Golf Club Atlas

GolfClubAtlas.com => Golf Course Architecture => Topic started by: Sean_A on August 24, 2007, 07:57:54 PM

Title: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on August 24, 2007, 07:57:54 PM
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At just under 6000 yards, many will dismiss Kington as far too short and nothing but a bit of fun, though fun Kington certainly is, the course should not be taken lightly.  Hutchison’s fondness for North Berwick, a links famous for its variety and quirkiness, enabled him to value unusual concepts without discarding what was at the time modern design theory. Although I suspect serious changes occurred to arrive at the current layout, the original design opened in 1926. Major CK Hutchison produced a remarkably crafty course which relies greatly on gaining the correct angles of approach, for the greens often fall heavily away from the front or sides making recovery from the wrong position terribly difficult despite appearances to the contrary.  It should come as no surprise that the Major could create such a gem.  He was a well known figure in the game as an amateur (he reached the final of the 1909 British Amateur) and as a serious student of architecture through his membership of Huntercombe, an early Willie Park Jr. ground breaking design.  On a more practical level, James Braid relied heavily on Hutchison’s knowledge during the design and construction of Kings and Queens courses at Gleneagles.  Additionally, for a brief period starting in the late 20s, Hutchison was in partnership with Majors GC Campbell and SV Hotchkin.  The company, Ferigna Incorporated, was responsible for all facets of the golf course business. This “Trinity of Majors” is famously responsible for the creation of Pulborough, a course well known for its combination of beauty and fierce hazards.

Kington can fairly be described as an inland-super-mare.  The sea is miles away, yet the golf at Kington is remarkably similar to seaside golf due to the keen terrain.  There are no bunkers and the course is not overly wide with practically no shaping of the fairways. In fact, Kington is the epitome of why wide is good.  Let the golfer open the shoulders, but if he places the ball in the wrong spot he can be left with a devil of a recovery – often times from quite close to the hole.  Bradnor Hill is among the chief defences with its slopes acting for and against play.  The micro undulations can leave a player confounded on how to make solid contact with anything other than short irons, or indeed the putter. The course climbs the hill for much of the front 9 and affords arresting views of the Brecon Beacons, Malverns and Black Mountains.  The club claims that at 1284 feet Kington is the highest course in England, but that isn’t important other than to impart that wind is another of Kington’s primary defences.  The greens tend to be narrow and many are angled against fairways and/or over deep fall-aways.  While there are plenty of unknowing breaks to be had, the greens are essentially flat. Finally, Kington’s turf is as fine as one could hope to find on most highly rated links.  There is a springiness which encourages the player to be aggressive both on the fairways and greens.

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An aerial tour of Kington.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfmCm-ZoK5c&app=desktop (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfmCm-ZoK5c&app=desktop)

Peter Finch video at Kington.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TouLqFtZzKI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TouLqFtZzKI&feature=youtu.be)

Standing on the first tee one immediately senses he is in for a treat.  A decent drive will make it past a shallow recess which is part of Offa's Dyke Path. This path was created out of what is thought to be an 8th century boundary between Mercia and Powys built by King Offa.  The first three holes make steady progress up Bradnor Hill.  All are good and require a deft touch rather than brute force. 
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When the course is keen one can readily see why such width is required.  In the conditions depicted below, a drive down the middle of the fairway with any hint of draw will finish in the left quarry.
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Below is a common approach angle for #1 and one of the reasons I think Kington is a wonderful course - this design is 100% percent about the angles of play and how to use gravity to the best effect.  The green is dramatically influenced by grade level slopes.  Because of this the putting surfaces can be surprisingly fast and turn where it seems improbable.
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The reader can see the angled nature of the green from the 2nd tee.
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The 2nd turns hard right around a higher part of Bradnor Hill.  This higher ground which curves around the 2nd and 3rd greens used to be part of an horse racing track.  It is very easy to hit a drive well past the turning point left or in a deep gulley right.  A good line is the old cock fighting pit which is just in view from the tee. The green moves deceptively hard from front right. 
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#3 is a useful par 3 to a shelf green that is deceptively large.  The gentle start abruptly changes on the 4th; still uphill, brutish at 435 yards and usually into the prevailing breeze.  This is one of the few holes at Kington which requires a carry. The second shot doesn't get any easier. The green is set down a left to right slope with two tiers in the same direction. Suffice it to say that a par here is well earned.  One aspect of Kington which is disheartening are the scattering of trees behind some skyline greens.  In the case of the 4th it is a exception because of the lovely tree.
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Kington's very own Road Hole is sublime, as are all the 3 pars at Kington.  The surface of the green is blind and the short iron needs to kick in from the left.  As is evidenced by the road..this is farm country.   
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One had better know how to flight his ball and control it once it lands or Kington will eat you alive with niggling recoveries.  The 7th is an up and over reachable par 5 with a green split in two by the crest of rise.  The visual clues tell the golfer the green falls from front to back, but mysteriously the putt from the rear of the green seems to be downhill as well.  This may be because the green is near the summit of Bradnor Hill. 

#8 is a superb par 4 which can be driven from the old tees, but the club has committed a serious breach of architectural malpractice by building a new set of tees much further back and right. This addition completely ignores Hutchison's original intent.  From what is now the ladies tee, the hole is reachable, but legs left if the player chooses to try for the pitch and putt birdie.  For those going for the green, anything left all but eliminates any chance of birdie.   More than a few holes have a "gate" which is a free running access to the green for those in the correct position.  Often times this gate is off-centre which creates a dogleg effect even though the fairways tend to be very wide.  Kington is also known to have patches of gorse which cause a spot of bother here and there.
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The course continues to wind its way around Bradnor Hill with blind drives, front to back sloping greens and skyline greens as particular features. #9 from the right tee - as tricky as it gets!  Hollows guard the natural kick in area to the left of the green which, like the 8th, runs away from the tee.
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The 10th sports another blind drive and side by side two tier green.  #11 is a reachable par 5 with a clever front to back green fed from a downhill fairway. This hole marks the point of a general descent back toward the house.  Yet another formidable short hole, the twelfth is one of the author's favourites. 
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There is a gate off-set right and golfers who can't make the carry over the mounding do attempt the running hook.  This picture, taken from the right side and forward of #12 tee, highlights how a player can use the slopes to great advantage.
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Behind the green.
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After another blind drive which requires one to shape the tee shot into the hill or ride the high side as long as possible, #13 is a terrific par 4 in the middle of Kington's purple patch. A view of the green well beyond the driving area.
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Left side of the green.
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A look at the rear of the green from #13 tee.
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The 14th continues the thrilling golf with this reachable par 5.  More people than not tend to find the ferns when trying a two-shot bash at this green.  An aspect of Kington which many may notice is the often random nature of the rough lines.  It can be hard to discern one's fate when flirting with the ferns. 
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The green has a false front, but once past this deception it then falls away from the player.  Brilliantly, Hutchison created a lip on the back left of the green which helps contain approaches if the player gets into position to use the feature.  Otherwise, if aiming directly at the flag and a bit strong, the ball is apt to roll 50 yards beyond the green.

