Golf Club Atlas
GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Anthony Gray on March 25, 2009, 10:01:23 AM
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What are some of the long walks between holes?
Do you like or dislike them?
How much does the walk between holes effect the routing?
Anthony
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Anthony:
Just to show you how obnoxious long walks between holes apparently used to be, up until 1877 it was actually restricted to a number of club-lengths by the Rules of Golf! ;)
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Anthony, I can't do the search feature as well as others, but there was a discussion some time ago regarding the walk from the 5th green to 6th tee box at Pebble Beach. Hopefully someone can find it (or not, I guess).
It included some nice artwork by Huckaby if I remember correctly. :)
-- Rob
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Yale 9 to 10 long walk. Both holes are worth it, but it is a trek.
Crystal Downs 11 to 12 and 16 to 17. Beautiful walk but not convinced I love the flow.
Pilgrim's Run - I'm blanking on the exact holes but it is toward the end of the front nine (either 7 to 8 or 8 to 9??)
There can't be many longer than my grand prize winner....
Ted Rhodes golf course in Nashville 10 to 11 and then again 17 to 18. I'm thinking half-mile.
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Any photos of the canadian course that has a nice walk?
Anthony
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There can't be many longer than my grand prize winner....
Ted Rhodes golf course in Nashville 10 to 11 and then again 17 to 18. I'm thinking half-mile.
Try Jeff Brauer's Legend course at Giants Ridge. There's one green-to-tee trek (or ride) on the back side that has to be way longer than half a mile.
Jeff can give the particulars, and the explanation.
Perhaps, while he's at it, he can tell you about one (?) environmentalist's objection to his final par-3 on that same course.
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Any photos of the canadian course that has a nice walk?
Anthony
See Ran's profile of Cape Breton Highlands, the 480 yard walk from 12 green to 13 tee. That doesn't seem to bad to me as long as it's not straight up hill.
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I think it's safe to say that nearly everyone dispises long walks. Therefore, I don't believe anyone in their right mind would purposely design them in. Most stem from 1 of 3 circumstances. 1) environmental concerns that must be skirted, 2) terrain not condusive to holes being contiguous, (and as a subset, rock), 3) stuck with a poor landplan.
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Yale 9 to 10 long walk. Both holes are worth it, but it is a trek.
Crystal Downs 11 to 12 and 16 to 17. Beautiful walk but not convinced I love the flow.
Pilgrim's Run - I'm blanking on the exact holes but it is toward the end of the front nine (either 7 to 8 or 8 to 9??)
There can't be many longer than my grand prize winner....
Ted Rhodes golf course in Nashville 10 to 11 and then again 17 to 18. I'm thinking half-mile.
Tim,
Believe it or not, Ironbridge Club in Glenwood Springs, CO beats that one handily--I believe the staff estimated the trek from #9 green to #10 tee at a little over a mile. Then #13 to #14 would be almost that. #1 to #2 and #8 to #9 would also be about half mile treks. Arthur Hills design.
Oh...the walk up to #10 is essentially up the side of the mountain ;D At least #13 to #14 is back down...
I'll be impressed if anyone can top all that!
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Best long walk between tees is Yale #9 to #10, and it's really not that long. Climbing up to #10 tee once you arrive is more arduous than the walk.
The most offensive walk that immediately comes to mind is Cape May National. The walk from #9 to #10 was roughly 800 yards, as confirmed by Google Earth. It was an exclamation point on an already odd routing which seems to be too hell bent on having returning nines. With close to a half mile separating the front and back, I am certain that it is entirely possible to putt out on #9 and then watch the players behind you pass you in carts before you reach the next tee on foot.
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Journey at Pechanga, Temecula, Cal. Arthur Hills-designed casino course. From fifth green to 6th tee is over 1/2 mile and a 250 foot ascent.
By contrast, the 480-yard walk at Cape Breton Highland Links along that river bed from 12th green to 13th tee is just a lovely ground-level stroll, the perfect distance to get a decent corona lit up and going.
