have the opportunity to thoroughly vet everything, but unfortunately with the opening of the Nicklaus Room and the championship season upon us, that likely won't be until the fall."  I have reponded that the historical significance of the matter warrants more timely attention, and asked that the timing be reconsidered.  I am not hopeful for an improvement in the timing.

[MCirba]

I recently came across this wonderful thread which I had missed during my GCA LOA.   

The information regarding early courses, particularly some of the details around Franklin Park, Myopia, and Edgewood at Tivoli certainly seem to be different than commonly held understandings.

Thanks to everyone who has participated and if this train gets moving again I'd like to climb aboard and help however I can.

[Tom Buggy]

With respect to The Edgewood Club of Tivoli about which I have posted previously, I no longer believe that the safety deposit box notes ("Tennis & 2 holes" associated with 1884) establish that golf was present in 1884.  It is much more likely that this reference, and a reference to "Upper 7 holes" associated with 1909, define the land parcels on which nine holes were located at the time the notes were written.  This conclusion is reinforced by the content of a 1937 club history book which states that the golf course was originally a five-hole course that was later condensed to three holes.  Unfortunately, the author does not say when the five holes were put into play.  (The course was later expanded to nine holes at which it remains today.)

Therefore, we do not yet know when golf started at The Edgewood Club of Tivoli.  If the year was 1884 or 1885 the club would be the oldest continually operated club in the U.S.  Research has been affected by the absence of club records between early 1885 and 1897, and the absence of newspaper records because of the very private nature of the club at the time of its founding.  We do know that golf was present at least by 1898; a club minutes book for that year has the title Edgewood Golf Club." 

It is likely that golf started before 1898.  Research is continuing with a focus on finding information in family papers of the Livingston family, members of which founded the club.

[Tom Buggy]

Unfortunately, there is no new news about The Edgewood Club of Tivoli.  Research has continued, including a review of a diary by a founding member, but when golf started remains a mystery.  Research of Livingston family papers will be done in January, 2016.

However, there is new news which establishes another course as the oldest continually operating golf course in the U.S.  It is the Dutcher Golf Course in Pawling NY.  The start date of this course was previously established as 1890, which is the year it became a 9-hole course.  However, the new information is that it was originally built as a 3-hole course in 1885 (one year earlier than the Dorset Field Club in Vermont).

This course was built by John Dutcher who operated a large hotel in Pawling at the time.  He built it for use by his friends and hotel guests, many of whom were from New York City who arrived at a railroad station the building of which he influenced.  The course was later donated to the town of Pawling with the stipulation that it remain a golf course forever.  It is considered the oldest municipal course in the U.S.

On another subject, I recently published a brief history of the Dinsmore Golf Course in Staatsburg NY, which was originally the Staatsburgh Golf Club, established in 1893.  If you wish to obtain a PDF file of the document, send a request via email to tbuggy@aol.com.

[MCirba]

In doing some research on Foxburg (more to come regarding its origins in coming weeks) I came across the following on the Dorset Field Club's website.   

I'm wondering if any of our intrepid researchers have ever been there to view the map and seeming affidavit in question referenced below?   I've been unable to find any newspaper reporting about golf at Dorset prior to formation of the "Field Club" in 1896, which seems odd if they'd been playing there for a decade at that time.   

In any case, here's their claim on the "earliest continual use" mantle;

Many of the early summer people were from New York City, New Jersey, and a large group from nearby Troy, New York.  Long walks and picnicking in the local hills proved to be less than sufficient activity for the more athletic and they soon set up a croquet court and lawn tennis on the village green.  As early as 1881 several of the men were playing golf on a few holes laid out on Pinnacle Hill using tomato cans sunk into rough greens, with one or two golf clubs shared by all.

Arvin Harrington, one of the Troy contingent, rallied a group of fellow golfers and masterminded the layout of a complete nine holes of golf on Sunday, September 12, 1886.  The course extended over the Edgerton, Edson Holley and Sykes pastures which gave the layout rolling hills and hollows, as well as swamp and water hazards.  The map drawn and dated the following day is inscribed as follows:

 

“Course laid out by A. W. Harrington, Esq. And Mayor of the City,

assisted by a crowd of thugs, touts and loafers.

1st Assistant Civil Engineers

“Dock” Holley, D. D.

“Bill” Kent, A.M. M.D. D.Q.L.

The course was planned and laid out on Sunday, September 12th 1886. 

The aforementioned A.W. Harrington, Chief Engineer and Mayor of the City

was late to dinner on this account and caught hell when he got home. 

All of which I can swear to.

                   Gillett”

 

Ransom Gillett was a Troy attorney.  The “original members and founders” of the Dorset Golf Links, as the course was first named, were the following.

 

Allan Bourne New York, N.Y.

Richard M. Campbell, Troy, N.Y.

James C. Chapin, Troy N.Y.

Ransom H. Gillett, Troy, N.Y.

Arvin W. Harrington, Troy, N.Y.

Joe H. Harrington, Troy, N.Y.

George B. Harrison, Troy, N.Y.

Fred S. Hawley, Troy, N.Y.