The 215 yard 15th completes the set of very good short holes.
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The penalty for coming up short is imaginative as this sort of humpty bumpty land features prominently at Kington. 
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A side view of the hollows.
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The obscured approach to #16.  This green was significantly softened some years ago.  Bitter debate still rages over whether it was a good or bad idea to level the surface.
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The seventeenth is a classic example of why width is so important to creating strategy.  This is a short par 4 with a wide fairway that often plays downwind.  However, as is the theme throughout Kington, one must gain the correct angle or be left with a very difficult approach to this green which slopes toward the clubhouse down the hill.     
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A closer look.  Notice there are no long grass stems as in the previous photo. The club has recently started cutting the fairways more often. Time will tell if the upgraded maintenance will eliminate the random fairway lines...let us hope not for that is one of the aspects of Kington which make it so endearing.
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We finally come to what I think is the finest finishing hole in golf.  It isn't often that a significant percentage of handicap golfers can stand on the tee of a par 4 and aspire to a 3.  However, on many days this is exactly the goal on Kington's 18th.  Choose a club, take aim at the pro shop, fire away over the quarry and let the fun unfold. 
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The green is an extremely narrow target.
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Looking back toward the tee and the 1st fairway. 
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Bernard Darwin had this to say about Kington: “Wisely, no attempt has been made toward a ‘set’ or stereotyped layout…outstanding in its variety, interest and charm.”  As with other courses such as Woking and Beau Desert, for those who give Kington due attention, a gradual appreciation and admiration will emerge.  There are no less than three All England candidates in numbers 1, 12 and 18 with the last being this author’s pick as the finest finishing hole he has experienced.  One’s handicap may be flattered if he chooses to play Kington on its terms, but without question fun will be had by one and all.  2*  2020

Should one decide to stay in Kington for a night and/or get thirsty, there is a wonderful pub on the outskirts of town.  With its charming front room ambience, the Ye Olde Tavern is aptly named.
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While the town is down on its luck, there is still a lot to like about Kington.
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Ciao
Title: Re:Kington - For The Benefit of Ray Ten and Mark P
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 25, 2007, 02:26:17 AM
Wonderful.  Thanks Sean.  I'll be making a short detour on my way home on Tuesday!
Title: Re:Kington - For The Benefit of Ray Ten and Mark P
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 30, 2007, 07:27:56 PM
Extraordinary.  From the first fairway on to the approach to 18 it's as if my ball was following your camera, so many of those shots are exactly the shot I had on Tuesday.  Great pictures.
Title: Re:Kington - For The Benefit of Ray Ten and Mark P
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on August 31, 2007, 11:34:45 AM
Thanks Sean, inspiring.


When you see courses like this you understand why golf  matchplay. On there it has to be matchplay.

Tony
Title: Re:Kington - For The Benefit of Ray Ten and Mark P
Post by: Mark_Rowlinson on September 01, 2007, 07:47:54 AM
And for those who may be attracted to this part of the world by Sean's wonderful photos, it is one of the most unspoiled parts of the UK.  Shropshire, Herefordshire and over the border into mid-Wales is very special. There's not much golf, but Llandrindod Wells is also worth a bash and I and others have extolled the virtues of Welshpool and Llanymynech, but the non-golfing delights are so many.  Spend a night in a pub/hotel at Bishop's Castle and enjoy the products of the two micro-breweries. Don't miss Ludlow, one of the gastronomic capitals of England (at some cost!). Neither should you miss Montgomery, a beautiful little classical town that you have to 'go to' because it's not on the way to or from anywhere. Clun is an austere place, but it's quite special, as is the drive over Kerry Hill from there to Newtown. Stokesay Castle just south of Craven Arms is a must see, more a slightly fortified manor house than a castle. Make sure you drive over the Long Mynd (throwing in a round of golf at Church Stretton), but neither should you neglect the drive along Wenlock Edge to Much Wenlock with its gorgeous Priory. read your Housman and make sure to take in places such as Hughley (given a steeple by Housman, but it doesn't have one and never did!). You are then on the southern edge of the big industrial archaeology heritage area centred on Ironbridge, which is fascinating.

Don't miss Leominster when you visit Kington. It has a lovely Priory and I remember having some of the best home-made fish cakes I've ever had in a very pleasant (and inexpensive) cafe in the charming little town.

Alternatively, head nearer to Worcester and enjoy the market town of Ledbury with its first-rate organic butchers specialising in meet from classical breeds, the charming spaciousness of Bromyard, the mistletoe markets of Tenbury Wells (nearer to Xmas, of course) and the other-worldliness of Brown Clee. This is a place to get out your Pevsner and visit the little churches - some even Saxon, many Norman and very unspoilt. There are Compostella pilgrimage churches in Herefordshire. And for those who are Elgar fans, Worcester should not be missed, and enjoy the hop fields and oast houses as you go.  By the way, I got hold of a DVD copy of Ken Russell's great Elgar film recently. It's wonderful.

It really is a special part of the world.
Title: Re: Kington - For The Benefit of Ray Ten and Mark P
Post by: Sean_A on March 20, 2009, 08:09:58 PM
The Kingdom of Kington beckons.  I have updated the review annd invite all to have a look.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON 1284 Revisted
Post by: Phil McDade on March 21, 2009, 09:56:36 AM
We finally come to what I think is the finest finishing hole in golf.  It isn't often that a significant percentage of handicap golfers can stand on the tee of a par 4 and aspire to a 3.  However, on many days this is exactly the goal on Kington's 18th.  Choose a club, take aim at the pro shop, fire away and let the fun unfold.

(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff114/seanrobertarble/100_2934.jpg?t=1187999497)

Sean:

Of all the pictures in all the threads, Courses by Country, and My Home Course features posted on GCA, this is my favorite.

I'm not sure how I missed this thread when you first posted it. Thanks very much for bringing it back and updating it.
Title: Re: KINGTON 1284 Revisted
Post by: Sean_A on March 22, 2009, 04:31:39 AM
Phil

Kington has to be the king of gravity golf.  I can't think of a single hole where a slight misjudgement won't land the player several if not several dozen yards away from the flag or in a hollow.

I have never been keen on mountain golf, but Kington is in a way mountain golf on a large hill. However, what sets it apart from the American style mountain course is the course can be walked. Hutchison kept every climb/descent just manageable and because the course is short with short green to tee walks the effort isn't too taxing - though once finished you know you were on a good walk!

Kington is in the same boat as Painswick and Huntercombe.  Its a throwback to a lost era and should be seen by anybody interested in design history - plus its a damn fine course.

Ciao

Title: Re: KINGTON 1284 Revisted
Post by: Phil McDade on March 22, 2009, 06:14:19 PM
Sean:

I just love how this course LOOKS. All those greens benched on the sides of hills, the endless parade of skyline shots, the contrast between the lay-of-the-land fairways and the often elaborate mounding near and around the greens, the long views. I spent half the night last night just googling the aerial, looking at the routing and comparing it to your tour. What was fascinating was that the land, the design, and the routing make for such an interesting course that I forget halfway through that the course is bunkerless. It's not that the course "doesn't need them;" it's as if the routing and terrain might even make bunkers superflous and distracting -- the way a wonderful and sublime piece of architecture doesn't need any bells and whistles, as they would simply detract from the graceful beauty of the original.

I'm assuming there are obvious parallels to Pennard, one of your favorites. What's your take on comparing/contrasting the two, the obvious yardage differences aside?
Title: Re: KINGTON 1284 Revisted
Post by: Peter Ferlicca on March 22, 2009, 06:41:28 PM
Sean, that has got to be one of the coolest looking golf courses I have seen, I remember seeing that 18th hole before, but the whole course has a awesome look to it.  It looks as if you are on top of a mountain playing to the edge on every hole.  The rumples in the fairway probably make every shot interesting.  The par 5 14th has to be the coolest par 5 I have seen, not a single bunker, dives down off the mountain
(http://i485.photobucket.com/albums/rr220/pferlicca/kington14.jpg)
Then this shot you took from the middle of the fairway, might be the coolest photo I have ever seen.  With the rumpled fairway leading to the skyline green with a huge false front, if this picture doesn’t get your juices flowing something wrong.
(http://i485.photobucket.com/albums/rr220/pferlicca/kington14a.jpg)
Title: Re: KINGTON 1284 Revisted
Post by: Sean_A on March 22, 2009, 07:02:14 PM
Sean:

I just love how this course LOOKS. All those greens benched on the sides of hills, the endless parade of skyline shots, the contrast between the lay-of-the-land fairways and the often elaborate mounding near and around the greens, the long views. I spent half the night last night just googling the aerial, looking at the routing and comparing it to your tour. What was fascinating was that the land, the design, and the routing make for such an interesting course that I forget halfway through that the course is bunkerless. It's not that the course "doesn't need them;" it's as if the routing and terrain might even make bunkers superflous and distracting -- the way a wonderful and sublime piece of architecture doesn't need any bells and whistles, as they would simply detract from the graceful beauty of the original.