Watch for some amazingly long stretches between holes at next week's Nationwide Tour event at TPC San Francisco Bay at Stonebrae. It will be interesting to count the number of cart transits they set up for players and caddies.
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Seven Canyons has to win at least one prize. Eight green to nine tee is long (3 to 4 minutes in a cart) enough to warrant a player assistant stationed there to help you find your way. That's on top of the 10-minute drive from the temporary clubhouse to the practice tee. The views are good on the way, though.
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The walk at Cape Breton Highlands is the longest one I've seen that was meant to be walked. I thought that was genius ... you are in a National Park there, and it's an enforced break which makes you appreciate the setting. [So, turning it into a cart ride is awful.]
Long cart rides like the one Brad described are pretty bad. Another course that has a few of those is Peninsula Papagayo in Costa Rica ... there are a couple of rides which must be 1/2 mile and a couple hundred feet uphill, too. There probably wasn't any other solution for that property, though.
A good routing for a golf course is all about trying to avoid awkward transitions between holes, just as much as it is about finding good holes. But, you have to keep your mind open to the possibility that a relatively long transition will be worth the walk, as opposed to other possible solutions for a particular stretch of land.
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I'm not sure how long it is but this one at Barnbougle is my favorite. (edit to reduce size)
(http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b350/jasontopp/Barnbougle/IMG_0027.jpg)
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The walk along the beach to Crail's back holes is lovely and welcome, but this is a very rare instance. There aren't many holes out there in which the quality of the hole justifies the long walk. Usually, nasty terrain or housing is the reason. Speaking of nasty terrain, folks love to play through huge dunes, but one side effect is that these dunes can often cause several longish walks in a round (and constrict play when the wind is up!). Hence one reason that I welcome some flatter terrain when playing in these sort of dunes.
Ciao
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OK....Cruden Bay again.....I love the walk up the hill. There are placesyou can stop and enjoy the view. And at the top you just have to pause and take it all in. The walk back down is wonderful also.
Anthony
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A couple years ago I played a pretty awful course in the SD area called Carmel Mountain Ranch. It seemed every tee was miles from the previous green. A bunch of holes between a bunch of houses. Not so enjoyable a walk.
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The infamous and often-discussed hole 13-14 trek on Bandon Trails (which now features shuttle service) sticks out like a sore thumb on a course that features fairly short transitions everywhere else. Still, I think the resulting holes are worth it.
Then , of course, there is the 5-minute (no joke) cart ride between the 11th and 12th holes at The Ranch (San Jose, CA), the longest of many ridiculous commutes on the least golf-worthy site I've ever suffered.
The Course at Wente Vineyard (Livermore, CA) features a cart path which must rival the Pechanga transition mentioned by Mr. Klein, climbing 250 feet from #9 to #10 with 8 or 9 switchbacks on the side of a cliff.
The biggest problem I've seen with long transitions occurs when some are riding while others walk. Big gaps and pileups as the walkers simply can't keep pace.
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A couple years ago I played a pretty awful course in the SD area called Carmel Mountain Ranch. It seemed every tee was miles from the previous green. A bunch of holes between a bunch of houses. Not so enjoyable a walk.
yea but other than that it was great right Steve? ::) :P
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I think it's safe to say that nearly everyone dispises long walks. Therefore, I don't believe anyone in their right mind would purposely design them in. Most stem from 1 of 3 circumstances. 1) environmental concerns that must be skirted, 2) terrain not condusive to holes being contiguous, (and as a subset, rock), 3) stuck with a poor landplan.
100% correct, I think.
The other thing to add is that golf carts ennable these kinds of distances, and then reinforce themsleves insofar as they becoem necessary in order to get around the course in a decent amount of time.
Long distances between the last green and the next tee are basically an evil. The fact that there may be nice scenery along the way makes them only slightly less evil. The fact that long distances may enhance the "last" hole and the "next" by isolating playing groups from one another is, I suppose, a valid benefit. But it does not outweigh all of the basic problems of having that distance in the first place.
