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Jay Flemma

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Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« on: September 26, 2009, 06:45:02 PM »
Had the chance to play in a tournament at Torrington yesterday and really enjoyed the greens.  There were a couple severe false fronts, some hog's backs, and a great deal of interior contoru throughout the round.  There was an especially interesting stretch from 2-7 that appealed to me.  Anyone else play there regularly?
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Anthony Gray

Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2009, 06:55:35 PM »


  Jay,

 Who was the designer? History of the course?

  Thanks....Anthony


Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2009, 07:06:25 PM »
Orrin Smith, 1925...was really early in his career as he started his own firm in 1925.
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2009, 09:36:35 PM »
That's 1928, and officially open for play, w/9 holes, in 1929. The remaining 9 holes were opened in 1932. Orrin Smith started out as a construction foreman for Willie Park Jr. at Shuttle Meadow, 1916,  and he was associated with Donald Ross. He did start his own company in 1925, but his experience began 13 years prior to his building CC of Torrington.

There were, and still are, some of the most down to earth members at CCT. Torrington (six miles east) was a booming factory town in its heyday and on a golfing note the Union Hardware Co., makers of Union golf shafts, was located there. Union subsequently became AMF, FM Precision Golf, and one other 'name' that escapes me right now. Rifle shafts originated there and they were still being produced at the site until a few years ago when True Temper bought them out. I grew up right across the street from the factory and sadly witnessed TT's trucks rolling out of the gates one day when I went to visit my 86 year old aunt, who lived next door to us and still lives in the same house she grew up in.

Only a handful of fairway bunkers are scattered about CCT's 18 holes but the site is wide open to the wind. You can experience a 5 club gale in the middle of the summer and in the winter the town of Goshen (where the course is located) has the largest snowdrifts in the state, bar none. What it lacks in sand it makes up for in terrain, it's a roller coaster ride in places.   

Although the course possesses a number of good holes, I think it stands out for the strength of its par 3s, in length and in how well they are protected by bunkering or severe tilt. The least physically protected of the bunch is the 17th, but in the wind it might be a 5 iron or a 3 wood, depending on the direction of the blow. Thankfully the player can run a ball onto the surface. None of the other par 3s allow this although a ball can be bounced onto the Redan-like 6th green from the right side, but only after a carry of some 175 yards or so. 

There are only 4 greens where you can let your guard down a bit, numbers 1, 8, 10 and 14, but I honestly can't think of any that might be seen as a hog's back or that incorporate a false front (possibly number 4). Maybe we have a difference of what constitutes such features.

I think Ron Forse has given the club a master plan for some renovation work they want to do, but I don't think much has been done with it to date.

« Last Edit: September 26, 2009, 10:40:49 PM by Jim_Kennedy »
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Carl Nichols

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2009, 09:51:29 PM »
On the "Biggest Choke Stories" thread, I wrote this post, which happened to be about a round at Torrington.  I remember the 18th hole quite well, unfortunately.

* * * *

My senior year of high school, our golf team was ranked #1 heading into the State Championship.  I played pretty poorly, but I still thought there was a chance that my score would count [i.e., be one of the 4 lowest out of 5 players] when I stepped up to hit my 2nd shot on the 18th hole.  In front of a fairly significant crowd, I airmailed the green and the ball bounced off the cartpath, flew over a one-story wing  of the clubhouse, and ultimately came to rest on the putting green.  At this point, I'm beyond flustered, and thankfully someone working the event came over and helped me figure out where to drop, etc.  I then proceeded to chili dip two chips, somehow got my fifth on the green, and two-putted for triple -- or at least that's what I think happened, since my memory is pretty hazy about the whole thing.  Even with that triple my score ended up counting, but (somewhat thankfully) we ended up losing by four strokes -- or at least that's what I remember now.

A GCA poster who will remain nameless and who was also on that team can correct any errors in my memory.

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2009, 05:50:00 PM »
Yeah, with the exception of a couple of par-3s and an odd duck here or there, the miss is short.  Theer are some vicious false fronts and hog's backs in the greens.  It was a fun round.

Here's the page from the course website on history.
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2009, 07:52:44 PM »
Yeah, with the exception of a couple of par-3s and an odd duck here or there, the miss is short.  Theer are some vicious false fronts and hog's backs in the greens.  It was a fun round.

Which of the greens do you think have false fronts, and which are hogbacks?
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2009, 01:40:32 PM »
Yeah, with the exception of a couple of par-3s and an odd duck here or there, the miss is short.  Theer are some vicious false fronts and hog's backs in the greens.  It was a fun round.