S. Frank Holley, New York, N.Y.

W. E. Kent, Dorset, VT.

Charles H. Keyes, New York, N.Y.

Edwin Q. Lasoll, New York, N.Y.

O.P. Lipscomb, Troy, N.Y.

George Lewis Prentiss, New York, N.Y.

Henry S. Woodruff, Dorset, VT

Arvin Harrington was elected president.  He owned the white-framed house on Church Street directly behind our present first tee (now owned by Club member Richard Hittle).  An upstairs room in the Harrington home served as the first clubhouse.  Arvin also set up shop and began to turn out golf clubs.  He experimented until he could even create hand-forged irons.  It was not long before he had the entire membership equipped with drivers, cleeks, lofters, and putters.  Until A.G. Spaulding ventured cautiously into the manufacture of golf balls in 1895, the “gutties” ball made from the coagulated juice of the gutta percha tree, had to be imported from Great Britain.

In good Scottish tradition each hole had a name:

 

Frost Knoll, 225 yards

Edgerton Lot, 180 yards

Highway, 200 yards

Clover Patch, 217 yards

Stump Hollow, 130 yards

Elm Tree, 220 yards

Stump Hollow (return), 200 yards

Bull Barn, 325 yards

Home Willow Tree, 195 yards

      Total Length, 1,892 Yards

Cows and goats (natural mowers before machines) roamed these first fairways and added an intriguing element of hazard.  An intricate set of ground rules covered action to be taken if a ball wereto bounce off a cow, or, more likely, to land in her droppings.  The putting greens were fenced with barbed  wire and entered  by a turnstile.  Some  of the first tees  looked like a child’s overlarge sandbox filled to the top with soil, planted with grass seed.  At each tee small containers held wet sand with which a player made a mound to tee up his ball.  Rubber tees, like a watch fob with a cup at one end, were used by some.  Wooden tees were not invented until the mid 1920’s.

By 1894 the summer business was booming. Golfers, needing more room, moved the clubhouse from the Harrington’s home to a building next to Peltier’s store just across Church Street.  The village columnist wrote in the Manchester Journal:

“It is quite evident that Dorset has not sufficient accommodations for the rapidly increasing summer business. It is a fact which city people appreciate more and more that there is no pleasanter spot on earth for tired mortals to rest and recuperate than Dorset and what is needed is more cottages and larger boarding houses…..”

A permanent clubhouse was needed.  Spurred by a large gift from Henry S. Woodruff, it was started in 1895 and had its formal opening in August 1896.  At the same time, the name was changed to the Dorset Field Club to better reflect the overall nature of the Club.

[Tom Buggy]

It is more than about time that I update the project that is seeking to determine the year in which golf started at The Edgewood Club of Tivoli (located in Dutchess County, New York).  The bottom line here is that if golf existed before September, 1886 (when a course at the Dorset Field Club in Vermont is credibly said to exist) the Edgewood Club of Tivoli would be the oldest continually operated golf club in the United States at its original location.

Unfortunately, documented evidence of the golf start year has not yet been found.  I say "yet" because the project has continued and will continue.  I have just about exhausted discovery possibilities from the Internet, newspaper archives, and searches in libraries and historical societies.  While something out of the blue remains a possibility, I believe the best (and perhaps the last) remaining hope is the family and personal papers and memorabilia of early club members - if such can be found (some have been found but have not yielded an answer).  I also hope to do a solicitation of information from Livingston family descendants at a Livingston Family Reunion to be held in the fall of 2018.

What we know is that the club was founded informally in 1883, and formally organized at Tivoli in 1884 with property, a constitution and bylaws.  It was founded primarily for tennis and social activity, but a 50th-anniversary history book published in 1937 mentions a golf course of five holes that were later condensed to three, and that the course became a 9-hole course in 1909 when a member purchased adjoining land and gave use of it to the club.  What the history book does not say is when the original five holes were put in place - thus, the absence of documented evidence.  What is also known is that golf has been played continuously on the same site from whenever the original holes were put in play.

My personal belief is that golf existed at the club very early in its existence, i.e. in 1884 or 1885.  This belief is based on the following:

-- In an interview with an elderly club member, she said that in a 1990s discussion with Honoria Livingston (the last direct Livingston descendant) Honoria said that golf "was there from the beginning" and that it was "inspired" by a Livingston family member who had made a recent trip to Scotland at the time.

-- Another elderly Livingston family descendant of an early club member states that his interpretation of the 1937 history book content is that golf was present in 1884, and there was no need to state a date.

-- The 1937 club history book which, although published in 1937, was written in the context of a 50th anniversary from 1884, has a passage which mentions walking to the club to play tennis or golf.

The primary argument against golf in 1884 or 1885 is that a very detailed list of 1885 club rules (including the fine fo0r spilling lemonade in the clubhouse) does not mention the word golf.  However, this might not be conclusive because of the clear primary focus on tennis, and history book content that says golf "was located in a remote field."  In other words, golf at the time was not an activity worthy of inclusion in club rules.

Of course, all of the above evidence is "circumstantial."  The search for documented evidence continues.