I genuinely believe that subconsciously, the reason that so many people get such enjoyment out of older golf courses, is the connection they feel to the routing when there are no large gaps between the last green and the next tee. It is one of the first things I think about when I rate my own personal enjoyment of a golf course.
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There's no excuse for the long walk from 6 to 7 at Black Mesa. A great hole could have been laid out from near the 6 greeen. I walked the first round and took advantage of the free cart for my second round. Even the cart refused to go from 6 to 7 and I had to send course personel out to get it after finishing 9.
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The walk from the 16th green to 17th tee at World Woods Pine Barrens approximates 150 yards, as does the walk from the 17th green to 18th tee - all to play a hole dominated by an overgrown tree line.
Bogey
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The walk along the beach to Crail's back holes is lovely and welcome, but this is a very rare instance. There aren't many holes out there in which the quality of the hole justifies the long walk. Usually, nasty terrain or housing is the reason. Speaking of nasty terrain, folks love to play through huge dunes, but one side effect is that these dunes can often cause several longish walks in a round (and constrict play when the wind is up!). Hence one reason that I welcome some flatter terrain when playing in these sort of dunes.
Ciao
Crail is a pleasent walk.
Anthony
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Kyle - when doing the course rating at THE RANCH, just for kicks we measured the cart ride from 11 to 12... it came out just a little less than a mile.
I still say that course is the one to bring the militant walkers into the light.... or darkness as it were... walking that would be beyond stupid.
And Rob, do you mean this picture? How Pat Mucci sees #6 at Pebble? Always happy to trot this out....
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/THuckaby/Pebble6-Mucci.jpg)
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The walk between the fourth green and fifth tee at Blackwolf Run River is a long way, but I don't mind it because it's a reall cool walk through the trees and the next nine holes that follow may be among my favorite nine consecutive holes anywhere.
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Although it's a course that few people walk, Caledonia would have a couple longer green-to-tee walks--6 to 7 comes to mind as the first one. The main ones are 8 to 9, and then 9 back to 10. I am in the minority in liking that hole, and I'm probably also in the minority that believes it's a great walk to that tee and then from that green.
I am also a big fan of Crail as a walking course. The only slightly annoying thing about it is that the toughest walk is from the 18th green to the clubhouse, which is pretty tiring at the end of the round.
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Kyle - when doing the course rating at THE RANCH, just for kicks we measured the cart ride from 11 to 12... it came out just a little less than a mile.
I still say that course is the one to bring the militant walkers into the light.... or darkness as it were... walking that would be beyond stupid.
And Rob, do you mean this picture? How Pat Mucci sees #6 at Pebble? Always happy to trot this out....
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/THuckaby/Pebble6-Mucci.jpg)
What Ocean?
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Anthony - it's more like "what views". The Muccian Doctrine would have us believe that if it's not in play, it doesn't matter.
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The walk along the beach to Crail's back holes is lovely and welcome, but this is a very rare instance. There aren't many holes out there in which the quality of the hole justifies the long walk. Usually, nasty terrain or housing is the reason. Speaking of nasty terrain, folks love to play through huge dunes, but one side effect is that these dunes can often cause several longish walks in a round (and constrict play when the wind is up!). Hence one reason that I welcome some flatter terrain when playing in these sort of dunes.
Ciao
That walk at Crail has never struck me as a long walk, though I guess it may be, it's certainly always pleasant with the beach on one side and the cave on the other. It's certainly less arduous than the walk back to the clubhouse after 18, but at least then a beer is within touching distance.
There's a long (and steeply uphill) walk through woods between (I think) the 11th and 12th holes at the Manor House at Castle Combe (an Alliss/Clark design). When I was a member there I was still playing (field) hockey to county standard but even so needed a minute or two to get my breath back before teeing off on 12. That course had a number of other long(ish) walks and was almost the only course I have played in the UK where if I played it today I might think about taking a buggy.