If you get the chance, I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on which of the holes possess the features you describe.

Thanks
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2009, 01:52:57 PM »
Sorry, Jim...too busy in the office. I'll post pics next time I play in a couple weeks.
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2009, 03:55:24 PM »
Jay,
You know that'ts not true as you just sent me a personal message saying that I was disrespecting you and not conducting myself as a gentleman. You called me loud and abrasive and questioned why I asked you about your opinion. There was more to your childish rant but I'll let that lie for now.

I asked you this, in the form of a question: "There are only 4 greens where you can let your guard down a bit, numbers 1, 8, 10 and 14, but I honestly can't think of any that might be seen as a hog's back or that incorporate a false front (possibly number 4). Maybe we have a difference of what constitutes such features".

That doesn't sound abrasive, loud, disrespectful or ungentlemanly to me. I'm beginning to think that you won't answer because you just rattled those remarks off the cuff without giving them much thought, and now that someone asks you to explain yourself (nicely I might add) you attack them because there is no backing up your claims.

Oh well.  :P
« Last Edit: September 29, 2009, 03:57:11 PM by Jim_Kennedy »
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT) New
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2009, 03:59:18 PM »
Jay,
You know that'ts not true as you just sent me a personal message saying that I was disrespecting you and not conducting myself as a gentleman. You called me loud and abrasive and questioned why I asked you about your opinion. There was more to your childish rant but I'll let that lie for now.

I asked you this, in the form of a question: "There are only 4 greens where you can let your guard down a bit, numbers 1, 8, 10 and 14, but I honestly can't think of any that might be seen as a hog's back or that incorporate a false front (possibly number 4). Maybe we have a difference of what constitutes such features".

That doesn't sound abrasive, loud, disrespectful or ungentlemanly to me. I'm beginning to think that you won't answer because you just rattled those remarks off the cuff without giving them much thought, and now that someone asks you to explain yourself (nicely I might add) you attack them because there is no backing up your claims.

Oh well.  :P

Ahhh...and now you're taking the contents of private messages and making them public, and then using them to start fights on GCA.com...you're just proving me right with every keystroke you type.

« Last Edit: September 29, 2009, 04:56:49 PM by Jay Flemma »
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2009, 04:03:38 PM »
Perhaps if you weren't trying to deflect the question with a load of hooey in public while you were attacking me in private I wouldn't have said anything, but alas, I did, and your duplicity is exposed.
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2009, 04:05:33 PM »
well bully for you.  I'm sure everyone is proud of you.  You're performing such a great public service.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2009, 04:07:32 PM by Jay Flemma »
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2009, 04:11:46 PM »
Personally, I don't see what was so hard about answering my question. I might have even agreed about one more green, the ninth, as having something like a false front, even though it cannot be seen from the approach. There are even a couple of holes where I might have somewhat agreed that their fairways could be viewed as hogbacks.

I guess that discussion is well past happening. Too bad.
"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

Jay Flemma

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2009, 04:18:42 PM »
Yep...too bad.  Everyone...since Jim has chosen to take a private discussion and make it public - watch out he may do the same to you - here is the letter I sent him that has him crying like Nancy Kerrigan:

"Sorry, Jim, but I'm really not interested into a battle of "who can argue more on GCA" with you.

When you prove you can be respectful and conduct yourself like a gentleman, I'll talk to you.  But if you want to have this loud, abrasive Internet persona, where you cross-examine everything I say and do, sorry, but I am too busy writing.  I am not on GCA to do White Papers, just converse quickly with friends.  if you wanna live and die every word you write on the Internet, talk to someone else.  I'm here for fun and camaraderie and you provide neither."

There Jim.  Perhaps if you weren't trying to attack and embarass me with a load of hooey in public while I was trying to keep this private, I wouldn't have said anything, but alas, you did, and your duplicity is exposed.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2009, 04:24:21 PM by Jay Flemma »
Mackenzie, MacRayBanks, Maxwell, Doak, Dye, Strantz. @JayGolfUSA, GNN Radio Host of Jay's Plays www.cybergolf.com/writerscorner

Jim_Kennedy

  • Karma: +0/-0
Re: Good greens at Torrington (CT)
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2009, 04:33:00 PM »
So there it really is Jay, now I know for sure that you had no idea what you were talking about re Torrington.

You embarrassed yourself, no one else was needed.

"I never beat a well man in my life" - Harry Vardon

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