I'm assuming there are obvious parallels to Pennard, one of your favorites. What's your take on comparing/contrasting the two, the obvious yardage differences aside?

Phil

I think there are many parallels between Kington and Pennard.  

1. Wind (both being raised above the surrounding area).
2. Dominant feature of gravity golf over aerial golf.  In a way, once you get the hang of Kington it is easier than Pennard because of the earthworks around the greens.  These can often be used to bank balls off when you want to play safe or get yourself out of trouble.  The only thing to remember is that you can't get caught on the high side of the hill with thise feature between yourself and the hole.  The great thing is that on loads of the Kington holes on has to go on the high side if he wants a shot at birdie.  
3. Blind/obscured shots (to be expected from a hilly design pre heavy machinery).
4. Many uphill approaches.
5. Deceiving driving lines (often because not sure how far the ball will roll).
6. Preferred angles of approach which accentuate ground game further.
7. Greens flowing with lay of land.
8. Humpty bumpty fairways which are hard to judge for consistent ground game options.
9. Good mix of short and mid length par 4s with the odd long one tossed in.  
10. Excellent sets of 1 shotters.
11. All par 5s reachable.
12. Both are fairly hilly, but within reason.  
13 Equalish number of drives which one must choose to either ride the high side or work the ball into the slope to hold it.  
14. It sounds weird, but both have animal dung to deal with.  The stuff sometimes influences me in what type of shot to hit around the greens as that shit can make you look like you hit a dreadfully weak chip!  
15. Superb long range views.
16. Good variety of downhill, uphill, sidehill golfing.


It really is striking how similar both courses are even though they look completely different.  Obviously, and it sounds strange writing this, Kington's site is more severe especially since Hutchison preferred to mainly attack the hills obliquely (even if uphill/downhill) whereas Braid wasn't too afraid to attack straight up hills a bit more often.  Other main differences are that Pennard has a few holes which restrict play with narrowness which I think is a good thing so long as the rough isn't stupid and Kington has a fair number of front to back sloping greens.  

PF

The neat thing about #14 is that you will swear that after the false front the green runs uphill.  Well, it is quite obvious in the pix the general lay of the land is severely downhill and that is exactly what the back 2/3s of the green does - run from middle to back.  Its a very odd effect that I am not sure I have seen before - which is why its my favourite green on the course.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules
Post by: Sean_A on November 04, 2009, 07:58:37 AM
As is the usual form, the 2009/10 Winter Tour kicked off with a game at Kington.  I think this is the third visit on the trot with very fine weather which most certainly breaks with form.  Anyway, I added a few pix and of course, the new rules which apply to seniors - aren't they lucky?

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules For Seniors
Post by: Dónal Ó Ceallaigh on November 04, 2009, 08:22:43 AM
Sean, a great presenataion once again!

Since yourself and many others on this site contribute wonderful course descriptions, is it not possible to include these in the "Courses by Country" section. Perhaps, many would have to be tidied up a little, but they certainly warrant a place on the "Courses by Country" section. What is the protocol here?

I think it's a shame to have to search the discussion group to find all these wonderful course descriptions.

Dónal.
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules For Seniors
Post by: Sean_A on November 04, 2009, 01:12:41 PM
Sean, a great presenataion once again!

Since yourself and many others on this site contribute wonderful course descriptions, is it not possible to include these in the "Courses by Country" section. Perhaps, many would have to be tidied up a little, but they certainly warrant a place on the "Courses by Country" section. What is the protocol here?

I think it's a shame to have to search the discussion group to find all these wonderful course descriptions.

Dónal.

D

Thank you for the kind words.  To answer your question, I believe the Courses by Country section is the domain of Ran.  I don't recall anybody else contributing.  He has some work of others in the Architecture Timeline though.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules For Seniors
Post by: Jason Topp on November 04, 2009, 06:39:51 PM
Sean:

How long is the drive from Pennard?
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules For Seniors
Post by: Sean_A on November 05, 2009, 01:53:03 AM
Sean:

How long is the drive from Pennard?

Jason

I reckon its about 2.5 hours from Kington to Pennard and 3ish via Porthcawl.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: New R&A Rules For Seniors
Post by: Mark Pearce on November 05, 2009, 04:01:55 AM
I, for one, am hoping to have a visit to Kington before or after BUDA next year.  I've only played there once but it left a lasting impression on me.  A far greater impression than many more highly rated courses.
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Pie In The Sky
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 30, 2011, 03:54:19 AM
I played at Kington yesterday with my wife and three boys, on the way back from a weekend spent in Herefordshire.  Selling Lorna the idea of a round of golf was hard.  However, Kington worked its magic and they all loved it sufficiently that, over a drink and a snack in the clubhouse afterwards and at the suggestion of Cameron (my eldest, 15) we went through our cards recounting how each of us fared at each of the holes.

The boys loved it and it really drove home what a great course this is.  Some observations:

The greens were lightening fast.  Whilst I was sorting things out in the pro-shop the boys went for a practice putt.  When I found them on the practice green the first thing Cameron (a member at Elie and Northumberland and who loves the speed of the links greens at Elie) said was the the greens were "stupidly" fast.  I cannot remember playing a course in the UK with greens any quicker than Kington yesterday.  That added (rather than detracting as it sometimes can) from the pleasure of the round.

The grass bunkers and mounds around the greens really are superb hazards.  Combined with sloping, fast greens they challenge the short game far more than sand.

The turf is an excellent golfing surface.  My wife commented that it was the sort of turf Elie should have!

The use of the hill is simply brilliant.  Every hole requires thought, particularly in a stiff breeze as we had yesterday.

More than anything Kington shows what can be achiecved with imagination, a bit of a hill and an understanding of angles.  The fact that it boasts some of the finest views in British golf just seals the deal.

There was talk in the car on the way home of booking a week near Kington next year......
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Pie In The Sky
Post by: John Mayhugh on August 30, 2011, 08:41:48 AM
More than anything Kington shows what can be achieved with imagination, a bit of a hill and an understanding of angles.  The fact that it boasts some of the finest views in British golf just seals the deal.

Kington is fantastic.  Great idea to take your kids out there.

How did everyone like the 18th?
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 30, 2011, 08:47:04 AM
John,

All loved the 18th.  I played with the twins, who both drove it to the bottom of the hill and had short uphill approaches from the RHS.  Both missed short and right and then proceeded to learn an important lesson in angles!  I pushed my tee shot and pitched on the front left of the green (so I'd have been way too long had I landed it left).  It then hit the face of a mound and stayed front left.  From where I nearly putted off the green and three putted for par.  Cameron, I gather left his drive in the ferns left but still managed to rescue par.  I'm not sure the boys had really enjoyed a golf course as a course as much before, and Cameron loves Elie.
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Anthony Gray on August 30, 2011, 09:13:31 AM


  Awesome. I would think a 60 degree wedge would be useful for some shots. Looks like a course you could play everyday.

  Anthony

Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Peter Pallotta on August 30, 2011, 10:06:44 AM
Thanks, Sean.  I must not be getting enough sleep, because your photos and Mark R's post almost had me crying, the lovliness of it all and the longing for that topography/setting. 

Peter
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Sean_A on August 31, 2011, 11:15:38 AM
Canary

Kington's greens are usually among the best I play year in and and year out. 

Did you convince your kids to bang shots through the hollows rather than chip over them?