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The better picture from that thread was the CPC 16 homage hole, the one with the spewing fountain in the middle of the lake.
Are Long Walks Between Tees, On Walkable Courses, Always Screwups? (http://golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,31764.0.html)
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If it had to be walked, Plantation Course would be the worst of all...
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If it had to be walked, Plantation Course would be the worst of all...
Nope. Been to both. THE RANCH AT SILVER CREEK (San Jose, CA) is worse.
Which has to tell ya something about said course, huh Mike?
:'(
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Or you can get the long hike out of the way really early, like at the outset with a cart ride, the way Doak did it at Lost Dunes. And while I haven't been there in 15 years, isn't it just about as long a trip back to the clubhouse from the 18th green at his Black Forest-Wilderness Valley Course?
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Bandon Dunes has three medium length walks: 3-4, 6-7, and 8-9, that seem to have been avoidable. Couldn't you have just put the next tee closer to the green, and still fashioned a fine golf hole in each case?
By the way, I just played Bandon Dunes for the first time in three years on Monday. Absolutely delightful, a great complement to the other great courses there.
Stanford has short walks, but has the curious attribute of three steep uphill walks to the tee at the end of the round: 14-15, 16-17, and 17-18. A great test of stamina; I always liked that.
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I know a course in PA that I've been accused of picking on that is literally 12 MILES from first tee to 18th green.
Top that! ;)
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When old farts show up at Tetherow, they tell them it is a 9 mile walk around the course and try to sell them a cart ride.
Since we walked and played in just over 3 hours, I believe the walk to be less than 6.5 miles.
Mike, how accurate is your 12 mile length.
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When old farts show up at Tetherow, they tell them it is a 9 mile walk around the course and try to sell them a cart ride.
Since we walked and played in just over 3 hours, I believe the walk to be less than 6.5 miles.
Mike, how accurate is your 12 mile length.
Garland,
6.5 miles. How long did you tell me Venice Beach was?
Anthony
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Mike, how accurate is your 12 mile length.
Garland,
You have to see it to believe it. :o
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Kyle - when doing the course rating at THE RANCH, just for kicks we measured the cart ride from 11 to 12... it came out just a little less than a mile.
I still say that course is the one to bring the militant walkers into the light.... or darkness as it were... walking that would be beyond stupid.
And Rob, do you mean this picture? How Pat Mucci sees #6 at Pebble? Always happy to trot this out....
(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d62/THuckaby/Pebble6-Mucci.jpg)
Thanks, man!! That always gives me a chuckle.
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Bandon Dunes has three medium length walks: 3-4, 6-7, and 8-9, that seem to have been avoidable. Couldn't you have just put the next tee closer to the green, and still fashioned a fine golf hole in each case?
By the way, I just played Bandon Dunes for the first time in three years on Monday. Absolutely delightful, a great complement to the other great courses there.
Stanford has short walks, but has the curious attribute of three steep uphill walks to the tee at the end of the round: 14-15, 16-17, and 17-18. A great test of stamina; I always liked that.
Pacific Dunes has a hefty walk to the 12th tee as well, but if I have to hike somewhere, it might as well be on that glorius stretch of Oregon coastline.
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Kapalua Plantation, Tournament Course at Redstone and Weaver Ridge in Peoria, IL are a few that come to mind.
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What irks me is courses that are obviously designed to be carts only and where the routing obviously reflects that decision from the start.
A good example is the two courses at the RTJ Trail in Alabama at Opelika, the Grand National's Lake and Links courses. I really had a good time playing both courses, but there were some bridges across the eponymous lakes that yielded at least four treks of about a mile each. No way you could walk, and the routing planned that from day one.
The Judge at Prattville is the same, with a 100' climb from 18th green up to the clubhouse via a corkscrew wood bridge reputed to cost $1M. :o
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While we know better today, apparently some times long walks were added on purpose!