[Tom Buggy]

A new discovery has been made in the search for the year in which golf started at the Edgewood Club of Tivoli. A file under the club's name has been retrieved from the Delafield Papers housed at the Princeton University library. General Delafield served as the club president for several years, including the 1936 and 1937 years in which the club's first history book was prepared and printed. The file contains a letter from the history book author (James Livingston Freeborn) to club member Thomas Hunt. The letter's content includes the following:
"I think that in 1886 or 1887 the three hole course was laid out because I know that I played there before I graduated in 1889.
The club history book says about the golf course: "Originally a five hole course, it was condensed into a three hole course later." So, if the three-hole course was done in 1886, the five-hole course had to exist in 1885 (a year earlier) at the latest. Similarly, a three-hole course in 1887 means that the five-hole course had to exist by 1886 at the latest. In both cases, it is likely that there was more than one year between the two layouts. Assuming that the Dorset Field Club course dates to September 1886, this new information establishes the possibility that the Edgewood Club of Tivoli is the oldest continually operated U'S. golf club at its original location.
Unfortunately, I do not believe that the nature of the new information supports making an "oldest" claim.  "I think that" and "1886 or 1887" are too imprecise.

[MCirba]

A new discovery has been made in the search for the year in which golf started at the Edgewood Club of Tivoli. A file under the club's name has been retrieved from the Delafield Papers housed at the Princeton University library. General Delafield served as the club president for several years, including the 1936 and 1937 years in which the club's first history book was prepared and printed. The file contains a letter from the history book author (James Livingston Freeborn) to club member Thomas Hunt. The letter's content includes the following:
"I think that in 1886 or 1887 the three hole course was laid out because I know that I played there before I graduated in 1889.
The club history book says about the golf course: "Originally a five hole course, it was condensed into a three hole course later." So, if the three-hole course was done in 1886, the five-hole course had to exist in 1885 (a year earlier) at the latest. Similarly, a three-hole course in 1887 means that the five-hole course had to exist by 1886 at the latest. In both cases, it is likely that there was more than one year between the two layouts. Assuming that the Dorset Field Club course dates to September 1886, this new information establishes the possibility that the Edgewood Club of Tivoli is the oldest continually operated U'S. golf club at its original location.
Unfortunately, I do not believe that the nature of the new information supports making an "oldest" claim.  "I think that" and "1886 or 1887" are too imprecise.

Tom Buggy,

Great research...thanks for sharing!   The only assumption I'd question is that the 5 hole to 3 hole course had to be a year prior.   Given the very rudimentary nature of those earliest courses it could be that two of the holes became impractical to play during that same year given anything from topography to conditions to maintainability, etc., and it became simpler for the few members playing to just go around three hole loops.   


My winter project this year, time permitting, is to continue my research into trying to prove that Dorset Field Club began golf in 1886 as is claimed that will hopefully inform an In My Opinion piece.   I need to visit the USGA Library soon for what I believe will be the last piece of the puzzle.   Thanks again!

[Jonathan Cummings]

Not the oldest by any means but an early one still.  Belleair in Clearwater FL is very well documented to have had continuous play on the current location since its beginning in 1897 (6 hole hotel course).  By that metric Belleair is likely the first in FL. 

[Tom Buggy]

Mike Cirba, thanks for your comments. What you suggest with respect to a same-year conversion of the Edgewood Club of Tivoli course from five holes to three is a possibility, but other uncorroborated circumstantial evidence (my post of 2/1/2018) suggests that golf was present as early as the founding year of 1884. In any case, we just don't know. I'll keep digging.

[Tom Buggy]

A new discovery. Based on the 1936 date of a letter in the Delafield papers from the author of the 1937 history book to General Delafield, and from material in the 1984 history book, it is established that the major content of the 1937 history book was in place in 1936. (Delafield had been pressing the author to add names of officers and tournament winners, and to provide full names of early members. These were added to the end of the book before it was printed in 1937.) The 1936 date is important given the following content in the 1937 history book:

"As I look back fifty years to the time we drove horses and thought nothing of walking up from Tivoli Landing or down from Northwood, playing tennis or golf and then walking home, the motors of today seem out of place."

Note "fifty years" and "golf." Fifty years earlier than 1936 is 1886, and golf would have been present in that year. (Given that the 1937 book was to be a 50th-anniversary book of the club's  1884 founding, it's possible that the major content of the book was written before 1936; but there is clear evidence for 1936.) Without considering the disputed September 1886 course at the Dorset Field Club, would this new discovery establish the Edgewood Club of Tivoli as the oldest continually used U.S. golf club at its original location?

[Gib_Papazian]

Olympic bought the old Lakeside GC in 1917 and retained the services of Raynor to build his "West Coast Lido." TD like to chide me about it, but the plans still hang on the wall in the locker room, sticking their tongue out at me.


My memory says in the wake of the (read: senseless) Great War ending, the club decided to build 36 holes to meet the higher demand, so Willie Watson (and later Sam Whiting, employed by the club) designed the Pacific Links and Lake Courses.


Our 1860 founding as an athletic club is irrelevant. If anything, Lakeside CC (NLE) had an older pedigree than Olympic by a long shot.


Professor Kennedy has it pretty well wired up.

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