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Jason Topp on August 31, 2011, 12:09:30 PM
For those that have not played the course the lumps in the fairway are very small and quite different from those you find in a links fairway. It is more like pasture land than links ground.   As a result, nearly every shot from the fairway is from an awkward lie.  Balls normally wind up in the low points and the undulations make getting at the ball a bit difficult.  Also - the bounce of the ball is more random than one would normally find. 

I am not sure whether or not I would grow to like that aspect of Kington over repeat plays or would grow weary of it.

Sean - what has your reaction been over repeat plays?  Has anyone else played the course enough to have a view on the subject?
 
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 31, 2011, 12:20:20 PM
Sean,

That's their natural way of playing.  Cameron's first option is to use the putter.  If that isn't available, he'll see if he can use a 7 iron.  Failing that, he'll try the pitching wedge.  The only one of us that used the 60 degree wedge was me and when I missed the 12th on the left I managed to chip in, despite not being able to see the hole.  The boys loved the mounds/hollows around the green and the number of different ways there were of playing any shot.  I think this sort of golf is so much more fun for kids of that age (the twins are 12 and Cameron's 15).
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Sean_A on August 31, 2011, 12:28:07 PM
 Jason

There is no question that when I first played Kington some 10+ years ago I was perplexed.  It wasn't that I didn't enjoy and see Kington as quite unusual, only that I didn't know how to play the course.  There are still some shots I don't know how to play other than just get a 9 iron out or something of that nature and take my lumps (much like a fairway bunker I spose) - such as the cuppy lies you speak of.  These aren't as commonly encountered as you make it seem, but I do expect it once or twice a round.  The really difficult aspect of these areas is trying to hit through them when you know the aerial route will likely fail to garner a good result.  Many the time I hit what I thought was a good shot only to see my ball hit an upslope of one these cups and just die - making me look daft.  I have gotten better over the years of hitting these shots flatter than I normally would, but my best tool against them is merely to laugh.  

I am not sure I could take Kington on a weekly basis, but that has to do with the weather, not the course.  It is a very exposed spot which invites all sorts of seasons within a few holes.  Kington is most certainly not for everybody, but I would certainly recommend to anybody interested in architecture to see the course twice even if it meant a reasonable overnight detour - its that special.  

I have long wanted to organize a few days at Kington, but I never thought I could get enough people to give it a go.

Very fine Mark!

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Matt MacIver on August 31, 2011, 12:43:41 PM
Sean - this course looks wonderful, I thought so when i read this thread the first time a few years ago.  I had a few thoughts as I re-read it...

Since the course has been around so long I assume its "successful" in terms of making the owners a profit?  Have annual rounds played dwindled since your review and the economic downturn, or have they had to raise rates?  Do they rely on a large percentage of non-Member or non-local play to make up any losses? 

Lastly, if this was a brand new site would an owner have the guts to develop it?  Could any archie be gutsy enough to replicate it? 

Kington is now on my list of must-must-sees. 
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Sean_A on August 31, 2011, 01:03:19 PM
Matt

I do think the club is down on members, but not too badly.  I seem to recall fees used to be about £275 when I first knew the club over 10 years ago and it had has probably gone up at least 50% in that time.  This is well above inflation, but many club fees have gone up 100% in the same period.  I am sure the club would like more visitor/society fees, but I don't have a clue as to how much they rely on visitors.  If I am anything to go by, I usually play Kington 3 or 4 times a year, yet the club probably only gets less than a £100 out me in total and that includes a very boozy society doo.

I doubt if this site would be developed today and if so, there is no way an archie would replicate it.  For one, I would be surprised if many reputable archies would even consider Kington a good course!  The shaping would put most of them off.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Kalen Braley on August 31, 2011, 02:14:01 PM
Sean,

Count me as another who loves this type of quirk on a golf course.  Conventional holes can be found almost everywhere, so I don't know why more folks don't love this out-of-the-box kind of stuff.  

Thanks for bringing this old thread back to life!!

P.S.  All those tiny micro-rumples in the fairways must lead to some equally awful and terrific kicks.  Perhaps an outing is in order to see if anyone gets consitently good kicks and/or bad kicks to test JK's theory!
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Sean_A on October 23, 2011, 02:44:59 PM
I don't recall ever playing the white tees at Kington until yesterday.  Several of the holes play very differently.  More importantly, I played in an unusual wind coming from a southerly direction.  Despite the strength and direction of the wind, the course was very playable - a lesson many clubs owning championship courses could learn. For me, Kington belongs with Merion, St Enodoc, Lahinch & Prestwick.  There is no course I would rather play!  Check out some of the updated pix.

Previous Stops

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,37526.0.html   Harborne

http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,49998.0.html   Worcester G&CC

Next Scheduled Stop: The New Course

Ciao

  
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: Mark Pearce on October 23, 2011, 03:04:58 PM
I had been hovering on calling Kington a 2* and yesterday's game confirmed it for me.  For me, Kington belongs with Merion, St Enodoc, Lahinch & Prestwick.  There is no course I would rather play!  
Extraordinary praise.  The thing is, I don't think I can argue (though Prestwick is the only one of those particular 4 courses  have played, I have played many in their approximate peer group).  I mentioned this to my wife, who simply said "Well, don't you think so?"
Title: Re: KINGTON: Its Not Just Pie In The Sky
Post by: John Mayhugh on October 24, 2011, 01:17:21 PM
I had been hovering on calling Kington a 2* and yesterday's game confirmed it for me.  For me, Kington belongs with Merion, St Enodoc, Lahinch & Prestwick.  There is no course I would rather play!  
Extraordinary praise.  The thing is, I don't think I can argue (though Prestwick is the only one of those particular 4 courses  have played, I have played many in their approximate peer group).  I mentioned this to my wife, who simply said "Well, don't you think so?"

Wow.  Though I haven't played any of the four that Sean mentioned, I can understand where he's coming from.  Many notable courses that I like less than Kington. 
Title: Re: KINGTON: 2011/12 Winter Tour Continues
Post by: Sean_A on October 25, 2011, 11:55:57 AM
Mark & Tucky

Its taken me a long time to admit to myself that Kington really is that special.  I can't say it is architecturally as good as the others because it lacks that challenging aspect for the really good players, but golf is thankfully about more than pure architecture.  The course has an unbelievable reputation for the guys I know around Worcester and generally for the average guy who plays there.  Anyone who knows, smiles when the name Kington comes up. 

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: 2011/12 Winter Tour Continues
Post by: Colin Macqueen on October 26, 2011, 07:27:56 AM
Sean,

As you mentioned a couple of years ago there is nary a bunker on this course. There are however a goodly number of bunker-like impressions around the greens. Were these originally standard bunkers allowed to grow over in time or are they original grass bunkers as such? Terrific pictures by the way and a golf course which looks to be full of fun and surprises.  How much for a round on this sort of gem hidden away (on the Welsh borders is it?).

Cheers Colin
Title: Re: KINGTON: 2011/12 Winter Tour Continues
Post by: John Mayhugh on October 26, 2011, 07:57:48 AM
Kington a sticky topic?  What next, a review by Ran?  I would like to see that.

In the summer, a weekend day ticket at Kington costs £40.  Down to £24 in the winter when Sean does his bargain shopping.   
Title: Re: KINGTON: 2011/12 Winter Tour Continues
Post by: Sean_A on October 26, 2011, 05:54:52 PM
Sean,

As you mentioned a couple of years ago there is nary a bunker on this course. There are however a goodly number of bunker-like impressions around the greens. Were these originally standard bunkers allowed to grow over in time or are they original grass bunkers as such? Terrific pictures by the way and a golf course which looks to be full of fun and surprises.  How much for a round on this sort of gem hidden away (on the Welsh borders is it?).