...and, more importantly, they were added by guys like Hugh Wilson, George Crump, Robert Lesley, Ab Smith, and if memory serves, even Tillinghast bought into their fallacious reasoning!
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3445/3385863506_abedcdc7e8_o.jpg)
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Kyle:
When we first laid out Pacific Dunes, the 12th tee would have been combined with the 5th tee, not a very long walk at all from #11 green. But we became worried that some guys would play down #4 fairway to get to #12 green, so we had to move #12 tee inland and extend the walk.
It still wouldn't be that far if you could cut across in front of #5 tee, but obviously that's dangerous and interrupts play. So we routed the path around the back of #5 tee, figuring that as long as people were looking at the ocean they wouldn't count that part of the walk against us.
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The walk out and then again back from the old nine to the new nine on the Barassie Links at the Kilmarnock Golf Club (near or in Troon) is a minus, but otherwise it's a fine course. You play three old nine holes, then the nine new nine holes, and then return to the old holes to finish the last six. The two parts of the course are different in character, not in itself a problem, but the long walks between the two nines added nothing to my enjoyment of the course. Off hand I cannot recall how long the path is, but you notice you're making a trip.
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The Bandon Trails 13/14 walk/ride is the worst that I've experienced. Up to that point, the course is just a fabulous walking course, and the introduction of a shuttle ride in that kind of setting is unfortunate, it really interrupts the flow of the round. Not to mention the fact that the hole you're walking to, #14, is my least favorite hole at the entire resort. I don't mind a long hike on a nice day to a hole that's special, but working that hard to get to that hole just makes the experience even worse.
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The Bandon Trails 13/14 walk/ride is the worst that I've experienced. Up to that point, the course is just a fabulous walking course, and the introduction of a shuttle ride in that kind of setting is unfortunate, it really interrupts the flow of the round. Not to mention the fact that the hole you're walking to, #14, is my least favorite hole at the entire resort. I don't mind a long hike on a nice day to a hole that's special, but working that hard to get to that hole just makes the experience even worse.
Rob - I'd say one's feelings about 14 determine one's feelings about the walk/ride to get there.
You don't like 14, so the walk sucks. Totally understood.
I like 14, so I find it to be a lovely jaunt through the forest; a prelude to the tasks to come.
;D
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Tom,
Again I agree. There is anticipation with that walk and you now an unique hole awaits you.
Anthony
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Two courses in San Diego that is awful are the Crossings at Carlsbad and Santaluz. The crossings at Carlsbad has a hole where you must trek back the whole distance of the par 4 you played and then tee off parallel to it, and Santaluz is just meant to be riding course, just way to much uphill walks in between the greens and tees to walk.
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The ride to the top of the mountain for the 1st tees at Boyne Mountain takes at least 15 minutes (don't recall the names of the two courses). It's got to be well over a mile. Can't actually imagine how long it would take to walk with a golf bag, but that's way more exercise than I'd be interested in. . .
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Tom Huckaby writes:
You don't like 14, so the walk sucks. Totally understood.
I think this is the key to any long hike on a golf course. There better be a reward. This is part of why Cruden Bay works so well. When you finish your hike you have this wonderful view that made the hike worth it.
This is why the Ranch doesn't even come close to working. A long hike leads you to another mediocre hole. There is no payoff.
Cheers,
Dan King
With a fine sea view and a clear course in front of him, the golfer may be excused if he regards golf, even though it be indifferent golf, as the true and adequate end of man's existence.
--A.J. Balfour
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Dan:
Well said, future partner. Total agreement re Cruden Bay and The Ranch as well as the general concept. And let that be the last time those two are included in any sentence outside of "Cruden Bay is excellent and THE RANCH really really sucks."
TH
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There's a course in Pinckney MI, Timber Trace that has a 5-6 minute CART RIDE between I think 13 and 14. Between 7 and 8 at Arcadia Bluffs would be a long walk too...
