[PThomas]

Oh, I agree with everyone that Maryland National is a routing disaster.   In fact, it's almost a case study for gawdawful routing.  I frankly can't believe there isn't enough acreage there to create a better routing.  

that was my point Mike..with so much distance between tees and greens there, one would think you could have built 18 holes without causing 2 serious safety situations

there are some good holes there, I also agree

[Rob_Waldron]

Mike

I hate to say this...but I agree that MD National has some very good holes. Unfortunately courses are evaluated as an 18 hole package! The frustration generated by the bad and dangerous holes at MD Nat. put it well below Musket and Whiskey from a golf experience standpoint. FORE!!!!

[Jesse Jones]

Hmmm..
Who's the architect at MD National?
Thought so..
By the way, I've played the PB Dye Club many times from its opening until just a couple of years ago..
I think it's a fun course. It has some inherent problems with routing, but it's not a bad track.
It's a real fun course to play when it's running fast and hard.
#1-#5-#9-#12-#14-#17 present some real challenges the ball is jumping combined with tight pins.
When they cut the rough down it's a joy to play.
When it is wet, your choices there are severely limited.
It's got a number of elevated greens, others with chipping areas..My problem is 13 is squeezed in there awful tight.
9 and 18 are mirror views of each other..Not much diversity there. 10 is not my favorite too pedestrian for what he had to work with.
8 and 11 are good par threes..
Put a birdie on PB Dye himself on 11.
Bottom line, you'll get to hit a lot of clubs, try a few heroic shots and hopefully roll in a couple of long putts.
The green fee is high..But so are the others around it..WM-WC and so on..


Jesse

[Matt MacIver]

Played it last year and enjoyed it enough to buy a logo ball (but not a shirt).  

Lots of angles, especially off the tee, and I recall most greens having rolling surrounds and contours.

My favorites: #4 is a nice short-n-tempting par 4 that can cause problems if you miss the green.  Par 3 # 8 had a fun green and surrounding area for some creative 2nd shots (ok so I missed the green).  #10 was another short par 4 -- not sure I actually had the OPTION of carrying those dogleg bunkers, but I liked it.  Huge downhill par 3 #11 over water was fun.  

And, in addition to the railroad ties, no one has mentioned the waterfall behind the 18th green.

[Andy Hughes]

Jesse and Matt, you both mentioned #10...I feel that hole be could be much improved by making it a tad shorter and adding some fairway right of what should be the centerline bunker.
It is not in the least a drivable short par 4 now, but it could be if it was shorter with the wide, enticing fairway left offering the much better angle, and a smaller fairway right giving the direct route.

(PS Matt--I suspect lottsa folks miss the 8th green. Pretty long shot up the hill in to the wind)

[Tim Taylor]

Thought I'd bump this back up since I asked on page 1 about a ranking of the courses up the I-270/I-70 corridor.

I wanted a break from my home course so I went up to play PB Dye today and, ta-dum, I loved it. The bad news is it was cart path only. The good news is it was cart path only due to a lack of rain and a low level of water in the irrigation pond surrounding the 11th green. This meant conditions were very firm and very fast.

I played with a nice guy named Rick who has been playing there since it opened. He pointed out all the changes - the bunker in the middle of the 3rd fairway that had been filled in, all the areas around greens where short grass had been allowed to grow long. It was fun and educational.

I agree with Matt MacIver - there are lots of angles to be had. And the holes that don't have interesting angles still have interesting greens. There is something to make you think on most of the holes. With the conditions we had today, many holes had run-up options and very rarely was a lob wedge the play anywhere on the course.

I didn't score that well but I had a blast. I think I could knock 10 shots off my score the next time I play there.

I can understand the criticism from an aesthetic perspective and even, maybe, from a dirt moving perspective. The property itself is so gorgeous that surely something more minimalist ("more minimalist" - does that even make sense?) could have been laid across the land. But, frankly, from a golfing standpoint there is not a lot to argue with. It's different, it's fun, it's playable. Nothing wrong with a little variety.

Tim

[Mark Bourgeois]

There many noteworthy courses I have not seen in The Old Line State, but of those I have seen the greens at PB Dye GC are the most interesting!

My only complaint was given the recent lack of rain they oughta have them running faster. (Some fairways are starting to turn yellow out there...)

Those of you with more MD golf experience, how do they compare to others in the region in terms of contours, movement, wildness?

I could post pics if there's any interest, although the lighting was poor and the contours didn't come out very well.

[Andy Hughes]

Mark, I can't claim much in the way of MD experience, but the PB Dye greens are the most interesting I have seen here.

Were the fairways playing somewhat fast? I don't believe I've ever played the course when it wasn't soft to some extent

Andy

PS I'd like to see your current pictures if it isn't too much bother

[Doug Ralston]

I have not played PB Dye Golf Club, but fwiw, the course that he did in Cincinnati called the Heritage Club is one of the strangest designed courses that I have ever stepped foot on. Some times I played it and just can't stand it, others it is not so bad and kind of fun. Mostly hate it though. The par 3 6th hole is one of the most penal hit or miss par 3's that I have ever seen. No water, but it might be the scariest shot I have ever faced. I saw a kid that was 1 under in the Ohio Amateur make a 10 here, his crime? Ball rolled over into a bunker by about 3 feet. Was PB Dye Golf Club over the top at all? Heritage certainly is.

Glenn;

You can't mention PB Dye and Cincy without Buck Point. That is a course, as we certainly agree, with much to recommend it. The folks in the clubhouse claimed he planned to retire there. I do not know the veracity of that ........

Doug

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