Cheers Colin

Colin

I believe the club experimented with the odd bunker or two and it didn't work out - too much wind and sheep tend to bed down in the sand.  Its probably for the best as the club has only three green keepers - not enough to take care of bunkers.  To answer the question, no, Hutchison designed the hollows to be sand free. 

Tucky

Being stuck is like finding one's name in the telephone book for the first time! 

BTW - I try to adhere to the advice of a very sage acquaintance and do all my shopping in pubs.

Ciao
Title: Re: KINGTON: 2011/12 Winter Tour Continues
Post by: Sean_A on May 31, 2014, 09:01:37 AM
Bringing this thread up as requested by Bogey.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Bogey
Post by: Paul Gray on May 31, 2014, 06:24:35 PM
Quite right too. This is exactly the sort of thread which made me realise I was not the only one left that had an interest in talking about more than 300 yard drives.

Always worth bumping these for newbies.
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Bogey
Post by: Mike Hendren on June 02, 2014, 10:08:21 AM
Thanks Sean - as advertised!

Once again evidence that there is no excuse to build a pedestrian golf course - anywhere.

Bogey
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Bogey
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on June 02, 2014, 04:10:01 PM
A timely reminder.

I'm going to a 4 day 90th birthday party for a very (new) hip gal, from Friday the 15th to Monday 19th August. 

The golfing gods are once again shining on me as it is only 10 miles from the course!


So Tin Man and Potts will be put under a 3 line whip to show me round. Any other takers?
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Bogey
Post by: Sean_A on June 02, 2014, 05:32:19 PM
A timely reminder.

I'm going to a 4 day 90th birthday party for a very (new) hip gal, from Friday the 15th to Monday 19th August. 

The golfing gods are once again shining on me as it is only 10 miles from the course!


So Tin Man and Potts will be put under a 3 line whip to show me round. Any other takers?

Spangles

Very fine.  The Saturday is probably best as Sunday is Captains Day. Let me know.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Sean_A on August 21, 2014, 10:39:40 AM
Well Spangles, you have been properly Kingtonized.  Lets hear the good, bad and ugly.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Neil White on August 21, 2014, 01:59:38 PM
Sean,

There is no bad or ugly when discussing Kington.  ;D
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on August 22, 2014, 11:11:24 AM
Sean I was going to look for this thread….thanks for finding it and for showing me round…

Much to mull over, unfortunately I didn’t manage a second round.   I  now know I’m too old to be chasing rounder’s balls down hills.…  (‘mericans can look it up!)

I have been thinking this over and in rereading this thread most of what I’m about to write has already been said, but it’s just easy to be distracted by the visuals. The scenery misleads you in a way that I haven’t encountered before. Heaven knows I’m easily distracted but here you are so impressed by scale it’s easy to miss detail.

First impression was, this wasn’t the course I was expecting!   Amongst some of the greatest backdrops and fall offs with views across at least two countries there’s a subtle Golf course to be encountered.  Although a few holes do play up and down it’s not what you notice (and I’ll  I’d bet you play down more feet than you do up with a few short walks to make up the difference.)

While being distracted by the views all along you stumble along the fairways because those micro undulations are everywhere and they really affect play.  ON the 14th my ball was sitting up on top and I creamed one of my most joyous shots of the year, pin high from 230 yards.  On 17 my ball was in a dip and despite only having to punch a 9 iron 80 yards I thinned it through the green and it was never seen again!  As others have said the turf and greens are a delight to play on and those micro dips are NOT like those elsewhere e.g. NOT links like at all.

I guess I was expecting a ‘bigger’ version of Cleeve Cloud with more elevation change and spectacular shots to try, but even though the surrounds are huge I can’t stress how intimate the holes feel, especially considering how wide the fairways are.  The greens offer small targets and like others above the course it most reminded me of was Pennard – high praise indeed.  You were right to emphasize the greens. Deceptively devilish.

Next day I sat down with the card and I could recall all 18 holes easily, often that is not the case. There is only one so so shot on the course.  For the rest, even a blind tee shot leaves you wondering how your ball will sit and what the next shot will demand of you.

I realise that I’m vacillating here so …

Did I love it               Yes
Will I go again soon as possible       Yes
Doe it offer tons of fun                                Yes

Would I recommend friends travel miles out of their way to play it?                   ? Not sure.   

My visceral reaction on first acquaintance to Cleeve Cloud and Painswick were markedly stronger and if someone had only one round (with out the benefit of an excellent guide with them), I suspect they would likely feel the same. They do have some pretty special holes and I’m not so sure Kington can match their highs, and maybe thats because the architect was determined to avoid extremes. It’s a lovely walk. However there are no dud holes and that’s not true of the first two.  But with repeat plays I‘m pretty sure I could see how the Crown is anointed on the right course!

PS
…and the so so shot?  Why it’s standing on the tee at 18 waiting to have ago at ‘hit and hope golf’. It’s actually atypical of the course, almost an afterthought. Come on man, get over it.

PPS
If this doesn’t get THE BUDA INVITATION INTERNATIONAL soon then I’m up for risking the cold in March.  At least 3 rounds should set me straight.

PPPS
Unique is an overused word on here, but it’s well deserved in this case for reasons that are not immediately apparent and because it confounds expectations.
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Mark Pearce on August 22, 2014, 11:38:52 AM
Tony,

Risky in March.  We went there as a family at Easter last year and the course was under snow for most of our trip.  The tee shot on 18 so-so?  Nonsense, man.  You're right to highlight the intimacy of Kington, it is a small, intimate course in a massive setting.  You're also right about how easy it is to remember every hole on the course and how much fun almost every shot is.

A must for BUDA sometime - 2016?
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Sean_A on August 22, 2014, 01:04:02 PM
Spangles

I am glad you didn't think Kington a waste of time.  

It is interesting that you wanted to compare Kington with Painswick and Cleeve Cloud and it does strike me as a very reasonable approach to figuring out how you feel about Kington even though all three are very different. I know I told you that my over-riding impression of Kington is that its a proper course built on hill.  Its not really that odd or quirky once you get past how the green shaping/hill slopes dictate play - the net effect isn't all that different to bunkering except that I think it looks better than sand and most people have little experience with this sort of shaping.  As you say, the real unique thing about Kington is the micro-undulations.  One can count on having issues with lies a few times a round.  I think the micro-undulations increase the importance of gaining good angles of approach.  At least if one gets a "down" lie the ball can be scuttled toward the target, but you have to decide to drop the pride and play for the scuttle.  On 17, did you try to pull off some kind of floater?  

I would go almost opposite of your take with Kington, Cleeve Cloud and Painswick.  Painswick is easily the course I admire least of the three.  As you allude to with Kington's 18th (though I adamantly disagree with your example), there is too much luck and goofy stuff going on to really get behind Painswick 52 weeks a year even if the weather was stellar.  Plus, the conditioning and lack of width are very problematic.  In winter the course is mucky.  In summer the course is a rough fest.  I love Cleeve Cloud, but I don't think it uses its hills nearly as well as Kington does and this results in more up and down golf than I would like.  However, there are some super greens sites (at Painswick as well), but I can't ever help thinking that CC could use bunkering in big way - massive scale bunkers, but not that many.  Of course, the final kicker for me is Kington has superior turf and greens to either Painswick or CC.  This makes a big difference when one plays these courses as often as I do.  

Anyway, I am still not convinced Kington is suitable for Buda.  I don't know if a few rounds is enough for guys to come to grips with the micro-undulations.  It took me a about six rounds before I came to an understanding that above all else, if one wants to score well at Kington, keep the angles of approach in mind to the exclusion of all else.  Plus, there isn't much nearby for the Mercans to play once Kington is in the history books.  Somewhat like Norfolk, a much lower-income version of Norfolk that is, Herefordshire is a step back in time.  

Give me a shout when you want to play the 18th again - its a feature hole  :D

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on August 22, 2014, 05:00:00 PM
Sean I would recomend the course to anyone really, it's just what they have to forgo.  It's a compliment to the course and at the same time frustrating that it is a long way from here and yet my curiousity about the course is now higher after having played it than it was before!