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I've got another one for you. At Buffalo Peak in Union, OR you leave the club house and walk to about the highest point on the course to tee off 1. At 9 green you are at about the lowest point on the course, which you leave and walk up to 10 tee which is just below 1 tee. Wonderful fellows these cart-ball designers are now aren't they?
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I don't remember the exact hole numbers, but the Donald Steele Cherokee Plantation course in Yemassee, SC has 3 holes on the back nine that are separated by old rice fields. The "gap" was long enough that we were carted.
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Having walked this beautiful path between the 12th and 13th hole at Highland Links, I can only say what a great walk it is along the Clyburn. Every golfer should have the pleasure of taking it. Better still golf carts are not allowed on this path but take a far less scenic route to the 13th tee. I have hijacked the photo from Ran's article on Highland to exhibit here:
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Tom Huckaby writes:
You don't like 14, so the walk sucks. Totally understood.
I think this is the key to any long hike on a golf course. There better be a reward. This is part of why Cruden Bay works so well. When you finish your hike you have this wonderful view that made the hike worth it.
This is why the Ranch doesn't even come close to working. A long hike leads you to another mediocre hole. There is no payoff.
Cheers,
Dan King
With a fine sea view and a clear course in front of him, the golfer may be excused if he regards golf, even though it be indifferent golf, as the true and adequate end of man's existence.
--A.J. Balfour
Dan
Where is the hiking involved at Cruden Bay?
Tom
Are you serious? You altered a tee location because you thought people would play the wrong hole and the alteration requires a hike? That is amazingly sad. Guys can find their way round the world but you can't trust them to find 18 tees. I have been lost a few times on a course, but these incidents were down to me shortcutting. Go back and alter the tees the way they should be.
Ciao
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Sean,
quite a long walk up from 8 green to 9 tee
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Sean,
quite a long walk up from 8 green to 9 tee
Jeff
I spose its not a good walk being steeply uphill especially as the 9th is a poor hole, but the views.....
Ciao
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Sean Arble writes:
I spose its not a good walk being steeply uphill especially as the 9th is a poor hole, but the views....
That was my point. You put that hike on almost any courses and it is bad design. At Cruden Bay it works because of the reward at the top.
I wonder what people who play it regularly think. The locals I played with were always happy to make the hike, but I think it was partially to show off the view. How do they feel just out playing on a Sunday afternoon? I might skip going up the hill and just walk around to the 11th, 14th or 16th holes.
Cheers,
Dan King
[Crudin Bay] A great personal favorite of mine which I hated to leave out of my Gourmet's Choice; but I couldn't list it as superior to Simpson's Ballybunion. Cruden Bay is more of a "cult" course, thanks to it's huge sandhills, superb views, great and terrible holes, and relative anonymity.
--Tom Doak (The Confidential Guide to Golf Courses)
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General information for consideration in both the "longest walks" thread and the "shortest walks" thread.
In a green to tee distance race between the UK and the USA, the UK wins - big time!
I wrote an article for Golf Magazine comparing the pace of play in the UK to the pace of play in the US. While visiting eleven courses in England and Scotland, I measured the courses and the green to tee distances were a key ingredient of my calculations.
To sum it up, the average of the total green to tee distances a player travels on a UK course was 788 yards (approximately 46 yards per hole), as compared to the average of the total green to tee distances traveled by a player on a US course which was 3,061 yards (approximately180 yards per hole). Therefore, the Brits typically walk 1.3 miles less from greens to tees than we do when playing 18 holes.
So, if you want to find the longest walk between holes, you'll probably find it in the US.
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Sean,
quite a long walk up from 8 green to 9 tee
Jeff
I spose its not a good walk being steeply uphill especially as the 9th is a poor hole, but the views.....