Mark I really enjoyed the fact that the boys got so much fun out of it. They don't have the same baggage we carry in terms of expectations. They just turned up and had a ball.


The best metaphor I can come up with is you meet a girl your friends have told you all about. When you meet  she's really not what you imagined at all, but she does have a certain quality you struggle to define.  You definitely want to meet her again...
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Thomas Dai on August 22, 2014, 05:29:35 PM

....Kington has superior turf and greens to either Painswick or CC. This makes a big difference when one plays these courses as often as I do.  


I believe this is a very important aspect. The more quirky courses - dare I use the term 'rustic'? - are often fine to play from tee to green but the greens are often not the most pleasant to putt on - 'scruffy' maybe a way to describe them, and I realise there will probably be perfectly valid reasons for this. Kington's greens however, are wonderfully smooth and fast and true rolling. Another reason to visit.

And the patio behind the very thick glass wall at the rear of the 18th green and watching shots hit from the 18th tee and observing how much they 'break' on the severely sloping fairway before coming to rest near, or not so near, the green, with it's narrow 'gate' entrance and humpy-bumpy-hollowy sides is a very pleasant spot to spend some time after a round.

(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff114/seanrobertarble/KINGTON/20March2009071.jpg?t=1240916913)

Kington, a thoroughly lovely course to play, although perhaps more on an occasional rather than very regular basis.

Thank you for bumping the thread and for the additional comments.

atb
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Sean_A on August 22, 2014, 06:48:18 PM
atb

Thats an interesting take concerning occasional play.  I usually play Kington between 3 and 6 times a year and never feel like I have had enough.  But there is something about courses on hills.  I wouldn't want to play Kington every week only because I know what sort of shocking weather the place can get in any of the 12 months.  That said, there aren't many places I would want to play every week given all the realities of course quality, weather and course conditions - in fact, I struggle to think of more than a few candidates.  The moral of the story - no single course can do it all for me.  

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: J.D. Griffith on August 23, 2014, 09:02:49 PM
Sean,

Can you compare and contrast Kington to Church Stretton?  Church Stretton has always piqued my interest, and is on my list of courses I must play if/when I finally make it across the pond. 
Also, just want to thank you for the excellent course descriptions and reviews you post here.
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON: For Spangles
Post by: Sean_A on August 24, 2014, 07:30:56 PM
JD

While too hilly for ideal golf, Kington's routing deals with the elevation change very well.  Church Stretton takes the hills to a whole new level.  Its way too hilly to really be considered very good golf and that elevation change rears its ugly head on a few really bad holes.  I said this earlier, but Kington is a proper course on a hill and I think the use of angles and well placed man-made elements bear this out.  Church Stretton is more akin to novelty golf.  That said, CS has a lot of good holes and is a beautiful site.  Like Herefordshire, Shropshire has a dearth of good golf so its not like golfers will often be in the area.  I happen to like CS quite a bit so I am willing to make a 2+ hour drive once a year, but I think in terms of recommending CS, generally speaking, give it a go if you are closer than two hours away  :D - CS is a fair diversion from the normal golf haunts.  

Ciao  
Title: Re: 2014-15 Winter Tour: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on October 19, 2014, 06:11:41 AM
The Wings are in action so it must be winter.  What better way to kick off the 2014-15 Winter Tour than at Kington.  See the updated tour on page 1.

Next scheduled stop, Little Aston.

Ciao
Title: Re: 2014-15 Winter Tour: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Paul Gray on October 19, 2014, 06:51:20 AM
I'm beginning to like winter, if only for Arble Tours!

As ever, a pleasure to see Kington. Must actually get there one of these days.
Title: Re: 2014-15 Winter Tour: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on October 21, 2014, 04:35:17 AM
I'm beginning to like winter, if only for Arble Tours!

As ever, a pleasure to see Kington. Must actually get there one of these days.

Paul

Kington is very amenable to weekend golfers  :D  Give us a shout if you decide to exit the Home Counties.

Ciao
Title: Re: 2014-15 Winter Tour: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on November 08, 2014, 11:51:54 AM
Knowing the love herein for Kington I thought I'd mention that on Sun 30th Nov they are hosting a 4-person Team Open Comp, £12/ea for visitors.

Any hardy folk brave enough for Kington hill at the end of Nov (not me, previous commitment....unfortunately!)?

Atb
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 04, 2015, 12:40:37 PM
I played Kington yesterday in quite fiery conditions.  I also learned that the club has worked out a deal with local farmers who have grazing rights.  Sheep are to be kept to restricted areas to reduce the waste and the club is now cutting the fairways about twice a month in summer.  I am not convinced by this approach and fear fairways will become more defined  :'(   


Anyway, see the updated tour.


Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Mark Saltzman on August 08, 2015, 04:00:08 AM

When initially planning my trip to England, I had in my head a short (and odd) list of courses I really wanted to play.  Swinley, Sunningdale, The Sacred Nine, Painswick and Kington (I'm 3/5, not bad).  The problem is that I really had no idea where any of these courses are and quickly figured out that you're never just going to find yourself in Kington's area.  It's a 2 hour drive from Stratford and 90 minutes back to Cheltenham but I wasn't going to miss it.


What an odd choice to start a discussion of Kington with rankings, but here we go.  I scored the course a Doak 7, and I believe Tom gave the same score, while Sean gives it a 6, all of this must be seen as a compliment as such scores put this unknown, inexpensive and out of the way country course in rather esteemed company.  But in re-thinking, why is Kington not an 8? Why isn't it a World Top 100 contender?


It's easy to make the argument that Kington offers a truly world-class set of par-3s.  There are, quite obviously, several standout holes through the course: 1, 5, 9, 10, 12, 13, 14, 15, 18.


Kington does not suffer from weak holes.  Seemingly simply holes such as the nearly featureless, uphill 6th still hold the golfer's interest by building an angled shelf green into the left-to-right slope, forcing the golfer to play to the fairway's high side or risk a far more challenging pitch.


Kington is unique.  Not to be mistaken with an anything I've seen before, from the micro hollows through the fairways, to the routing taking advantage of broad movements up and down Bradnor Hill, to the lack of bunkers, to the built-up mounding...


So, where is Kington's weakness? Unlike, say, Cleeve Hill or Painswick, the land never got so difficult or the quirk so extreme as to become goofy for a great course.  So is it really conditioning and difficulty that hold Kington back from top-100 status? I thought that sort of thing doesn't matter to us?


(http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc430/SaltyLaw/Kington%201_zpsniia8wdq.jpg) (http://s1211.photobucket.com/user/SaltyLaw/media/Kington%201_zpsniia8wdq.jpg.html)
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on August 08, 2015, 04:44:42 AM
Mark

For me, Kington is always one of the best conditioned courses I play each year.  The fairways are beautiful turf and the greens always roll true. 

Some possible reasons for not offering up Kington as an 8.

1. The greens are almost without exception rely on slope for interest...lack of variety. 

2. The greens have thatch so can turn soft in winter. 

3. There are four holes over 420 yards...not bad for a course whose daily tee length is just over 5600 yards, but perhaps one or two more to balance out the shorter 4s is a bit better. 

4. This ties into #3, perhaps a few too many 4s in the short to modest range. 

5. Lack of bunkers for variety.  While Kington doesn't need sand per se, the design would benefit from some bunkers.

6.  On a personal note, the change to #8 is awful.  They turned a very interesting sub 300 yarder into a dull driving hole of 360 yards...and created a dreadful green to tee walk which is completely out of sorts for Kington.   

7. I usually would tick a course down for a 3 shot differential between par and SSS (in either direction), but Kington's hills and wind erase that argument...still others will be dubious about this. 

For me, #1 alone would exclude Kington from 8 company, but not being an 8 is not a weakness.  Kington more than makes up its lack of quality with its joy to be alive character. I would rather play Kington than the other courses I give an 8.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on September 24, 2015, 04:33:19 PM
The opportunity recently presented itself for another game at charming Kington.


After making sure that our cars handbrake was well secured we ventured up the 1st hole into a 3-4 club against wind. Fortunately it was dry. As usual the course was pretty quiet whilst the clubhouse and pro-shop were as friendly and obliging as you could wish for.


The course? Well, fun as always. The greens were quick and extremely true rolling. The last few weeks have been pretty wet this year and the fairway turf was pretty lush so as a consequence shots were unusually holding there line on the side sloping fairways. This relative lushness when combined with the ever present micro-bumps all over the fairways meant it was rather unpredictable to play the ground game - should a shot land on the upslope of a micro-bump then the ball would stop immediately, land a shot on the far side though and it would speed on. Great fun playing on a hill top in such a high wind, watching high flighted shots reach an apex and then being blown backwards.


One of the best aspects about Kington is the routing. First hole very uphill and a bit of a steep walk from the 3rd green to the 4th tee, 14th, 16th and 18th severely downhill but the rest of the holes relatively pretty level as they circle around the hill, sometimes with ball above feet stances, sometimes ball below feet stances.


Big time fun factor playing here as usual, especially for one of my playing partners who knocked his tee shot onto the 18th green with a 6-iron!


Oh, and there was a huge star shaped 'splat' mark right in the middle of one of the thick glass safety screen panels located on the patio to the rear of the 18th green!


Atb
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on September 25, 2015, 03:41:10 AM
Now we have Buda 2016 location sorted it's time to reignite the debate for 2017.

I think this group is ready for Kington and it continues with the pattern of Links/Inland.

Does anyone doubt it would be suitable?  Accommodation is relevant.

Anyone up for organising?
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on September 27, 2015, 11:40:26 AM
atb

The 18th is very special as are many holes at Kington.

I sure wish the club had the money to attack the thatch in the greens.  Every time prolonged rainy weather hits the greens soften up and lose their interest.

Spangles

Kington is a course for which I would be willing to organize a Buda.  Its a long way off though.  If there is sufficient interest when the time comes I will raise my hand as the sucker of the year.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on September 27, 2015, 02:24:12 PM
You've been to Kington many more times than me Sean so I can't disagree with your thoughts on the thatch, but jeez the greens were quick and beautifully true when I was there recently, although curiously the 18th was noticeably slower than the others. Less wind to dry it out maybe?


Cracking course though. One of those courses it's difficult to play or later think about without a smile on the face. And the more I think about Kington the more I appreciate the cleverness of the routing.


A nice wee trip around the English-Welsh border would combine Kington with Llandrindod Wells and Welshpool and maybe a few others to like Church Stretton, Newtown, Builth Wells and even Knighton and even inside the racecourse at free draining Ludlow. Messrs Braid and Vardon in particular seem to have been pretty active this way in the early 20th century.


Atb



Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on September 29, 2015, 05:49:37 AM
atb

Thatchy greens can be very quick and true, but its difficult to keep them firm.  I think eventually if the thatch isn't dealt with the harder it is to make the greens true because they hold more water. 

Thatch in greens is a common issue among the "lesser" GB&I clubs. 

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kinks of KINGTON
Post by: Rich Goodale on September 29, 2015, 06:25:58 AM
I must admit that the only golf course in the world that reminds me of The Kinks is Carnoustie, as per:

"You really got me!" (Ray Davies) and "Working on the Chain Gang" (Chrissy Hynde).

Rich
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 02, 2016, 06:03:19 PM
Kington is on the move with its conditioning.  The club has decided to cut the grass much more often and the results are stunning. I don't expect to see a course in better nick all year.  The greens are quick enough to cause some grief and the fairways, while always a great surface for the game are now simply awesome.  I guess Doak was right...Kington is a 7 all day.  See the updated tour.


Ciao 
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Tom_Doak on July 02, 2016, 07:09:32 PM
I don't expect to see a course in better nick all year.   


Sean:


That's pretty amazing!


Do you think that the course's newfound notoriety [here and in The Confidential Guide] has had anything to do with them making the move to spend a bit more?  Are there signs of more visitors?
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 02, 2016, 08:38:34 PM
Tom

There are signs of more visitors, even of the foreign type.  However, there are still only two green keepers.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Tom_Doak on July 02, 2016, 10:37:18 PM

There are signs of more visitors, even of the foreign type.



Yikes!  I hope they don't sue us if someone has a collision on the way up or down the driveway!
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Jon Wiggett on July 03, 2016, 08:50:34 AM
The course looks great. I really like the use of grass bunkers and the type of modelling around the green. It is a shame that no modern day architects are using this style if only occasionally. As to the improved conditioning, though it is to be applauded I hope it is not accompanied with any significant increase in fees as this just negates any apparent net gain.


Jon
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on July 03, 2016, 02:37:06 PM
Sean,
Always nice to get an update on Kington, thank you, but which are the updated photos?
Atb
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on July 03, 2016, 04:50:45 PM
It is worth noting that this is currently the only proposal for BUDA 2017, it already has my vote. :)
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 03, 2016, 06:28:43 PM
Jon

Its hard to imagine Kington becoming too expensive to play, but I don't begrudge the club raising fees a bit if the product is better. I have long said golf is too cheap in the UK...at the expense of the long term health of courses.   

ATB...there are about 9 new pix. 

Spangles

I am already on record as saying that I will happily organize a Kington BUDA, but I will on no account sell the idea.  The PESTS will have to come to me before I organize as my days of organize it and they will come are long gone. 

I was shocked by the green speeds of Kington after the disappointingly slow greens in Fife. 

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on July 04, 2016, 04:38:46 AM
It is worth noting that this is currently the only proposal for BUDA 2017, it already has my vote. :)


In combination with the annual Kington Town Festival - http://www.kingtonfestival.co.uk - and participate in the wheelbarrow racing!
Atb
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Jon Wiggett on July 04, 2016, 05:28:33 AM
Jon

Its hard to imagine Kington becoming too expensive to play, but I don't begrudge the club raising fees a bit if the product is better. I have long said golf is too cheap in the UK...at the expense of the long term health of courses.   




Sean,


I suspect we will never agree on the cost of golf as I believe that there should be a healthy spectrum of costs from cheap and cheerful to elite high. I agree that if the product is improved in quality then a higher price can be asked but this should not necessarily be the motivation behind any improvement. I do however strongly disagree with any apparent desire to peg the lower end of the market above a certain price and so pricing out a whole section of society. This has never been part of British golfing culture and is nothing short of snobbery.


Jon
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 07, 2016, 11:10:37 AM
Jon

No price pegging or any need to worry about the lower end of the market.  I am talking about good courses, the sort people would travel a bit to play.  The cheap end of the market is a meat grinder of never-ending competition in trying to drag people in off the streets.  These places never had the opportunity to put money into the course...its hand to mouth type stuff and there is a big market for this sort of thing...though I think there are too many courses to feed this sector.   

Kington's pricing is about right...20 visitor fees equals the cost of full membership. 

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Jon Wiggett on July 07, 2016, 04:12:21 PM
Sean,


most of the members clubs in the UK have operated quite successfully on a hand to mouth existence for the best part of 100 years or longer. Indeed, many of those who go to the wall do so because they spend money they do not have and the debt catches up with them. I certainly do not begrudge any club investing in their course but would hope the motivation is to improve with money they have rather than in order to increase prices and I suspect you also are of this mind.

[/size]Your GF ratio of 20 x is something I would wholly agree with.[size=78%]

[/size]Jon[size=78%]
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 14, 2016, 06:33:38 PM
Richard

I am told you dropped by Kington for a game...impressions?