Ciao
From the standpoint of a humble, low-skill golfer: I really liked number 9 the one day I played two rounds at Cruden Bay. The climb up from 8 is steep, but not too long. Nine is a simple hole. You hit it up and over the top of the hill, probably the top of Cruden Bay's world, and then down to the green. The view up the fairway from the tee -- a green field (fairway), the line at the horizon and then pure blue sky above (true), with no indication (except memory) of what's beyond I still believe is one of the greatest views off a tee I've ever seen, both aesthetically and from a golf standpoint. The contrast with the rest of the course, and the half-way link -- a break -- between the mostly rolly-polly holes on either side makes it in my view a wonderful hole in its place at the top of a wonderful course. 10 is a similar link -- a typical but it brings you back to earth. But then that's just my opinion.
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Pilgrim's Run - I'm blanking on the exact holes but it is toward the end of the front nine (either 7 to 8 or 8 to 9??)
#8 green to #9 tee..you actually pass #3 tee, #2 green AND THEN through the woods!
Tony Nysse
Asst. Supt.
Colonial CC
Ft. Worth, TX
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The ride to the top of the mountain for the 1st tees at Boyne Mountain takes at least 15 minutes (don't recall the names of the two courses). It's got to be well over a mile. Can't actually imagine how long it would take to walk with a golf bag, but that's way more exercise than I'd be interested in. . .
Mark you beat me too it after I began to read subsequent posts talking about long walks to first tees and from the last hole. And you are right about the Boyne Mountain "Monument" and "Alpine" courses.
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Brasada Ranch near Redmond has countless monster green to tee transfers, many with sharp elevation changes.
Easily the worst course for walking I have ever seen.
Tetherow has some long transfers as well, although Garland seems to have found a way to shorten them to make his total trek there only 6.5 miles :)
- 2nd to 3rd - ouch
- 6th to 7th - ouch
- 7th to 8th - ouch
- 9th to 10th - like wicked owee
- 12th to 13th - major leg heaviness
- 15th to 16th - through a tunnel - woo hoo
- 17th to 18th - this must be the last one
- 18th to Clubhouse - 1/2 mile up a hill to collect your beer
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Sean Arble writes:
I spose its not a good walk being steeply uphill especially as the 9th is a poor hole, but the views....
That was my point. You put that hike on almost any courses and it is bad design. At Cruden Bay it works because of the reward at the top.
I wonder what people who play it regularly think. The locals I played with were always happy to make the hike, but I think it was partially to show off the view. How do they feel just out playing on a Sunday afternoon? I might skip going up the hill and just walk around to the 11th, 14th or 16th holes.
Cheers,
Dan King
[Crudin Bay] A great personal favorite of mine which I hated to leave out of my Gourmet's Choice; but I couldn't list it as superior to Simpson's Ballybunion. Cruden Bay is more of a "cult" course, thanks to it's huge sandhills, superb views, great and terrible holes, and relative anonymity.
--Tom Doak (The Confidential Guide to Golf Courses)
Dan
I spose I didn't think the 8 to 9 walk was anything too harsh regardless of what came next. Plus, this is the only one like it on the course which is really quite remarkable considering the size of the dunes. I have often thought that the wee course in the middle of the big course has some terrific land. I reckon it must have been a tough choice to not use this land and instead head over toward 10-12 with #9 being the linker. In the end, the views must have won the day.
Ciao
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Sean,
I think that the fear was that players would deliberatly play down the 4th fairway and that they would mistake the 4th for the 12th.
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While we know better today, apparently some times long walks were added on purpose!
...and, more importantly, they were added by guys like Hugh Wilson, George Crump, Robert Lesley, Ab Smith, and if memory serves, even Tillinghast bought into their fallacious reasoning!
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3445/3385863506_abedcdc7e8_o.jpg)
Here's a bit more discussing the "intention" to add long walks to Cobb's Creek so as to reduce congestion.
This comes from January 1915, after the course was routed, but prior to construction. It's funny how even the golf writer, "Joe Bunker", buys into this obvious fallacious reasoning.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3645/3404541444_7ae38c33b9.jpg?v=0)
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Mike,
I refer to the walk from 17green to 18tee at Cobbs as "Cardiac Hill." I'm all for the installation of an escalator if and when the course gets restored. ;D