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on September 17, 2016, 07:41:08 PM
Well...Ulrich?

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON : 2016-17 Winter Tour
Post by: Thomas Dai on May 20, 2017, 03:48:55 PM
Found this recent article about Kington. Some fine photos from above.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAQG_NdWsAAHf7y.jpg:large)
Bottom right photo - indications of once-upon-a-time sand bunkers?


Nice aerial video here as well - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dfmCm-ZoK5c
atb
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON : 2016-17 Winter Tour
Post by: Sean_A on May 23, 2017, 02:46:25 AM
atb

The hole you reference is the 12th...a superb par 3.  It would be interesting to know if the club ever experimented with sand. 

Thanks for the aerial tour...its actually one of the best I have seen except for the dreadful music.

Wasn't it about this time in 2012 that a Cream coloured Courser was spotted on the course?  I seem to recall it was big bird news!  How the hell it hit England's shores must be a wild story.  A few hundred people each day tramped up Bradnor Hill to have a look...only in England!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsJbCQpfXXw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsJbCQpfXXw)

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON : 2016-17 Winter Tour
Post by: Thomas Dai on May 23, 2017, 03:34:43 AM
Sean,
I happened to be playing Kington on the day the bird was there. 200 or so folks, many with big cameras, some on tripods, where lining the left side of the 8th hole whilst this smallish creamy coloured bird was bobbing around in the right rough. I have a photo of said bird somewhere. Folks were driving from far and wide to see it. I spoke to a couple who had driven down from Scotland. A stunning day weather wise as I recall.
atb


Edit - old photo now added
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9vGiEpWwAEPC-S.jpg)
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 14, 2018, 06:11:38 AM
With the recent dry spell I finally completed a year round set of pix for Kington.  Kington was crazy keen yesterday, far more burned out than any other course I have seen this year. Luckily the wind was down or there would have been serious damage done to the ball supply as Kington is a totally different course right now.  Patience is seriously rewarded.

BTW...the time has come...we need some rain!

See the updated tour
www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,30926.0.html

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Tony_Muldoon on July 16, 2018, 11:47:39 AM
With the recent dry spell

Ciao


What did you hit on 18?
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 17, 2018, 04:26:35 AM
With the recent dry spell

Ciao

What did you hit on 18?

I bunted a driver to the front right of the green and was left in an awful spot with the flag back right.  The green is tougher now that it has been raised a bit.  Back in the day, the green used to be higher still so going for it from the tee would have been very difficult as the surrounds weren't high enough to trap the ball so easily.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 04, 2019, 06:08:49 AM
I dragged a very travelled golfer to Kington this past weekend for his Kington badge.  I was very surprised he thought Kington is a 7.  Put simply, it is the originality of Kington which impressed him most.  In the end, I have to concede he is right on both points. 

The course was once again in great nick.  I did add a few photos.
www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,30926.0.html (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,30926.0.html)

I am not sure Llandrindod Wells is the sort of course to make a good enough partner with Kington to entertain the idea of a future Kington Buda Cup.  I would be more convinced if LW had a killer must see hole...which it doesn't. 
www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,67344.0.html (http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php/topic,67344.0.html)

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kharacter of KINGTON
Post by: Mike Hendren on July 04, 2019, 12:15:18 PM

Sean, after once again reviewing your tour I have only one thought:  How could Kington NOT be a 7?  It is precisely this type of course that is keeping me from giving up the game and sojourns altogether.  Thank you.  I will get there on day.


Your tours and photographs are a blessing to me. 


Bogey
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: John Mayhugh on July 05, 2019, 12:32:01 PM
Sean,Kington would be a natural choice for Buda. I've yet to see Llandrindod Wells, but seems a reasonable complement. And the likes of Church Stretton or southeast for Minch and Cleeve Hill would be perfect add-ons.
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Mark Pearce on July 05, 2019, 12:35:10 PM
There is a precedent for a one course BUDA.  If a course is good enough (and Silloth was and Kington would be) but lacks a natural partner, then three days at one course works fine.
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Peter Pallotta on July 05, 2019, 08:11:15 PM
Lovely to see this again.
I couldn't say if Kington is a 7, but where else in the entire world could one ever play over a recess that was once the 8th century boundary line between Mercia and Powys (or was once an 8th century *anything*)? If I know my Tom Doak, sentimentalist that he is under the cool, straight talking exterior, that fact alone should be worth 1 point on the scale. Absolutely lovely -- even though I'm almost sure that, in good nick, it would prove too much course for me. Some of the  more gently sloping inland England courses with at grade greens that I can actually *see* might likely suit better.
Thanks Sean
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on July 06, 2019, 03:17:44 AM
It's worth pointing out how appreciative the folks at Kington etc are to the publicity and support given by the likes of Sean Arble's and others course tours and visits and positive comments by the likes the Tom Doak etc. Same at Minchinhampton Old with Ran's visit and profile.
Often folks at under the radar Clubs do not realise what a gem their course is and it takes a visit or visits by outsiders to highlight this to them.
There's a great deal of interesting, challenging and fun golf to be had away from the big name usual suspect popular venues and for visitors its a great way to see other parts of the UK, particularly the rural areas. I reckon this is probably the case in many other countries as well.
If you visit an unsung Club and like it write some comments herein or on social media. A few kind words from a few folks can make a big cumulative difference to a small Club.
atb
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E7Zu9jVXIAQnqdQ?format=jpg&name=small)
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 19, 2019, 07:59:14 PM
There is a precedent for a one course BUDA.  If a course is good enough (and Silloth was and Kington would be) but lacks a natural partner, then three days at one course works fine.

Mark

Toss the idea around with the Committee.  There are enough beds in town and a few pubs...including one outstanding pub.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ye_Olde_Tavern,_Kington (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ye_Olde_Tavern,_Kington)

Bogey...cheers.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on July 30, 2020, 05:59:08 AM
People must be routinely cancelling games at Kington due to poor weather forecasts. The club is now offering a free booking on another day if play is interrupted by severe weather. I don't know what is defined as severe weather, but I don't know of another club that does this.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on August 13, 2020, 07:24:10 PM
I am not trying to be harsh or pushy, but the deadline for bailing with the prospect of a deposit return is the last day of August. On September 1 I will be confirming numbers and paying fees.

Ciao
Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Thomas Dai on April 16, 2023, 07:51:21 AM
Some details about Kington and an earlier course routing which changed to the current routing apparently in the 1930's have arisen.

Firstly, a pre-WW2 photo that shows what was then the 4th hole. The tee being positioned above and to the right of the (then and now) 3rd green and playing to the currently numbered 17th green.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FtwRoftWcAAmX0I?format=jpg&name=medium)

And below the old course routing.

Notable differences to the current routing appear to include -

A par-3 (then numbered 9) that no longer exists.
A current par-3 (the now numbered 9) that wasn't in the older routing
A current par-3 (the now numbered 12th) that was previously a par-4
A current par-4 (the now numbered 13th) that was previously a par-3
The former 18th played from adjacent the present 15th tee to a green 150 yds lower down the hill than at present, ie way below the clubhouse. Note that Google Earth shows the outline of a distinct horseshoe shaped former green in this area.
Some of the current splendid holes and greensites, eg the currently numbered 9, 12 and 18 are not original, which begs a few more questions.

Below the earlier course routing plan.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FtxCMuDXwAEW4w_?format=jpg&name=medium)

Some strolling amongst the ferns and the gorse might be needed to see the old green sites.

atb





Title: Re: The Kingdom of KINGTON
Post by: Sean_A on April 25, 2023, 04:03:35 AM
Thanks Welsh Wizard. I long suspected the existing course wasn't original. 9 & 12 being two holes which made me wonder. However, I had no idea about the 18! I wonder if there were shared fairways? Getting from 14 green to 150 yards past the house gets my brain spinning.

Ciao